Norm says we should've traded Ware

[Future]

They should have traded him after the 2011 season...if not before last year.

 

[Hoofbite]

Is that even legal?

Yeah, Dallas lets it be known he's available and grants permission for teams to contact him.

 

[big dog cowboy]

No one was going to take that base salary...

Correctamundo.

 

[Galian Beast]

I don't think that's necessarily true.

Denver is going to pay him $13M in year 1. $3M base, $5M roster bonus, $5M signing bonus.

Considering they could have done whatever they wanted with that base salary in terms of guaranteeing a portion and prorating it over the next however many years, taking on his $12M base salary wouldn't have been a problem.

The only real deterrent would have been that his scheduled base salaries were higher in the next few years than they are in Denver but given he took less, I don't see any reason why a team couldn't have negotiated that in the process.

It's not just about his base salary in this year. He was scheduled to make at least 13 million a year for 4 years (think a couple of the final 2 years were 13.5), what he signed on with Denver was 30 million for 3 years. That is so not only is that a shorter contract but it's significantly less money. We're looking at a 9 million dollar difference for that 3 year period.

 

[gmoney112]

Yeah, Dallas lets it be known he's available and grants permission for teams to contact him.

And what exactly is stopping a team from saying,

"Just hold out, they'll release you. And then we'll sign you for more than their offering without giving up a draft pick" ?

I think the last thing you want to do as a team with no leverage is let a player you're going to attempt to negotiate with talk to other teams about contracts. There was no way Dallas was keeping Ware with his contract and everyone knew it.

 

[OhSnap]

Is it true that we could've traded ware and received something in return? We went directly from meeting with Ware to releasing him. Denver overpaid him so maybe we could've used other teams interest as leverage for a late round pick.

Are you trying to tell me someone was critical of how the Cowboys handled their business? Cowboys trade all time sack leader for a 6th rd draft pick. LOL that would have been a much better headline for the talking heads.

 

[Nightman]

I advocated a trade the whole time. His salaries aren't a big deal because nothing was guaranteed, but the team would have him under contract for 4 years if they wanted. The biggest drawback was that no one thought a team would want him for multiple years.

If Denver wanted to guaranteed him 20m they could have easily used his existing contract to accomplish it. Just turn his 12.75m salary into a roster bonus instead of a signing bonus. By guaranteeing him another 7m in 2015 the old salary numbers would be discarded. Baltimore just did the exact same thing with Suggs.

Either way they probably wouldn't have got more than a 4th round pick, but it would allow them to save some face I suppose. Everyone definitely underestimated the market for Ware, but like they say "it only takes one".

 

[visionary]

Is it true that we could've traded ware and received something in return? We went directly from meeting with Ware to releasing him. Denver overpaid him so maybe we could've used other teams interest as leverage for a late round pick.

what i said about this from the beginning was that we were not being forced to cut him since we were under the cap and ware knew that FA dollars dry up quickly

once we got under the cap, we had all the leverage

we could have told him that he can either take a paycut and stay (or get traded) or we will designate him a june 1 cut when all the FA dollars have dried up and most teams have already filled their needs

given this, ware would have taken a paycut

jerry cant play hardball with players because he wants to be viewed as their favorite uncle
we suffer by paying out large contracts and over-valuing players or cutting players becasue "it is fair to them"

well, what about doing what is best for the team?
if it means we can benefit from hardball with some players, too bad

this is where jerry being owner and GM is a huge detriment to the team

the GMs job is to build the best team and to treat every player as an asset
he is not trying to become their friend

jerry is

 

[gmoney112]

what i said about this from the beginning was that we were not being forced to cut him since we were under the cap and ware knew that FA dollars dry up quickly

once we got under the cap, we had all the leverage

we could have told him that he can either take a paycut and stay (or get traded) or we will designate him a june 1 cut when all the FA dollars have dried up and most teams have already filled their needs

given this, ware would have taken a paycut

jerry cant play hardball with players because he wants to be viewed as their favorite uncle
we suffer by paying out large contracts and over-valuing players or cutting players becasue "it is fair to them"

well, what about doing what is best for the team?
if it means we can benefit from hardball with some players, too bad

this is where jerry being owner and GM is a huge detriment to the team

the GMs job is to build the best team and to treat every player as an asset
he is not trying to become their friend

jerry is

I don't think you know the definition of leverage.

 

[visionary]

really? who would pay? would anybody be willing to trade draft picks, for a player with injury history and a large salary like that? probably a low round pick. nobody would pay 1-4 round picks.

just taking a wild guess but a team that thought they could win now and were willing to give him 13 million in his first year and 20 million guaranteed might have

just a guess

 

[visionary]

I don't think you know the definition of leverage.

ouch, that hurt

 

[Hoofbite]

And what exactly is stopping a team from saying,

"Just hold out, they'll release you. And then we'll sign you for more than their offering without giving up a draft pick" ?

I think the last thing you want to do as a team with no leverage is let a player you're going to attempt to negotiate with talk to other teams about contracts. There was no way Dallas was keeping Ware with his contract and everyone knew it.

They could say that but it's unlikely a handful of teams would all say that.

And if they did, so what? No worse off than they are now.

 

[gmoney112]

They could say that but it's unlikely a handful of teams would all say that.

And if they did, so what? No worse off than they are now.

Well, hindsight is 20/20. At the time they were trying to reach a negotiation.

Let him contact other teams and there's no point in even entering the room. Your chance of reaching any kind of negotiation went from slim to none.

 

[visionary]

They could say that but it's unlikely a handful of teams would all say that.

And if they did, so what? No worse off than they are now.

no way, it has never happened

oh wait.... the new orleans saints just traded sproles for a 5th after almost cutting him, but then keeping him because they heard a lot of teams were interested

 

[Hoofbite]

Well, hindsight is 20/20. At the time they were trying to reach a negotiation.

Let him contact other teams and there's no point in even entering the room. Your chance of reaching any kind of negotiation went from slim to none.

So don't negotiate. If you're genuine in saying you'll cut him if his salary isn't reduced there's no need to negotiate.

Tell him the situation, wait for his response. Move from there. You can't just drag it out hoping hes going to change his mind.

 

[gmoney112]

So don't negotiate. If you're genuine in saying you'll cut him if his salary isn't reduced there's no need to negotiate.

Tell him the situation, wait for his response. Move from there. You can't just drag it out hoping hes going to change his mind.

So you didn't even want to make an attempt at working out a new contract for Ware?

 

[ferrispata]

Jerry is lazy.....that would have required him getting off his duff and picking up a phone and make some phone calls. That would have been too difficult

I would call JJ many things, but Lazy is not one of them.

 

[Hoofbite]

So you didn't even want to make an attempt at working out a new contract for Ware?

They've had months to do that.

This isn't a of or die in the next 60 seconds situation.

 

[KingintheNorth]

When a player is traded, the new team inherits the base salary only on the remaining years and they are not guaranteed. Teams can, and usually do, give the player a new contract because they can rip up the old one at no cost to their salary cap. The player usually does it because it means more guaranteed money (new signing bonus). Denver could have given Ware the exact same deal they gave him had they traded for him.

Teams know the book on Jerry. Either you beat him in the trade or you wait him out and he'll cut the player that he gave a huge contract to. I think he cut Ware sooner than later out of respect to the player AND to free up the room for the Cowboys now. Although, Jerry isn't really doing anything meaningful with that room.

 

[DuDa]

Is that even legal?

No but it happens all of the time I bet.