NFL PA Statement

Philmonroe

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Which I think is a fair thing to say - without sufficient evidence, you can come up with all sorts of reasons as to how she ended up with those bruises. And it's really not Zeke's job to prove how she got those injuries, it's up to her to prove Zeke caused them (At least, if things were being looked at fairly)
Exactly it's like people have gotten conveniently silly all of a sudden. How did she get those marks? I don't know I wasn't with her when she got them. Guilty. Is this really how we want things to be handled? I guess it's okay until you(general) get that same bogus scenario then tunes will change guaranteed.
 

bsbellomy

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Because he has experts called lawyers that advise him what is best.

Yeah and Lawyers always advise you to do what's best right? Did they also advise him to withhold his phone records for 6 months before turning them over? Yeah great move there.
 

bsbellomy

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Which I think is a fair thing to say - without sufficient evidence, you can come up with all sorts of reasons as to how she ended up with those bruises. And it's really not Zeke's job to prove how she got those injuries, it's up to her to prove Zeke caused them (At least, if things were being looked at fairly)

Its actually not for you to say what he has to prove is it now? Some people here think I'm defending the NFL, I'm not and maybe it's garbage but it's reality.
 

mattjames2010

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Its actually not for you to say what he has to prove is it now? Some people here think I'm defending the NFL, I'm not and maybe it's garbage but it's reality.

You are defending it - and you didn't make an argument. **** no it's not about me proving it, genius. It's about a accuser proving it.

It being "reality" doesn't change what I'm saying. You know what I hate, and it often comes from lolbertarians, is how useless they can be. "Well I mean, the policies are stupid and may even break some laws, but LOL their decision" - Yeah, thanks.
 

Nightman

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Exactly it's like people have gotten conveniently silly all of a sudden. How did she get those marks? I don't know I wasn't with her when she got them. Guilty. Is this really how we want things to be handled? I guess it's okay until you(general) get that same bogus scenario then tunes will change guaranteed.
My mother watches an 18 month old and has bruises all over her body

He is active and jumps up into her arms and lap and grabs on when loses balance

Bruises aren't evidence of anything....... I can give myself ten bruises in the next 10 minutes
 

mattjames2010

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Yeah and Lawyers always advise you to do what's best right? Did they also advise him to withhold his phone records for 6 months before turning them over? Yeah great move there.

Irrelevant.

Lawyers are pretty good at what is and isn't good PR - Stop spouting off. Lawyers want their job to be easier, they don't want their client to say something stupid in front of cameras which will make it tougher to win a case.

MUH REALITY!
 

MeTed

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LOL at the NFL claiming the NFLPA was victim shaming Thompson, but one of the stories that paints her in a negative light came from the NFL.com website................ they really are an embarrassment.
I become so weary of the either/or false choices we are presented. We are almost taunted into accepting the idea that any defense offered is somehow "victim shaming," which is of course nonsense. The state of mind of the accuser, the background of the accuser and the actions of the accuser all provide insight into the likely truthfulness of the accuser. Yes it's true "victim shaming" has occurred, and we ought to make every effort to protect women and encourage them not to fear telling the truth. But we can't cross a threshold that eliminates the ability of the accused to defend his reputation, which merely by the fact of the accusation has already been heavily damaged.

This is framed these days as a man/woman issue when it is correctly a human/human issue. We have a responsibility to respect the rights of both parties and to respect the fact that either could be telling the truth. But the NFL issued a statement publicly branding Ezekiel Elliott as an abuser. Should we prevent him being able to offer any public defense? Those inclined to accept Elliott's guilt keep reminding us this isn't a criminal case and is more akin to a civil case, where preponderance of evidence trumps reasonable doubt. I would argue it is neither. It is an employer enforcing discipline on an employee under the strictures of a collective bargaining agreement.

But we can't stop there. We can't be naive. This is also a PR battle. The NFL made public accusations. It is now slamming the NFLPA for -- supposedly -- attempting to poke holes in the accusation by presenting alternate facts. Those alternate facts present the accuser in a poor light. But they are, it would seem, facts. And I struggle to understand why it is "public shaming" to point out those facts. Yes it creates an uncomfortable situation for the accuser, but this is true in almost any situation in which one is accused of doing something illegal, immoral or criminal. The character and motives of the accuser are as much an indicator as those of the accused.

We are a nation built in part on the concept that the accused has a right to a defense. At what point did we decide that wasn't true for a man accused by a woman of having committed violence against her? At what point did we say this is sufficiently reprehensible that the accusation alone makes the accused guilty? And if it turns out he was innocent, the fact his reputation was destroyed is merely unfortunate collateral damage.

At what point did we decide the accuser's reputation is more important than the reputation of the accused? They are both human beings. Both of them have already endured a measure of public shaming. There are people who will never believe her, absent 100% proof. There are people who will never believe him, absent 100% proof. He is at a disadvantage because of the inherent difficulty of proving a negative.

But is it reasonable to take the position that Elliott and his defenders must not use facts to defend his reputation before it is tarnished beyond repair? Is his reputation meaningless because he has been accused of a heinous act? Is this what we've come to? Have we gone so far that even his family cannot point to facts that suggest their son might just be innocent? And if they do so that explains everything -- of course he is a woman beater because look at the insensitivity of his family in defending their son by pointing to her actions, motives and behavior? Aha! Now we have the answer.

Is this where we've come? Is this the outcome we want?
I get what you are saying, but even in the NFL's response they noted to Zeke there are injuries to the accuser that he cannot explain. And it seems his defense thus far has not been to explain those injuries. Now maybe it's coming, but his team did not start with their focal point. I'm pretty sure they already knew her credibility was ****, but that still doesn't wash away the part of their findings that they are basing their decision on.

By the way, I think people were hoping for a more pronounced and active denial. Google "mcgregor responds to racism claims", that's the kind of response I would expect (if he's innocent).

I keep reading post-after-post giving the accuser a free pass on credibility which is mind boggling. There is irrefutable evidence that the accuser lied. It defies logic and common sense to assume ANY of her testimony is credible. What objective standard is the NFL using to cherry pick portions of her testimony? That's what the NFL needs to reconcile to the court of public opinion.
 

Stash

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I keep reading post-after-post giving the accuser a free pass on credibility which is mind boggling. There is irrefutable evidence that the accuser lied. It defies logic and common sense to assume ANY of her testimony is credible. What objective standard is the NFL using to cherry pick portions of her testimony? That's what the NFL needs to reconcile to the court of public opinion.

And what they will ultimately have to reconcile in a real court of law.

I can't wait to see the public spanking the NFL receives on this.
 
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