LB A. Pierce comment on Dallas rb

[Doomsday101]

I don't think it a matter of JJ being a better back than Barber.

Think about it: it would be stupid to have JJ on the bench on first and second down since he is the home run threat. Since teams know that we probably will hand it to JJ because he CAN take it 40 yards, teams would be more inclined to put more players in the box. Which gives us an opportunity to play action pass it down their throats.

Barber is obviously the tougher, more talented player overall, but I understand the coaching staffs reasoning behind having JJ as the main setback.

I may not agree with it but what the hell are we going to do. If you don't like then make your own nfl team.

Thing is the staff is giving Barber entire series not just 3rd down or short yardage. I think the more he shows the more carries he will get. Barber may not be as fast as Jones but that is not going to stop him from being able to break long runs. Emmitt Smith was much slower than Jones but that never stopped him from breaking long TD runs. Once you get past the LB it is pretty much open field

 

[Rack]

Your statement was

Now you want to change the question because you are wrong?

I didn't change my position. That first post was suppose to say "end of game" not season.

Believe what you want, but it's obvious to those of us not blinded by ignorance that Barber is the better RB.

 

[AbeBeta]

I didn't change my position. That first post was suppose to say "end of game" not season.

Believe what you want, but it's obvious to those of us not blinded by ignorance that Barber is the better RB.

Yes, it must be ignorance to assume that the guy that 2 coaching staffs picked to be the RB, the guy who the team gave over 130 more carries last year, the guy they relied on in the most important game of the season last year, is the worse RB.

 

[Rack]

Yes, it must be ignorance to assume that the guy that 2 coaching staffs picked to be the RB, the guy who the team gave over 130 more carries last year, the guy they relied on in the most important game of the season last year, is the worse RB.

That's your problem, you don't have the ability to form your own opinion. You just look at what the opinions of BP and Wade are and let them do the thinking for you.

 

[AbeBeta]

That's your problem, you don't have the ability to form your own opinion. You just look at what the opinions of BP and Wade are and let them do the thinking for you.

That's your problem -- you ignore the opinions of experts who work directly with the players and assume that you know more than they do.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I could care less who starts as long as Jones doesnt average more than 15 carries per game. he wears down but if used correctly hes a great player.

 

[Rack]

That's your problem -- you ignore the opinions of experts who work directly with the players and assume that you know more than they do.

Not ignoring anything, I just have an understanding as to why they're using them the way they do.


You, obviously, don't.

 

[AbeBeta]

Not ignoring anything, I just have an understanding as to why they're using them the way they do.


You, obviously, don't.

right.. most teams don't want the better back getting the bulk of the carries.

 

[Rack]

right.. most teams don't want the better back getting the bulk of the carries.

It's about getting the best possible production, OVERALL, out of both backs, not just ONE back.


If MB3 starts he wouldn't be as effective in short yardage and 3rd down back situations. And JuJo certainly isn't as effective in those situations so we can't just switch their roles.

Giving JuJo the "Start" and bulk of the carries early, and MB3 getting the short yardage/goalling and 3rd down back duties, as well as the bulk of the carries late is the best way to utilize them both for maximum production.

I KNOW you understand that. You're just being stubborn (believe me, I know stubborn when I see it.. I'm an expert when it comes to stubborness).


The best case scenario for us would be to have a start that is better then JuJo and MB3, and have MB3 remain in his current role.

 

[AbeBeta]

It's about getting the best possible production, OVERALL, out of both backs, not just ONE back.


If MB3 starts he wouldn't be as effective in short yardage and 3rd down back situations. And JuJo certainly isn't as effective in those situations so we can't just switch their roles.

Giving JuJo the "Start" and bulk of the carries early, and MB3 getting the short yardage/goalling and 3rd down back duties, as well as the bulk of the carries late is the best way to utilize them both for maximum production.

I KNOW you understand that. You're just being stubborn (believe me, I know stubborn when I see it.. I'm an expert when it comes to stubborness).


The best case scenario for us would be to have a start that is better then JuJo and MB3, and have MB3 remain in his current role.

How can he be the "better" back if he can't be a 20 carry a game player? He runs the ball 8-9 times on average a game whereas Julius gets it 16-17 times a game.

So to be effective, Barber needs to only get a handful of carries? Good backs should be able to handle more than 8 carries a game. Certainly if they are better than the starter.

 

[Rack]

How can he be the "better" back if he can't be a 20 carry a game player? He runs the ball 8-9 times on average a game whereas Julius gets it 16-17 times a game.

So to be effective, Barber needs to only get a handful of carries? Good backs should be able to handle more than 8 carries a game. Certainly if they are better than the starter.

No, he doesn't.


And you completely missed the point I made about MB3 and JuJo. Either that or you're "Playing dumb" and you're ignoring the point.

 

[percyhoward]

How can he be the "better" back if he can't be a 20 carry a game player? He runs the ball 8-9 times on average a game whereas Julius gets it 16-17 times a game.

There has been a gradual shift in how much each back is used, if you go back to the beginning of last season. Julius averaged 17 carries per game over the entire course of last season, but he averaged 20.2 carries per game for the first 10 games. His carries went down after that, due to a combination of factors. One reason was that we were behind in games so we were running less as a team, but the other reason was that Barber's share of the carries went up, percentage-wise.

Regular season 2006: JJ's split of the carries with Barber was 71/29 over the first half of the season, and 53/47 over the second half.

JJ's % of the carries also went down when you compare preseason 2006 to preseason 2007. This preseason, Barber had entire series of his own with the starting unit in games 2 and 3.

Although some interpreted that JJ was merely being rested more in preseason because he is the "better" back, to me these two trends suggested that Barber would be a bigger part of the offense once the regular season started, and sure enough he was Sunday night.

Some people may even think that JJ is still being somewhat rested, because he does seem to play better when he hasn't had a big workload. I doubt that this means he's the better back of the two, in the eyes of the coaches.

So it's a situation in constant flux, but I hope we've reached an equilibrium and we leave it the way it is. I'd just substitute a few passes to JJ for some of JJ's runs.

 

[AbeBeta]

No, he doesn't.


And you completely missed the point I made about MB3 and JuJo. Either that or you're "Playing dumb" and you're ignoring the point.

Julius had 267 regular season carries last year -- over 16 games that is an average of 16.7. Either you are playing dumb or you don't know how an average is calculated.

Point blank - if Barber is so much better, the coaching staff would give him more carries and start him.

They don't. He isn't.

 

[AbeBeta]

There has been a gradual shift in how much each back is used, if you go back to the beginning of last season. Julius averaged 17 carries per game over the entire course of last season, but he averaged 20.2 carries per game for the first 10 games. His carries went down after that, due to a combination of factors. One reason was that we were behind in games so we were running less as a team, but the other reason was that Barber's share of the carries went up, percentage-wise.

BP explained the shift in terms of "resting" JJ -- when the season was on the line, who got the ball?

 

[Rack]

Julius had 267 regular season carries last year -- over 16 games that is an average of 16.7. Either you are playing dumb or you don't know how an average is calculated.

Point blank - if Barber is so much better, the coaching staff would give him more carries and start him.

They don't. He isn't.

I said he was better, not "So much" better.

But it's enough better to be obvious.

Well, obvious to most of us.

 

[Hoov]

Julius had 267 regular season carries last year -- over 16 games that is an average of 16.7. Either you are playing dumb or you don't know how an average is calculated.

Point blank - if Barber is so much better, the coaching staff would give him more carries and start him.

They don't. He isn't.

He is, They will. By game 4 he will be getting more carries than jj

 

[percyhoward]

BP explained the shift in terms of "resting" JJ -- when the season was on the line, who got the ball?

Parcells went with the guy who he was convinced was the better RB. Not only better than Barber, but better than Steven Jackson, too. Had to be, right? I wonder how much the current staff respects Bill's opinion on that one.

In the biggest game of the year up to that point (vs. Colts) JJ got the ball, and got the ball repeatedly, against the league's worst run D, after sitting out the entire second half the week before. How did he look in that game? Like he still needed rest. After that, down the playoff stretch, he had one 77-yarder sandwiched between 64 carries at 3.0 per. Then he looked great in Seattle after 6 straight games of 13 carries or less.

The guy who got the ball when the season was on the line is the guy you admit needed to be rested. This back who you claim that the (I'm assuming, current) coaches believe is the better of the two either has to have his carries limited all year long, or be saved for big games. What does that tell you about JJ's dependability, and how does that make him "better"?

If the starter were, by definition, always the better player, then no starter would ever lose his job.

 

[AbeBeta]

The guy who got the ball when the season was on the line is the guy you admit needed to be rested. This back who you claim that the (I'm assuming, current) coaches believe is the better of the two either has to have his carries limited all year long, or be saved for big games. What does that tell you about JJ's dependability, and how does that make him "better"?

And the guy who you claim is better averages about 8 carries a game -- what does that tell YOU about Barber's dependability?

 

[Doomsday101]

And the guy who you claim is better averages about 8 carries a game -- what does that tell YOU about Barber's dependability?

All it shows is he was limited by the last coaching staff. Barber has had games where he got over 25 carries in a game and went over 120 yards. It is about getting the oppertunity if he get it and fails then you have a point but because he has not gotten does not mean he is not better or that he can't do the job.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

And the guy who you claim is better averages about 8 carries a game -- what does that tell YOU about Barber's dependability?

because he only averages 8 carries per game means he is not dependable? come on... the number of carries has NOTHING to do with dependability. He is a situational RB. He is a dagger. He is a closer.

All it shows is he was limited by the last coaching staff. Barber has had games where he got over 25 carries in a game and went over 120 yards. It is about getting the oppertunity if he get it and fails then you have a point but because he has not gotten does not mean he is not better or that he can't do the job.

A few more carries would be nice... but to me... not a necessity... he has QUALITY carries that get results... I will take that over quantity any day.

When McFadden comes in... I say keep a similiar 2 headed RB monster attack.