McNabb... what we really think about him

Alexander

What's it going to be then, eh?
Messages
62,482
Reaction score
67,294
HeavyHitta31 said:
When most of your passes are short routes to the RB and TE, shouldnt you be rated pretty high?

The West Coast Offense always inflates QB ratings. Always has, always will. McNabb is a classic case of that. In fact, the system masks how truly inaccurate he really is.

Until McNabb gets it done like Montana did, the doubts will continue.

He is an above average QB because of the things he can do, outside of his passing.

Until he wins a championship like Montana did, he will forever be a notch below.
 

big dog cowboy

THE BIG DOG
Staff member
Messages
101,829
Reaction score
112,714
CowboysZone ULTIMATE Fan
Above average. He led the Iggles to several conference championship games without TO.
 

Da Hammer

The Natural
Messages
10,604
Reaction score
1
an above average QB that can make lots of plays and get you into the playoffs but thats it. Just not a guy that you want with a young team as your leader because he is not a leader and that hurts in a game like the Super Bowl where he looked pathetic. I would still take him though over what we have and with our O-line his mobility would help a lot
 

Gfunk

New Member
Messages
291
Reaction score
0
HeavyHitta31 said:
To me, "Elite" implies at least a top 5 player at their position. I don't see how McNabb is anywhere near that mark.

because he's everything to that offense, a pass-first offense

I got love for my boy James Thrash, but come on, he made Thrash a NUMBER ONE WR!! :eek:

besides his habit of passing the ball at the feet of WRs, he gets everything else right

very few QBs can carry a whole team like McNabb has the Eagles​
 

JackMagist

The Great Communicator
Messages
5,726
Reaction score
0
I think he is an above average QB who can't handle the pressure of a big game. He didn't get the nickname McChoke for nothing. It has been reported several times by various players that he loses his nerve in big games and starts having dry heaves (very similar to choking) and is just unable to keep it together. Several reports have it that this happened in the NFC Championship game before they went to the Superbowl but they were able to win that one in spite of the panic attack. I don't want him as my QB for this reason but if there were no playoffs and all I had to do was play regular season games I'd be fine with him.
 

Bob Sacamano

Benched
Messages
57,084
Reaction score
3
ABQCOWBOY said:
I'd expect you to understand what I'm saying. I'm not talking about yards or TDs. I'm talking about QB rating. That takes everything into consideration. Doesn't matter if you pass 20 times or 50 times. It is all compliled and averaged out. I'm just saying that just because the guy plays for the Eagles doesn't mean he isn't a good player. If the criteria is top 5, then he has done some things in the past few years to make that a point of debate.

:hammer:

I like the game, just hate the man
 

Nav22

Well-Known Member
Messages
14,448
Reaction score
17,757
You guys have gotta be kidding me. McNabb is definitely elite, as much as it pains me to say it.

He has a better than 2/1 TD/INT ratio for his career, and he has played with absolute TRASH from the WR position for every year but 1.5.

And the 1 full season that he DID have a great WR to throw to? He became the first QB in NFL history to throw for over 30 TDs and less than 10 INTs.

He's easily a top 8 QB and probably in the top 4... that makes him "elite" IMO.

That being said, I don't think he'll ever win a Super Bowl, and that puts a huge smile on my face. :starspin
 

SkinsandTerps

Commanders Forever
Messages
7,627
Reaction score
125
Seems to me that Tom Brady plays a version of west coast offense as well. Not saying that McNabb is as good as Brady but to discount his talents based on the style of offense he plays in is reaching.
 

MarionBarberThe4th

Well-Known Member
Messages
17,411
Reaction score
5,387
Quote:
Originally Posted by calcbfan1
He's an average QB that comes up small in big games.

You just described Bledsoe.[/QUOTE]

Bledsoe is the only QB in the division with a ring
 

RealCowboyfan

Championship
Messages
4,587
Reaction score
1
Bledsoe = above average quarterback
Mcnabb = Elite quarterback

I rather have McNabb over Bledsoe anyday.
 

SkinsandTerps

Commanders Forever
Messages
7,627
Reaction score
125
MarionBarberThe4th said:
Bledsoe is the only QB in the division with a ring

To use your logic :

David Patten is better than any other WR in the division.

Bledsoe didnt even throw one pass in that SB.
 

SkinsandTerps

Commanders Forever
Messages
7,627
Reaction score
125
MarionBarberThe4th said:
Unless that day is the superbowl...... jk

People forget, if it werent for Bledsoe NE wouldnt of won that first superbowl

Because Brady wasnt on a 6+ game winning streak at the time...

:rolleyes:
 

CrazyCowboy

Well-Known Member
Messages
32,287
Reaction score
440
I really believe he is an elite talent, however I cannot get past the fact that he is a beagle.....
 

ABQCOWBOY

Regular Joe....
Messages
58,929
Reaction score
27,716
5Stars said:
Forgive me, but, I'll take yards and TD's over any QB rating everyday, anyday...I don't care if he was this or that...!

Another thing, those stats sound better then Aikman has had...who would you want?

McNabb is not a winner...he's a whiner...good athlete...good scrambler, what not, but, he is not an "elite" QB....

As far as the INTs go, yeah, when you dump if off to a back 8 yards away from you and that back gains another 15 or 20 so yards, that counts as passing yards, your not going to have alot of INTs...

Intangibles...my friend, intangibles...and McSoup does not have those...

:star:

I will say again, I did not set the criteria for what makes elite. If the criteria is yards, TDs and INTs, then I don't see how you can look at McNabb and say he doesn't qualify. Perhaps we should qualify the criteria to read, Elite QBs are only elite if they pass for a lot of yards, have a very good Average Yard Per Attempt ratio, throw for a lot of TDs and very few INTs and lasty, this pertains only to QBs who are NOT named McNabb.

The question, who would you rather have Aikman or McNabb is relative. In the WCO, I'd probably take McNabb. In the timing offense, I'd take Aikman, no question. There are so many variables to a question like that. If you put McNabb in an offense with Irvin and Emmitt and that offensive line, what could he do? If you put Aikman in an offense with no WRs and no running game, to speak of, what would happen? You can't just say, who would you rather have? It's not that simple.

As I said earlier, I didn't create the criteria. If it is your opinion that he is not an elite QB, then lets not say the criteria for elite is yards, TDs, AYPA and INTs. Lets say you can't be a whinner or a crybaby or you have to be able to win a championship or whatever abstract criteria you want to pull out of the air. Manning is not an elite QB because he chokes. Fran Tarkenton is not an elite QB because he chokes. Dan Marino, Dan Foutes, Don Meredith, all chokers. The point can be made that Drew Bledsoe is a choker because in his opportunity to win, in a game he actually played in, he choked. Some how, this criteria doesn't seem all that fair but that's fine. If that's how we are going to judge things by, then set those things down as qualifying points rather then Yards, TDs, INTs and average yards per attempt.

Steve Young played in a WCO and threw those same kinds of passes. He has no intangibles either? Joe Montana, Brett Favre? The all played in WCOs and they all threw those short passes and they are all considered great. I guess it's because they have all won a championship using that offense and McNabb hasn't. Since McNabb hasn't won a championship, he is somehow down graded because of the offense? OK. I guess if that's how it is, then OK.

If McNabb ever wins a championship, will he then somehow have developed intangibles? I suspect intangibles is more of a crutch then anything where McNabb is conerned. I don't like the guy but I give him his due. He has been a great player for the Eagles. To me, that is beyond question.
 

Stash

Staff member
Messages
78,834
Reaction score
103,557
CowboysZone ULTIMATE Fan
ABQCOWBOY said:
I will say again, I did not set the criteria for what makes elite. If the criteria is yards, TDs and INTs, then I don't see how you can look at McNabb and say he doesn't qualify. Perhaps we should qualify the criteria to read, Elite QBs are only elite if they pass for a lot of yards, have a very good Average Yard Per Attempt ratio, throw for a lot of TDs and very few INTs and lasty, this pertains only to QBs who are NOT named McNabb.

The question, who would you rather have Aikman or McNabb is relative. In the WCO, I'd probably take McNabb. In the timing offense, I'd take Aikman, no question. There are so many variables to a question like that. If you put McNabb in an offense with Irvin and Emmitt and that offensive line, what could he do? If you put Aikman in an offense with no WRs and no running game, to speak of, what would happen? You can't just say, who would you rather have? It's not that simple.

As I said earlier, I didn't create the criteria. If it is your opinion that he is not an elite QB, then lets not say the criteria for elite is yards, TDs, AYPA and INTs. Lets say you can't be a whinner or a crybaby or you have to be able to win a championship or whatever abstract criteria you want to pull out of the air. Manning is not an elite QB because he chokes. Fran Tarkenton is not an elite QB because he chokes. Dan Marino, Dan Foutes, Don Meredith, all chokers. The point can be made that Drew Bledsoe is a choker because in his opportunity to win, in a game he actually played in, he choked. Some how, this criteria doesn't seem all that fair but that's fine. If that's how we are going to judge things by, then set those things down as qualifying points rather then Yards, TDs, INTs and average yards per attempt.

Steve Young played in a WCO and threw those same kinds of passes. He has no intangibles either? Joe Montana, Brett Favre? The all played in WCOs and they all threw those short passes and they are all considered great. I guess it's because they have all won a championship using that offense and McNabb hasn't. Since McNabb hasn't won a championship, he is somehow down graded because of the offense? OK. I guess if that's how it is, then OK.

If McNabb ever wins a championship, will he then somehow have developed intangibles? I suspect intangibles is more of a crutch then anything where McNabb is conerned. I don't like the guy but I give him his due. He has been a great player for the Eagles. To me, that is beyond question.

Everyone is entitled to their opinions and that's essentially all they are - opinions.

For me, a quarterback isn't really elite until he shows he can win the big game. Until then, the numbers don't mean a whole lot. The NFL is about winning and if a player can't win when it counts, it's a strike against them.

There are 3 quarterbacks I see in today's NFL that qualify for that "distinction":

Peyton Manning
Daunte Culpepper
Donovan McNabb

They all put up "numbers" in the regular season, but fold when the going gets tough and the games really count. That's not the kind of player I want leading my team.

As for McNabb's overall numbers, it's foolish to discount the impact of the offense he plays in. The West Coast Offense is a quarterback's dream and always inflates their numbers. And the numbers in Philadelphia are definitely skewed. McNabb probably dumps the ball off to his running backs more than any QB in the league - a safe, high-percentage throw - and with a guy like Westbrook they're especially effective.

McNabb had put up good - not great - numbers before Terrell Owens arrived. With Owens, his numbers were exceptional. It will be interesting to see what they look like without the league's best receiver this season.

For me, the stigma of choking in the big game trumps any regular season numbers a QB may put up. Because if you can't win when it counts, the numbers matter very little.
 
Top