Nate just said go after the pass rusher, not the guard.

[Hostile]

I agree with Nate in Free Agency, but not in the Draft. I would never pass on DeCastro.

 

[realtick]

I don't think they are dumb, we see players at different position including DL who put up great college numbers and do not do much in the Pros. I think scouts do the best they can with all the information they can get but in the end you don't know

Eric Norwood was considered one of the top pass rusher in 09 with 22 sacks

In 2 years and 28 games in the NFL he has 1 sack.

Exactly.

I could create a list longer than Schindler's of former college DEs/LBs pass rushers who had 12-15+ sack seasons that would have folks saying "oh yeah, I remember that guy..." that haven't done jack-squat in the NFL.

There are so many variables that determine whether a player will have success or not. It's not as simple as pointing to sack totals in college.

 

[InmanRoshi]

Registering 15 sacks (or whatever the magical number) doesn't equate to NFL success.

Actually, recording 15+ sacks season in college does in fact correlate to a high degree of success. Facts are right, you're wrong. Sorry.

 

[realtick]

Actually, recording 15+ sacks season in college does in fact correlate to a high degree of success. Facts are right, you're wrong. Sorry.

Yeah, actually it doesn't.

Care to share the data, or do you find more peace of mind in just making assertions and "fact-checking" them with your intuition?

 

[jswalker1981]

Bang the drum Nate but unfortunately, it probably won't matter. The Cowboy Fan Base wants DeCastro. That may not be what the team is thinking but I doubt we will change the collective minds of the Fan Base. I think most are set on DeCastro or Bust mode.

Oh, because Holland and Kosier are studs that don't need replacing.

 

[realtick]

Actually, recording 15+ sacks season in college does in fact correlate to a high degree of success. Facts are right, you're wrong. Sorry.

Let me help you since I know you won't be responding because you have nothing to support your claim.

Here are college players 2005 to present that have registered 15+ sacks:

2005
Elvis Dummervil
Dan Bazuin
Willie Evans

2006
Ameer Ismail

2007
Greg Middleton

2008
Jerry Hughes

2009
Brandon Sharpe
Von Miller

2010
Da'Quan Bowers

2011
Whitney Mercilus


There's two guys there out of that list that can legitimately be said that their college dominance/skills translated to NFL success. Your "facts" are wrong.....again.

 

[Chuck 54]

If there's someone at 14 that you think warrants the pick, especially cb, lb, or DL, great....if you aren't in love, trade down in round 1, pick up a starting C and extra picks.

If Tannyhill doesn't go top 10, he could be in play...I'd love to see him on board when 14 comes up....we'd get a nice offer to move down a bit.

 

[newlander]

I agree with Nate in Free Agency, but not in the Draft. I would never pass on DeCastro.

.......DeCAstro is a beast and we HAVE to do something to stem the tide up front: the gspots, eagles abuse us up front and the skins more than hold their own. IF there was a viable, solid pass rusher at 14 I would agree with Nate but this draft is thin in that category, and the few there are will be gone by the time we pick. DeCastro or Glenn is fine by me. Sign Finnegan or Carr at CB and also a vet center: either Myers or Samele.

The problem is, we won't be able to address all our needs this off season: just too many holes. If there was NO salary cap then maybe, but this situation has been made worse by Jerrah and Ciskowski: they haven't drafted well enought the last 5 years: the 2009 "special teams" draft is killing us right now

 

[Mr Cowboy]

Spencer is not the problem with this defense, its the defensive ends. If there is a bonifide player of the JJ Watt caliber sitting there at 14 I would take him over De Castro. Problem is that there is no such player. Ingram is not a DE and neither is Upshaw. Hightower is the closest to Spencer, but has not played the position.

When we are on the clock, I believe that De Castro will be the BPA. You don't reach for a player just because you don't think that OG is not a value.

This team needs better DE play, not a replacement for Spencer. We need to get past the days when we were told that our DEs were only required to tie up OL and not expected to rush the passer. Every other team running the 3-4 gets pressure from their DEs.

Did everyone forget the terrible OL play from the interior of our line from just a few months ago?

 

[L-O-Jete]

Grab Mario Williams and go back to a 4-3 and Wells or Myers in FA.
That is the key to success.

 

[Smith22]

Spencer is not the problem with this defense, its the defensive ends. If there is a bonifide player of the JJ Watt caliber sitting there at 14 I would take him over De Castro. Problem is that there is no such player. Ingram is not a DE and neither is Upshaw. Hightower is the closest to Spencer, but has not played the position.

When we are on the clock, I believe that De Castro will be the BPA. You don't reach for a player just because you don't think that OG is not a value.

This team needs better DE play, not a replacement for Spencer. We need to get past the days when we were told that our DEs were only required to tie up OL and not expected to rush the passer. Every other team running the 3-4 gets pressure from their DEs.

Did everyone forget the terrible OL play from the interior of our line from just a few months ago?

Draft Poe and move Rat to DE??

 

[Primetime42]

Draft Poe and move Rat to DE??

The thought had crossed my mind...

 

[Aven8]

So which pass rusher do you prefer at 14?

I like Ingram, but I don't think he'll be there. Don't think Coples will be there at 14 either.

I'm torn on Poe, not sure whether he's worth the risk.

Seems like Perry may be better suited as a 43 DE. I'm not as keen on Upshaw at OLB. Maybe Marceilus (sp?)? He seems like a prospect with a lot of upside, though I don't know if 14 is too early. I guess it depends if you think he's another JPP type. Then clearly he is.

Honestly, as much as I'd prefer a pressure player, I'm more comfortable with DeCastro, Glenn (assuming Ingram and Coples are gone). And the same goes for CB, I think we can get a good one in Round 2. I doubt we take a WR/QB/RB in Round 1 either.

Was it Mayock who said that this draft is very good for DL but not so good for pass rushers?[/

I like Ingram. He can play almost every position. Would be a great joker in Robs scheme. He is also great with the football in his hands for a big guy.

 

[realtick]

So which pass rusher do you prefer at 14?

I like Ingram, but I don't think he'll be there. Don't think Coples will be there at 14 either.

I'm torn on Poe, not sure whether he's worth the risk.

Seems like Perry may be better suited as a 43 DE. I'm not as keen on Upshaw at OLB. Maybe Marceilus (sp?)? He seems like a prospect with a lot of upside, though I don't know if 14 is too early. I guess it depends if you think he's another JPP type. Then clearly he is.

Honestly, as much as I'd prefer a pressure player, I'm more comfortable with DeCastro, Glenn (assuming Ingram and Coples are gone). And the same goes for CB, I think we can get a good one in Round 2. I doubt we take a WR/QB/RB in Round 1 either.

Was it Mayock who said that this draft is very good for DL but not so good for pass rushers?[/

I like Ingram. He can play almost every position. Would be a great joker in Robs scheme. He is also great with the football in his hands for a big guy.

I've been pimping Poe on this forum for months, but even I wouldn't want to take him at #14. I think he's a developmental prospect, and not an instant impact player ala Ndomakung Suh.

 

[Doomsday101]

Spencer is not the problem with this defense, its the defensive ends. If there is a bonifide player of the JJ Watt caliber sitting there at 14 I would take him over De Castro. Problem is that there is no such player. Ingram is not a DE and neither is Upshaw. Hightower is the closest to Spencer, but has not played the position.

When we are on the clock, I believe that De Castro will be the BPA. You don't reach for a player just because you don't think that OG is not a value.

This team needs better DE play, not a replacement for Spencer. We need to get past the days when we were told that our DEs were only required to tie up OL and not expected to rush the passer. Every other team running the 3-4 gets pressure from their DEs.

Did everyone forget the terrible OL play from the interior of our line from just a few months ago?

Romo did not forget.

 

[cowboy_ron]

So much is depending on what we do in FA as to who we take in rd 1

 

[Deep_Freeze]

So much is depending on what we do in FA as to who we take in rd 1

Well thank you.....starting to think I should put this in my sig cause I have said it so much, probably say it as much as we need balance on O and D.

I don't understand how we can marry any pick until we know who is available and who we get in free agency. Let's say we get Mario, front 7 is upgraded highly and DeCastro is front and center.

I'm not married to any pick til after free agency.

 

[Hoofbite]

I asked Hoofbite this question, so I'll ask you, why can't the Cowboys address the interior Oline thru free agency?

I responded.

They could but I don't see why it matters where they upgrade each spot so long as as many holes as possible are filled.

That's just part of the quote.

I'm wondering why they could fill spots on the defensive side of the ball in free agency?

 

[dmq]

Right, he fell to the 4th round after a 17.5 sacks season. And Elvis Dumvervil fell to the 4th round after a 20 sacks season. Which shows how dumb scouts are when they ignore college production from a pass rusher.

Yeah, but Elvis was productive in college because he had Montavious Stanley getting double teamed next to him. That's what Jeff Ireland told us.

 

[supercowboy8]

I agree with Nate in Free Agency, but not in the Draft. I would never pass on DeCastro.

I would pass on DeCastro on a good pass rusher like Ingram, Von Miller, Aldon Smith, or Kerrigan. But people look at stats and combine numbers and think reaching for a guy like Mercilus at 14 is just as good when they never seen him play and a can clearly see his game doesn't translate to a 3-4 SOLB. Andre Branch translate better than Mercilus does but I wouldn't take him over DeCastro. Branch and Mercilus isn't better than Spencer.

The only thing is, is that this draft doesn;t have a 3-4 DE or OLB pass rushers like last years draft had. I would take a JJ Watt over Decastro. But I don't see a Watt, Miller, or Kerrigan in this draft. Ingram is the closest one but he will go top 12.