NFC East records since Garrett took over Cowboys

Apollo Creed

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This made it official. The minute I see Jason Garrett I'm going to judo chop him in the neck.

The east has never been this weak. Think the Giants are going to be garbage again next year? The arrow is obviously going up with the Eagles. The Skins are gonna suck but they play us tough even when they're RG3-13.
 

Idgit

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How are they not related to the argument? Paul had 27 TOs in 8 games, Wade had 4. That is why the Cowboys won, plain and simple. That doesn't mean Paul is a better coordinator, just like it doesn't mean JG is a good coach. The season was over by then and Jerry Jones went buck-wild in the locker room. It was akin to Shanny saying the season is done last year, only to be followed by 7 straight wins. Lucky for them, they playedthe clown JG and got into te play-offs. Then, the collapsed this year and Garrett was fired.

And it does suck intoday's context cause each of those 3 other teams made the play-offs and the Giants won the SB. We on the other hand, just lose to them when it counts.

If you don't think that has any bearing on the argument, than your just being a homer.

You can drive a bus through the difference between 'any bearing' and 'it does suck,' khiladi. I'm not being a homer, at all. You can be disappointed with our production without resorting to believing the head coach is an idiot.

IIRC, we switched up and played more zone when Garrett took over for Wade. I don't believe that's something that suddenly occurred to Coach P. It's something Wade hadn't wanted to do earlier, for whatever reason.

And I don't care what anybody else who's just disgrunteld has to say about it. This team cannot defend the pass against a good passing offense, and it has not been able to for the last three seasons. This is the reason why we get beat when we're playing another good team for all the marbles. At the beginning of the season, when we've been healthier, we've held up better, but injuries and a just plain old inability to play pass defense bites us when we're playing a decent passing offense. With regularity. It's not the questionable play calling that can be considered one of a dozen factors that contribute to the losses. It's the historically-bad pass defense that's getting us beat. And, even so, it's getting us beat less than it's getting other teams in the NFCE beat. The problem is, when we're playing good teams and we need the win, we're not able to get it. We've racked up our wins by playing consistently well against teams that aren't as good as we are. We're not good enough to beat the week 17 Giants, or Commanders or Eagles each of the last three years.

The 'realists' for whatever reason, won't accept that, and somehow I'm a homer for acknowledging it. I'm not saying it because I like Jason Garrett (though I do). It's Jason's responsibility to fix it. He's added expensive resources and used high draft picks to do it. He's hired two DCs to do it. He's failed at it so far, and I see that every bit as much as the rest of you do. I say it because it's true. Because I'd rather see a HC with a track record of aggressively addressing personnel problems get another shot at it because I think the rest of the team is actually in really good shape. I understand that he's on borrowed time, too. But if you're one side away from solving your Rubix cube, it's not the time to mess the whole thing up again and start over, just because you're frustrated.

Now, I get people thinking our Rubix Cube is not really close at all. I don't agree, and I think the data is pretty clear why I shouldn't agree, but I do at least understand the sentiment. What I don't get is people who look at the pass defense effectiveness data and understand it who still think the real problem the team is play calling or balance or coaching. That just makes zero sense.
 

Idgit

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The east has never been this weak. Think the Giants are going to be garbage again next year? The arrow is obviously going up with the Eagles. The Skins are gonna suck but they play us tough even when they're RG3-13.

The same thing was said about the Giants last year. And the Skins were playing the role of this year's Eagles. The league doesn't end up working that way. And again, why are we expected to outperform the other teams in the East with a weaker roster, weaker management, and what's supposed to be a worse coach? The fact is, we're winning as much as anyone else in the division, doing it more consistently, and we're still unable to beat good teams when we need to because we're still unable to play anything other than bottom-25 pass defense.
 

Little Jr

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What this shows me is the nfc east has been as weak as its ever been in any 3 year stretch. Yet the best a jg lead team can do is 8-8 and a weak 17 choke job for 3 straight years.
 

Apollo Creed

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The same thing was said about the Giants last year. And the Skins were playing the role of this year's Eagles. The league doesn't end up working that way. And again, why are we expected to outperform the other teams in the East with a weaker roster, weaker management, and what's supposed to be a worse coach? The fact is, we're winning as much as anyone else in the division, doing it more consistently, and we're still unable to beat good teams when we need to because we're still unable to play anything other than bottom-25 pass defense.

You keep harping on this pass defense and acting like it's the only reason we're a perpetually mediocre team.

Pass defense and pass rush are a symbiotic relationship of sorts. Doesn't matter if we have 2 Deions, Woody and Ronnie Lott back there - it's impossible to cover people when QBs are comfortable. We made backups look all pro because they had time to make a sandwich in the pocket.

Even when we had a decent pass rush when Ware was healthy and Spencer was playing for a contract - we still gave up a ton of yards in the air because we had scrubs for safeties and our corners had no help over the top.

Ultimately meaning, plug one hole in this sinking ship and another one pops up. We're not a talented or deep defense because we've drafted poorly, given out bad contracts, and switched schemes 3 times in 4 years because it's obviously the DC's fault every year.

The blame falls squarely on the Jones' shoulders for a lack of talent on that side of the ball. Selvie, Hayden, Kearse, Bass, Heath - those guys would be on a lot of team's practice squads, but we're trotting them out there expecting them to stop somebody in today's offense oriented NFL. Yeah, right.
 

TheFinisher

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Who cares, we're the only team in the division that couldn't win when it mattered.... And we did it 3 years running.
 

blindzebra

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You keep harping on this pass defense and acting like it's the only reason we're a perpetually mediocre team.

Pass defense and pass rush are a symbiotic relationship of sorts. Doesn't matter if we have 2 Deions, Woody and Ronnie Lott back there - it's impossible to cover people when QBs are comfortable. We made backups look all pro because they had time to make a sandwich in the pocket.

Even when we had a decent pass rush when Ware was healthy and Spencer was playing for a contract - we still gave up a ton of yards in the air because we had scrubs for safeties and our corners had no help over the top.

Ultimately meaning, plug one hole in this sinking ship and another one pops up. We're not a talented or deep defense because we've drafted poorly, given out bad contracts, and switched schemes 3 times in 4 years because it's obviously the DC's fault every year.

The blame falls squarely on the Jones' shoulders for a lack of talent on that side of the ball. Selvie, Hayden, Kearse, Bass, Heath - those guys would be on a lot of team's practice squads, but we're trotting them out there expecting them to stop somebody in today's offense oriented NFL. Yeah, right.

Yeah like we did not have Spencer for Selvie, Ratliff for Hayden and Crawford for Kearse?

You do realize we lost the starter and back up at DT, DE, SOLB and MLB right?

You do realize we ended the season with a DE at SOLB and a rookie OLB at MLB right?

No coach or GM can prepare for the amount of injuries that forced us to play 26 different players in our front 7.
 

Apollo Creed

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Yeah like we did not have Spencer for Selvie, Ratliff for Hayden and Crawford for Kearse?

You do realize we lost the starter and back up at DT, DE, SOLB and MLB right?

You do realize we ended the season with a DE at SOLB and a rookie OLB at MLB right?

No coach or GM can prepare for the amount of injuries that forced us to play 26 different players in our front 7.

Well, that's the NFL - you're gonna have injuries. If you drafted better or signed better depth in the offseason you wouldn't be forced to sign people off the couch and move people around.

The Packers had 15 players on IR and won the Super Bowl. I'm tired of the excuses.
 

blindzebra

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Well, that's the NFL - you're gonna have injuries. If you drafted better or signed better depth in the offseason you wouldn't be forced to sign people off the couch and move people around.

The Packers had 15 players on IR and won the Super Bowl. I'm tired of the excuses.

And 13 of those 15 were fringe players. They also got players who were injured early back in the stretch run.

You can be tired of it all you want but the fact is finishing 8-8 with those injuries and the defense they caused was amazing coaching by Garrett.

Now play the bull **** game management card.
 

Apollo Creed

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And 13 of those 15 were fringe players. They also got players who were injured early back in the stretch run.

You can be tired of it all you want but the fact is finishing 8-8 with those injuries and the defense they caused was amazing coaching by Garrett.

Now play the bull **** game management card.

You can honestly say that Garrett managed games well this season?

C'mon bro. The only reason this team is competitive is because of Tony Romo, any one of 1,000 coaches could go 8-8 with this squad just by trotting him out there and watching him continue to put this team in a position to win. Romo was good before Garrett was here, he's good now, and he'll be good long after he's gone.

It's not like Garrett inherited some 2-14 team with no QB and no talent. As of right now your boy can't even be mentioned in the same breath as Wade Phillips.

He's had 3.5 years, the east has been garbage each year, and he can't even manage to make the playoffs?
 

blindzebra

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You can honestly say that Garrett managed games well this season?

C'mon bro. The only reason this team is competitive is because of Tony Romo, any one of 1,000 coaches could go 8-8 with this squad just by trotting him out there and watching him continue to put this team in a position to win. Romo was good before Garrett was here, he's good now, and he'll be good long after he's gone.

It's not like Garrett inherited some 2-14 team with no QB and no talent. As of right now your boy can't even be mentioned in the same breath as Wade Phillips.

He's had 3.5 years, the east has been garbage each year, and he can't even manage to make the playoffs?

Yes he did.

He inherited a 1-7 team without Romo and went 5-3...kinda blows that point huh?
 

Toruk_Makto

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If only it were that easy.

Also, saying that 5-3 makes Garrett's record "not as bad as people want to believe" is hyperbole, 2 more wins doesn't change nearly as much as you might be alluding it does.

I'm pretty sure if Garrett had 3 more wins in that ledger the mood around here would be different.

I'll leave it to you to guess which 3....
 

Apollo Creed

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Yes he did.

He inherited a 1-7 team without Romo and went 5-3...kinda blows that point huh?

6 of those 7 losses were by a TD or less.

That was an anomaly. Anyone with a brain understands Romo's value to this franchise. I'm starting to think you might be Jason Garrett. RJ is that you?
 

Beast_from_East

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I do. I don't understand why everybody expects the Cowboys to outperform the rest of the division with a first time HC, a liability at GM, a hamstrung cap, and a roster no better than that of the other three teams.

Why is it the Cowboys who are expected to take advantage of this weak division when teams like the Giants or a Eagles cannot? We're playing similar schedules.

Our weaknesses are well documented. In other threads we're more than willing to acknowledge their existence. We even try to make some up where there really aren't any. So why are the Cowboys expected to overdeliver when it comes to wins and losses? Is it because we like the star on the side of the helmet?

Chip Kelley, Tom Coughlin, Andy Reid, Mike Shannahan. These are some pretty good coaches struggling similarly with similar teams playing similar schedules. We expect Jason Garret to outperform them in terms of not only wins and losses, but NFC titles, that's a normal thing fans do. But it doesn't necessarily follow that we're a disaster when we're not able to do it. At some point you have to sit back and realize that beating good teams with a pass defense like ours is a really tall order.

We are not asking to "outperform our rivals"..........how about just matching them?..................Every one of our division rivals have won this division since Garrett became head coach, except us................that is a fact.

So we are not "outperforming" our division rivals, we are lagging behind all of them because each one of them have a division championship since Garrett took over..................except us.............again, not my opinion, its a fact.
 

Fredd

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Just imagine how one little thing makes this a HUGE difference...if we win the last 3 week 17 games, not only do we look better in the record department, but we also have 3 consecutive division titles and playoff appearances, while keeping the other 3 out of the playoffs

Dallas: 32-24
New York: 28-28
Philadelphia: 26-30
Washington: 19-37
 

blindzebra

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6 of those 7 losses were by a TD or less.

That was an anomaly. Anyone with a brain understands Romo's value to this franchise. I'm starting to think you might be Jason Garrett. RJ is that you?

Do any of you actually have any comprehension skills? Where did I say Romo had no value? You said it was not like he inherited a 2-14 team without a QB when in fact he went 5-3 with 3 close losses without Romo.
 

Beast_from_East

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Yes he did.

He inherited a 1-7 team without Romo and went 5-3...kinda blows that point huh?


His best season was when he was interim head coach...........its been all downhill since.................the longer he has remained head coach the worse the team has played................tells you all you need to know right there.
 

blindzebra

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His best season was when he was interim head coach...........its been all downhill since.................the longer he has remained head coach the worse the team has played................tells you all you need to know right there.

If you think we have played worse and worse you are more stupid than I thought and that says a lot.
 

Little Jr

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And 13 of those 15 were
fringe players. They also got players who were injured early back in the stretch run.

You can be tired of it all you want but the fact is finishing 8-8 with those injuries and the defense they caused was amazing coaching by Garrett.

Now play the bull **** game management card.


How bout the year before? And the year before?
 
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