Offensive line, offensive line, and more offensive line

[InmanRoshi]

That was a ridiculous statement. Phil Costa is the only player returning to the same position as last year, and you think we have the same questions as the two Super Bowl teams?

The Patriots have lost Matt Light, Brian Waters and Dan Koppen from their starting lineup from Week 1 2011. Sebastian Vollmer came into this season on PUP with chronic back problems that have been bothering him since last year and wasn't able to play in the preseason, and his replacement Marcus Cannon was a dumpster fire filling in for him. Their best returning OL Logan Mankins is coming back from a torn ACL surgery.

The Giants OL was mediocre at best last year, and upon that unit they've replaced Will Beatty with Sean Locklear protecting Eli's blindside. A guy working on his 3rd team in 3 years, and was basically the Commanders version of Derrick Dockery in 2011. If you believe that guys like Nate Livings and Bernadeau can't be critical cogs in a good offensive line, and that you absolutely have to have a Carl Nicks or David DeCastro, you would have to say guys like David Bass and Kevin Kevin Boothe are fairly awful. David Bass was a backup from the 49ers who came in as a cheap free agent, and Kevin Boothe is a former Raiders castoff who before last year was a career backup.

 

[baj1dallas]

I can only imagine the massive poutrage and hysteria if the Cowboys opened Week 1 with Sean Locklear as our starting blindside tackle.

If they had gone into the offseason with that as the plan, yeah I think you would have every right to question that.

 

[PhillyCowboysFan]

That was a ridiculous statement. Phil Costa is the only player returning to the same position as last year, and you think we have the same questions as the two Super Bowl teams?

It's hard to even begin to debate that. It's like saying water is dry.

Yes I do looking at the start of last season. Based upon the fact that both those teams had major problems in the beginning of last season with their Olines. Both QB's took major hits and sacks until those lines begin to gel later in the season. Also the Giants couldn't open any running lanes for their backs.

 

[baj1dallas]

The only thing tonight is going to prove is people's pre-existing confirmation bias.

So you don't believe that there's any way to objectively judge the performance of the offensive line? It can't be done, because the laws of nature prevent it? Human senses aren't finely tuned enough to make the measurements? Instruments aren't sensitive enough to capture the information?

BS.

 

[baj1dallas]

The Patriots have lost Matt Light, Brian Waters and Dan Koppen from their starting lineup from Week 1 2011. Sebastian Vollmer came into this season on PUP with chronic back problems that have been bothering him since last year and wasn't able to play in the preseason, and his replacement Marcus Cannon was a dumpster fire filling in for him. Their best returning OL Logan Mankins is coming back from a torn ACL surgery.

The Giants OL was mediocre at best last year, and upon that unit they've replaced Will Beatty with Sean Locklear protecting Eli's blindside. A guy working on his 3rd team in 3 years, and was basically the Commanders version of Derrick Dockery in 2011. If you believe that guys like Nate Livings and Bernadeau can't be critical cogs in a good offensive line, and that you absolutely have to have a Carl Nicks or David DeCastro, you would have to say guys like David Bass and Kevin Kevin Boothe are fairly awful. David Bass was a backup from the 49ers who came in as a cheap free agent, and Kevin Boothe is a former Raiders castoff who before last year was a career backup.

None of those guys have anything to do with the answer to this question: Can Phil Costa at least perform adequately this year?

If you see Romo ducking and spinning left or right almost immediately after the snap multiple times tonight (should look familiar to anybody who watched the first preseason game), that should answer that question. Of course some people will see that and say that it couldn't possibly be the center's fault, even if you see him attempt and fail to block a man lined up directly across from him, but I think you can safely ignore those people.

 

[InmanRoshi]

If they had gone into the offseason with that as the plan, yeah I think you would have every right to question that.

It's not a huge surprise that Will Beatty has had back problems. He's been having them since the spring. Suffice to say they can officially be diagnosed as "chronic" at this point. They cut Kareem McKenzie, their starting right tackle from last year. And how did they address the position in the offseason to compensate ? They signed Sean Locklear off the free agency scrap heap. Seems like it was their "plan" to me, or else they just didn't have a plan.

 

[InmanRoshi]

None of those guys have anything to do with the answer to this question: Can Phil Costa at least perform adequately this year?

Every team in the NFL is starting their version of Phil Costa somewhere on the OL. If he can play similar to how he played at the end of the season last year when he got his bearings and starting playing around better guards, I'll take it.

The Cowboys are the only fanbase in the NFL who believe you have to have $30 million signing bonus free agents and/or Top 50 draft picks at all 5 positions in the NFL. Even among fanbases who have observed much worse OLs.

 

[BourbonBalz]

The Patriots have lost Matt Light, Brian Waters and Dan Koppen from their starting lineup from Week 1 2011. Sebastian Vollmer came into this season on PUP with chronic back problems that have been bothering him since last year and wasn't able to play in the preseason, and his replacement Marcus Cannon was a dumpster fire filling in for him. Their best returning OL Logan Mankins is coming back from a torn ACL surgery.

The Giants OL was mediocre at best last year, and upon that unit they've replaced Will Beatty with Sean Locklear protecting Eli's blindside. A guy working on his 3rd team in 3 years, and was basically the Commanders version of Derrick Dockery in 2011. If you believe that guys like Nate Livings and Bernadeau can't be critical cogs in a good offensive line, and that you absolutely have to have a Carl Nicks or David DeCastro, you would have to say guys like David Bass and Kevin Kevin Boothe are fairly awful. David Bass was a backup from the 49ers who came in as a cheap free agent, and Kevin Boothe is a former Raiders castoff who before last year was a career backup.

Now you're just not being fair. Quit trying to confuse some of these guys with facts.

 

[Doomsday101]

You know it is not just the OL stepping up it is the RB picking up his man on blocks. There will be times where the back has to come up and pick up the middle rusher this is not something just done in Dallas but pretty much through out the league.

 

[Mash]

It was the best offensive line ever assembled. It put together numerous rushing titles for Emmitt Smith, and Troy just stood back there and surveyed the field at will.

He got hurt before it was assembled, and after it fell part later in the 90s, but for five years, it was the best I ever witnessed.

IMHO....Emmitt Smith made that OL better then it was.

That and Norv with his scheme......pick your poison......teams couldnt put 8 in a box.

The 90's oline was very good....but lets not overrate them....

Its funny....we overrate the oline of the 90's.....and we think our present OL is the worst ever put on a NFL field.

Like mentioned here....how did we put up such great offensive numbers with a OL that pathetic? Tony Romo must be the greatest QB ever to play the game then.

I just find it funny.....

 

[Mash]

You have a valid point about Romo's stat, but Romo can move out of the pocket alot. If it was not for Romo, that online last year would have given up more sacks.

Cant that be said about alot of QB's in this league? Eli makes subtle moves in the pocket to get a throw off....he doesn't scramble like a Romo....but sometimes you dont have too.

Doesnt Rodgers make his OL look better......Didnt Newton....Vick....etc

And then there are some QB's that make a OL look worse....

 

[NoLuv4Jerry]

We apparently didn't need Carl Nicks, nor did we need to draft a center or guard in the draft. What we needed were two bulkier, younger guards to bracket Costa at center, and Bill Callahan to coach 'em up instead of Hudson Houck.

We'll see tonight.

Until this team has an offensive line that can stand up against elite pass-rushing defensive lines, not a single thing is going to change. This schedule features several teams with good defensive fronts, so this improvement isn't optional, and it can't be patchworked.

The offseason moves have to be correct....or else.

I'm looking forward to watching the new-look defense tonight, but make no mistake, tonight and this entire season rely solely on the offensive line. It has to be dramatically better than last year.

My eyes will be focused intently Smith, Livings, Costa, Bernadeau, and Free tonight.

You speak the truth. Every year for the last 5 years when people ask me how the Cowboys are going to do...I tell them.....let me see the o-line, and I will tell you how I think they are going to do. So tonight is as good a test as this OL will get all year. And how they fare will go a long ways in determining how this team is going to fare.

 

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

I've said it many times before, but when you have a mobile quarterback like we have you don't a great offensive line. You look at last year the Giants OL wasn't all that great and neither was Green Bay's the year before.

 

[Mash]

Your memory is pretty flakey, then. I assume you're 5 years stretch is from 1991-1996. Steve Buerlein had to play for a long stretch of the season in 1991, and Bernie Kosar had to fill in for Troy in the 1993 NFC Championship game. And Jason Garrett having to play a Thanksgiving Game against the Packers in 1994, and Rodney Peete playing an important December game against the Eagles that same year.

Stop throwing facts out there....some just have a certain opinion and wont budge from it.

You can throw all the facts you want.....but if they think this OL is the worst ever.....and last year was even worse....then so be it.........cant change their minds....

 

[jazzcat22]

So you're saying offensive line is an issue?

Who knew?

Seriously, there could be a thread on the type of shoe strings the team wears and some yahoo comes in screaming, "offensive line stinks! offensive line stinks!"

Yes, I know I opened the thread and decided to comment, but I do so simply to ask, for the millionth time, "what Cowboys fan on this board doesn't know that offensive line is an issue?"

I've asked many times before without a concrete reply for one fan who says all is well with the offensive line, and no one's yet to show me that fan because he/she doesn't exist.

As ridiculous as fans can be on this board, we all know the OL has issues!

So for the love of Pete, let us play at least 8 games with the same OL, before we get back to screaming the sky is blue.

Oh, and I'm just gonna go out on a limb and say that the FO throws a lot of resources at the OL in the offseason...call it a hunch.

You could have replaced PETE with PHIL.....:laugh2:

I been saying this all off season...watch and see how the OL improves.
I think it will be a pleasant surprise they will play well.
But as another poster said...fans will still see the negatives and not the positives.

 

[erod]

Your memory is pretty flakey, then. I assume you're 5 years stretch is from 1991-1996. Steve Buerlein had to play for a long stretch of the season in 1991, and Bernie Kosar had to fill in for Troy in the 1993 NFC Championship game. And Jason Garrett having to play a Thanksgiving Game against the Packers in 1994, and Rodney Peete playing an important December game against the Eagles that same year.

I remember it just fine. He still had loads of time to throw the ball. I never said football wasn't a rough game back then; in fact, you could actually hit a quarterback in the head back in those days...and the knees and anywhere you wanted to.

But go ahead and make a case for this this offensive line versus that one. It's going so well for you.

 

[speedkilz88]

It was the best offensive line ever assembled. It put together numerous rushing titles for Emmitt Smith, and Troy just stood back there and surveyed the field at will.

He got hurt before it was assembled, and after it fell part later in the 90s, but for five years, it was the best I ever witnessed.

Your memory is pretty flakey, then. I assume you're 5 years stretch is from 1991-1996. Steve Buerlein had to play for a long stretch of the season in 1991, and Bernie Kosar had to fill in for Troy in the 1993 NFC Championship game. And Jason Garrett having to play a Thanksgiving Game against the Packers in 1994, and Rodney Peete playing an important December game against the Eagles that same year.

I have to add that Mark Tuinei, Nate Newton, and Kevin Gogan were all on the team before Troy.

 

[erod]

Stop throwing facts out there....some just have a certain opinion and wont budge from it.

You can throw all the facts you want.....but if they think this OL is the worst ever.....and last year was even worse....then so be it.........cant change their minds....

I'll forgive you. You're too young to have seen winning Cowboys football before.

 

[erod]

IMHO....Emmitt Smith made that OL better then it was.

That and Norv with his scheme......pick your poison......teams couldnt put 8 in a box.

The 90's oline was very good....but lets not overrate them....

Its funny....we overrate the oline of the 90's.....and we think our present OL is the worst ever put on a NFL field.

Like mentioned here....how did we put up such great offensive numbers with a OL that pathetic? Tony Romo must be the greatest QB ever to play the game then.

I just find it funny.....

LOL, Emmitt wouldn't get touched until he was 4-5 yards downfield. Gimme a break.

How long has it been since we had 1,000-yard rusher? Emmitt used to have that by week 9.

We ran the ball horribly against good defenses last year. We just ran up stats against the Rams, Bills, and Seahawks, which made the totals and averages look better. Couldn't do squat against the Giants or Eagles.

 

[InmanRoshi]

I have to add that Mark Tuinei, Nate Newton, and Kevin Gogan were all on the team before Troy.

And they all sucked until their 3rd or 4th years in the league. I can only imagine what the opinions would have been of them had messageboards and 24/7 media existed in 1988.