Lebron to the Lakers

[jterrell]

I don't think GS can get any better. That's just me.

They can get better and may well do so.
With the glut of bad teams and tank teams they can pick off talent to make the back end of their rotation for lots of nothing.
All these teams will shift now.

GSW and HOU were already gonna battle to improve as they gear up to face each other again.

 

[jterrell]

I think they have this year but after that, they need to be ready to roll. I agree with that. I think that if you have James, you are pretty much signing up for the over the cap club. That's just my opinion thou.

exactly why trading for Kawhi now has value.
operating as a to be under the cap club is a negative/handicap to improving in season.

so get your big horses, then go get role players.
forget being a bad club focused on 2021 and focus on being the best now.

 

[Clove]

I hope they do. Howard is a flake. I watched him in LA and it is my opinion that signing Howard is a bad move.

Javale Mcgee was a bone head, but they reeled him in and he was very good there.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

no, they aren't telling us that.
they are telling us betters like the Lakers far more than they ever did CLE.

again this is common sense. what dufus would bet on the Cavs to win it all right now? not a soul.
vegas has to reflect that.
odds change mightily as the off-season than season wear on.

Vegas job is to balance out bets not predict games.

Were I betting I'd put money on HOU. --though I detest them.
They are quiet right now but showed with a healthy CPS they could beat the GSW.

That's exactly what they are telling us JT. Clevelands roster, right now, is bad. That entire team was built around James. Now that he is gone, they are broken. The Lakers, they have young pieces and were headed to the playoffs, IMO, with or with out James. The Lakers roster, IMO, is better right now then is Clevelands.

The problem here is that you are hung up on the Lakers right now. The post you are referring to was not a statement on if the Lakers could win the Championship. Reread the post. I said they might be the 3rd best team in the West. The statement was about the poster who said the Cleveland roster is better at every position right now. That's not true IMO and Vegas is clearly telling us that.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

exactly why trading for Kawhi now has value.
operating as a to be under the cap club is a negative/handicap to improving in season.

so get your big horses, then go get role players.
forget being a bad club focused on 2021 and focus on being the best now.

Already posted this. I said in another post that now is the time for the Spurs to make a deal. The later it gets, the less leverage they have.

 

[Clove]

All the Warriors would need is another 3-point shooter & a Capella type and they will rule the NBA.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

They can get better and may well do so.
With the glut of bad teams and tank teams they can pick off talent to make the back end of their rotation for lots of nothing.
All these teams will shift now.

GSW and HOU were already gonna battle to improve as they gear up to face each other again.

I don't think so but it depends on how Leonard plays this. Leonard can force a trade to LA if he wants. He can claim that he won't play for anybody else and that he's gone at the end of the season and all of a sudden, the only teams that might have real interest are teams that are really close. There are only a few of those and even fewer who can afford to lose players without hurting your chances further. Maybe Boston but if Leonard is serious, then you are paying a lot for a one and done chance and lets face it, you can get Leonard and still might lose to GS in the Finals. I don't see it happening but like I say, Leonard has a lot of control in this situation IMO.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Javale Mcgee was a bone head, but they reeled him in and he was very good there.

The more time they spend trying to make Howard work, the better the NBA likes it. They are welcome to try, I hope they do.

 

[jterrell]

GSW could end up with someone like Avery Bradley or Wes Matthews.

They can trade off future picks and such as needed and will find no shortage of guys willing to go there.

HOU is also likely to make moves.

The over the cap MLE (nba should do way with that crap) is a big weapon for them both.

 

[jterrell]

I don't think so but it depends on how Leonard plays this. Leonard can force a trade to LA if he wants. He can claim that he won't play for anybody else and that he's gone at the end of the season and all of a sudden, the only teams that might have real interest are teams that are really close. There are only a few of those and even fewer who can afford to lose players without hurting your chances further. Maybe Boston but if Leonard is serious, then you are paying a lot for a one and done chance and lets face it, you can get Leonard and still might lose to GS in the Finals. I don't see it happening but like I say, Leonard has a lot of control in this situation IMO.

No Leonard can't. He could be sued for breach of contract and really be in trouble long term. He could also face NBA sanctions that extend beyond this year or even have his joining that Lakers team banned totally.
He has to abide by the CBA.
He certainly has reduced his value to other teams a lot but again SAS if they go to tank mode has no reason to do him or LAL any favors.
In fact the more he antagonizes them the less likely they are to be amenable to his wishes.

The best thing for Kawhi right now would be to act like an adult. His wishes are clear but put his head down and go to work.

At the end of the day the best move for the Lakers and Kawhi is get the deal done and start operating like other heavy favorites not an under the cap team.
He is simply a FAR better player than any Laker not named LeBron. Go get him and you really do become a title contender.
Without him, not so much.

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

Uh....yes they are (3pt shot). Lakers have players that can handle the ball, create their own shot. Lebron, Ingram, Kuzma, Lonzo (3pt shot WILL be better), KCP, Hart, Stephenson, add the rookies Wagner, Mykhailiuk, etc.

Spoken like someone that's ignored the actual evidence.

They were second to last in the NBA in 3 PT percentage.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

No Leonard can't. He could be sued for breach of contract and really be in trouble long term. He could also face NBA sanctions that extend beyond this year or even have his joining that Lakers team banned totally.
He has to abide by the CBA.
He certainly has reduced his value to other teams a lot but again SAS if they go to tank mode has no reason to do him or LAL any favors.
In fact the more he antagonizes them the less likely they are to be amenable to his wishes.

The best thing for Kawhi right now would be to act like an adult. His wishes are clear but put his head down and go to work.

At the end of the day the best move for the Lakers and Kawhi is get the deal done and start operating like other heavy favorites not an under the cap team.
He is simply a FAR better player than any Laker not named LeBron. Go get him and you really do become a title contender.
Without him, not so much.

He can do whatever he wants JT. He can be sued but so what? They aren't taking anything other then what the league can fine him for. He does not have to play basketball for a team if doesn't want to. Many, many players have forced trades to certain teams and lets face it, the League is not going to get behind punishing Leonard for that because they want to see another super team with James as the headliner. That's big money for the league so no, nothing ridiculous is going to happen to Leonard if he forces the issue. That's my opinion on it.

I don't think the best thing for LA is get a deal done. That plays into San Antonio's hands and lets face it, if the Lakers can keep all of those young guys, can keep draft picks and just sign Leonard for cash, that's better for them all the way around. it's San Antonio, to me, that is on the wrong end of this deal.

 

[jterrell]

He can do whatever he wants JT. He can be sued but so what? They aren't taking anything other then what the league can fine him for. He does not have to play basketball for a team if doesn't want to. Many, many players have forced trades to certain teams and lets face it, the League is not going to get behind punishing Leonard for that because they want to see another super team with James as the headliner. That's big money for the league so no, nothing ridiculous is going to happen to Leonard if he forces the issue. That's my opinion on it.

I don't think the best thing for LA is get a deal done. That plays into San Antonio's hands and lets face it, if the Lakers can keep all of those young guys, can keep draft picks and just sign Leonard for cash, that's better for them all the way around. it's San Antonio, to me, that is on the wrong end of this deal.

No, they haven't.
That's what you are missing.
PG13 went to OKC, So did Carmelo. Both BADLY WANTED to play with LBJ but it didn't happen and now may not ever happen.

SAS can get random crap for either Philly or BOS for Kawhi who would instantly put either team in the Finals this year.
LAL isn't anywhere near GTD to make the Finals at this point.
-------
Washington Wizards coach Flip Saunders benched Andray Blatche Tuesday after the forward disobeyed orders to go onto the court. (Blatche disputes the coach's account.) Can the Wizards sue him for refusing to play?


Yes. By signing the National Basketball Association's Uniform Player Contract, a player agrees to "give his best services, as well as his loyalty, to the Team," to "conduct himself on and off the court according to the highest standards of honesty, citizenship, and sportsmanship," and "not to do anything that is materially detrimental" to the team or the league. Refusing to play in a game against a coach's orders could therefore be considered a breach of contract. The team could justifiably withhold payment, terminate his contract, or sue him for monetary damages. (Nearly every professional sport requires players to sign a similar contract.)

The only circumstance under which a player can refuse to compete—in just about any professional league—is if he's injured. Normally, it's up to the team doctor to decide whether an athlete is fit to play. If the player disagrees—or gets a second opinion from an outside doctor—he can file a grievance through the players union, which then negotiates a solution with the team.
--------

Again, Leonard's agent and Kawhi himself are best served by just shutting up and keeping heads down. Let Magic complete a trade for him.
But pressure is on the Lakers here not Spurs.
The Spurs aren't going to win a title or battle for one regardless, the Lakers might.
The Lakers need to form their team though fairly quickly and start accumulating pieces.

You do recall the CP3 trade being voided right?? The League has a lot of owners and giving the Lakers any gifts is unlikely to happen on their watch. If they vote to suspend Kawhi 50 games in 2019 after he played a handful last year and sits out this year? That's basically a career crusher at that point. Lakers or anyone gonna give him a max free agent deal if he's gotta sit 50 games?
And again Lakers have to hang with 1 year deals to make space next off-season until they get him. Then they can trade for overpaid but good players costing them nothing but future money.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

No, they haven't.
That's what you are missing.
PG13 went to OKC, So did Carmelo. Both BADLY WANTED to play with LBJ but it didn't happen and now may not ever happen.

SAS can get random crap for either Philly or BOS for Kawhi who would instantly put either team in the Finals this year.
LAL isn't anywhere near GTD to make the Finals at this point.
-------
Washington Wizards coach Flip Saunders benched Andray Blatche Tuesday after the forward disobeyed orders to go onto the court. (Blatche disputes the coach's account.) Can the Wizards sue him for refusing to play?


Yes. By signing the National Basketball Association's Uniform Player Contract, a player agrees to "give his best services, as well as his loyalty, to the Team," to "conduct himself on and off the court according to the highest standards of honesty, citizenship, and sportsmanship," and "not to do anything that is materially detrimental" to the team or the league. Refusing to play in a game against a coach's orders could therefore be considered a breach of contract. The team could justifiably withhold payment, terminate his contract, or sue him for monetary damages. (Nearly every professional sport requires players to sign a similar contract.)

The only circumstance under which a player can refuse to compete—in just about any professional league—is if he's injured. Normally, it's up to the team doctor to decide whether an athlete is fit to play. If the player disagrees—or gets a second opinion from an outside doctor—he can file a grievance through the players union, which then negotiates a solution with the team.
--------

Again, Leonard's agent and Kawhi himself are best served by just shutting up and keeping heads down. Let Magic complete a trade for him.
But pressure is on the Lakers here not Spurs.
The Spurs aren't going to win a title or battle for one regardless, the Lakers might.
The Lakers need to form their team though fairly quickly and start accumulating pieces.

You do recall the CP3 trade being voided right?? The League has a lot of owners and giving the Lakers any gifts is unlikely to happen on their watch. If they vote to suspend Kawhi 50 games in 2019 after he played a handful last year and sits out this year? That's basically a career crusher at that point. Lakers or anyone gonna give him a max free agent deal if he's gotta sit 50 games?
And again Lakers have to hang with 1 year deals to make space next off-season until they get him. Then they can trade for overpaid but good players costing them nothing but future money.

JT, you know that the Lakers didn't want to sign George or Anthony long term. If they had made a serious offer to George, he would be in LA right now IMO. All this talk about George not wanting to go to LA and would rather stay in OKC is just smoke IMO. The truth of the matter is that the Lakers wanted Leonard more then George and that's why they didn't offer him. When George realized that, he made a deal with OKC, which is probably the best deal for him so to me, that worked out really well all the way around.

CP3 trade is exactly what I'm talking about. The league didn't want to see that trade done so even though it was totally legal, they killed it and screwed the Lakers. The League picks winners and losers and that's why Leonard will not be punished if he forces this thing, IMO. Not gonna happen.

 

[bigdnlaca]

I hope they do. Howard is a flake. I watched him in LA and it is my opinion that signing Howard is a bad move.

Howard was bad in L.A. but there are a couple of things I did notice that will probably have him motivated to play basketball for them if he were to go to GSW.

1. He will be playing with guys where most of the team are willing passers and can penetrate.
2. He will be playing with a PF that has a defensive mindset like him. This is something I don't think he ever had. Teams relied on him to do everything on defense.

 

[jterrell]

JT, you know that the Lakers didn't want to sign George or Anthony long term. If they had made a serious offer to George, he would be in LA right now IMO. All this talk about George not wanting to go to LA and would rather stay in OKC is just smoke IMO. The truth of the matter is that the Lakers wanted Leonard more then George and that's why they didn't offer him. When George realized that, he made a deal with OKC, which is probably the best deal for him so to me, that worked out really well all the way around.

CP3 trade is exactly what I'm talking about. The league didn't want to see that trade done so even though it was totally legal, they killed it and screwed the Lakers. The League picks winners and losers and that's why Leonard will not be punished if he forces this thing, IMO. Not gonna happen.

ABQ you totally missed the point. Carmelo and George both wanted to go to LA.
Carlemo actually had long term LAL MAX offers on the table but chose the bigger money in NY.

Both PG13 and George forced trades last year after trying very hard to get traded to CLE they ended up accepting OKC.
That was the point. No matter how hard Kawhi tries he doesn't control his own destiny until 2019.
All he can do is talk. And talking just reduces his value to everyone.
He just needs to keep quiet, work hard and let LAL go get him.

SAS isn't going to give him away for nothing but they are going to move him.
After playing 9 games last year and scoring only 16 PPG with less than 5 rebounds it was a pretty sad season.
He can't take another off.

If the Spurs file an official complaint with the league regarding Kawhi the people who decide that are the same people who voided CP3.
Those are owners that want parity. And they will have no qualms about punishing the crap out of a player who won't fulfill his contract.
NBA players do not bail on contracts. This isn't the NFL.
Deals are guaranteed and they are lived up to.

Nerlens Noel was mad at Dallas and basically whined through his one year deal. His reward? He just signed a minimum salary deal.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

ABQ you totally missed the point. Carmelo and George both wanted to go to LA.
Carlemo actually had long term LAL MAX offers on the table but chose the bigger money in NY.

Both PG13 and George forced trades last year after trying very hard to get traded to CLE they ended up accepting OKC.
That was the point. No matter how hard Kawhi tries he doesn't control his own destiny until 2019.
All he can do is talk. And talking just reduces his value to everyone.
He just needs to keep quiet, work hard and let LAL go get him.

SAS isn't going to give him away for nothing but they are going to move him.
After playing 9 games last year and scoring only 16 PPG with less than 5 rebounds it was a pretty sad season.
He can't take another off.

If the Spurs file an official complaint with the league regarding Kawhi the people who decide that are the same people who voided CP3.
Those are owners that want parity. And they will have no qualms about punishing the crap out of a player who won't fulfill his contract.
NBA players do not bail on contracts. This isn't the NFL.
Deals are guaranteed and they are lived up to.

Nerlens Noel was mad at Dallas and basically whined through his one year deal. His reward? He just signed a minimum salary deal.

JT, I'm not missing any points here. I said, it depends on how hard Leonard pushes it but Anthony absolutely forced a trade. He foreced his way out of NY. He is a perfect example of what I am saying.

If San Antonio trades Leonard to another team, it's a one year rental but Leonard does not have to report, he can hold out and he can get fined by the league but nothing else is going to happen other then that. The guys who decided what would happen with the Lakers a CP3 will not decide what happens with Leonard because that guy is gone. Stern is who voided that deal with the Lakers he is gone but never the less, it wouldn't matter. The League did not want to see the Lakers roll at the the time that deal voided. The League wanted James and Miami to continue to be the marque franchise. Now, it's different. James has come to the Lakers so the league is no longer likely to come down hard on the Lakers or Leonard because they want to see that team become another Super Team. It is in there best interests to see that happen. I'm not missing any points here. I'm just saying that the situations have changed and I no longer believe that the league would take a hard stance on that. You know as well as I do that the NBA picks teams they want to see do well and they have for awhile. Do you not agree with that?

I don't see Philly or the Celtics going all in on Leonard to try and get him for one year. I mean, I guess they could but would you? The difference between George and Leonard, IMO, is that George didn't necessarily want to come to LA to be second fiddle to James, IMO. I think he wanted to be the man in LA. Leonard, he wants to come to LA, not because it's LA but because he wants to play with James. I feel like that's the big difference in that situation but again, this is all just my opinion. I've said that multiple time but I don't see JT. I don't see Philly making a can't walk away from deal to San Antonio for a single year.

Lakers would be much smarter, IMO, to wait till 2019 and sign him to a max deal then. They have plenty of cap next year and it gives them time to figure out what to do with Ball. Another year for Kuz and Ingram to develop and Randle will likely be gone. If the Spurs decide to be reasonable and as I said, the longer they wait, the less they get, then OK. If not, then OK.

Let San Antonio file whatever they want. That will not help them and what they will end up with is a Leonard who is walking through the regular season and getting nothing for him. How does that help anything? San Antonio, IMO, needs to understand that all of their leverage went out the window when James signed. Before that, the Lakers felt pressure to get Leonard Signed. Now, there is no reason to over pay for him. Next year, there a a ton of pretty good FAs so even if Leonard decided not to go to LA, the Lakers would still get another really good piece in FA IMO.

 

[sean10mm]

The Lakers should be well positioned for a free agency bonanza in 2019 even if they can't load up enough in 2018. I think that's what LeBron is seeing in the move to LA.

You might think that if LeBron was thinking in terms of 2 year builds he could just stay in Cleveland, but I don't think he trusts the ownership/management of the Cavs as far as they can throw him. Dan Gilbert is just a garbage owner and LeBron knows it.

 

[jterrell]

Lakers are not keeping the kids.
They just signed Rondo and renounced Randle for nothing.

 

[jterrell]

The Lakers should be well positioned for a free agency bonanza in 2019 even if they can't load up enough in 2018. I think that's what LeBron is seeing in the move to LA.

You might think that if LeBron was thinking in terms of 2 year builds he could just stay in Cleveland, but I don't think he trusts the ownership/management of the Cavs as far as they can throw him. Dan Gilbert is just a garbage owner and LeBron knows it.

I do think LAL should consider that option but it is far inferior to just being good now and landing the superstar next to LeBron that improves both ends of the floor.