Pa. governor sues NCAA over Penn State sanctions

[Cajuncowboy]

Exaggerated foolishness.



My analogy is simple and accurate. If you can't see how one man's crime impacts not only himself, but his whole family, .. then I can now understand why you are so upset that Penn St. got what they got.

Ummm, no, I can see how someone's actions impact their family. But this is an institution. Not a family.
You are comparing apples and oranges. And it makes no sense whatsoever. It's a desperate analogy to condone something that on the face is simply wrong and at it's core is egregious at best.

 

[rickjameschinaclub]

A player taking gifts/payment is aiding his teammates in a way, hence the competitive advantage, the prime mission of the NCAA. For example, would Newton have gone to Auburn if someone didn't pay his father? Would Auburn have won a title without Newton? An ineligible athlete participating definitely "aids" his teammates so sanctions are meant to maintain a competitive balance.

Prime mission isn't an issue of dispute... A corporation's prime mission is to maximize profits. That doesn't absolve it of it's moral responsibility to turn over a child molestor that happen to be in a position of power within that organization, when coming to know of criminal activity, because that doesn't fall within the gambit of it's 'corporate goals'.

The reality is, Sandusky used the program for his crimes and the university did nothing.

 

[rickjameschinaclub]

One is an NCAA violation that provides his teammates an advantage. The other does not.

Well, your the one talking about justice in this conversation.. I'm sorry, but your rationalizations seem to be pathetic, because the punishment for the NCAA 'violation' is a lot more 'unjust' than what is being handed down to school for child molestation.

If you got a problem with the punishment on moral grounds, that innocent people are being punished for a crime they didn't committ, while justifying punishing schools because four athletes took cash from boosters, then what really is there to say about your loyalty to Penn state.. At least the culture can be praised for teaching their followers blind allegiance...

 

[StanleySpadowski]

Prime mission isn't an issue of dispute... A corporation's prime mission is to maximize profits. That doesn't absolve it of it's moral responsibility to turn over a child molestor that happen to be in a position of power within that organization, when coming to know of criminal activity, because that doesn't fall within the gambit of it's 'corporate goals'.

The reality is, Sandusky used the program for his crimes and the university did nothing.

So you want the NCAA to make moral judgments? That's simply insanity.

 

[WV Cowboy]

It's a desperate analogy to condone something that on the face is simply wrong and at it's core is egregious at best.

All of the investigators, all of the investigations, found whatever they found and came to the conclusions that they did, dealt out the punishments that they did, .. and Penn St. never said a word, but just accepted it all.

You need to let that all sink in a bit.

 

[rickjameschinaclub]

So you want the NCAA to make moral judgments? That's simply insanity.

One can only imagine the state of the world when an organization deems foul child molestation and the support of it as foul and worthy of punishment, it is seen by the general populace as insanity...

Also, I guess cheating and fair play isn't a moral issue? In fact, one can only imagine under what basis the NCAA rules were originally written if not from a moral basis...

Just because the NCAA has become hypocrites does not mean all their actions are wrong.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

Well, your the one talking about justice in this conversation.. I'm sorry, but your rationalizations seem to be pathetic, because the punishment for the NCAA 'violation' is a lot more 'unjust' than what is being handed down to school for child molestation.

If you got a problem with the punishment on moral grounds, that innocent people are being punished for a crime they didn't committ, while justifying punishing schools because four athletes took cash from boosters, then what really is there to say about your loyalty to Penn state.. At least the culture can be praised for teaching their followers blind allegiance...

I see you are unable to draw a distinction between an NCAA violation and a crime. So I will just allow you to ramble on without trying to argue with someone who doesn't have the basic understanding of this situation.

 

[StanleySpadowski]

One can only imagine the state of the world when an organization deems foul child molestation and the support of it as foul and worthy of punishment, it is seen by the general populace as insanity...

Also, I guess cheating and fair play isn't a moral issue? In fact, one can only imagine under what basis the NCAA rules were originally written if not from a moral basis...

Just because the NCAA has become hypocrites does not mean all their actions are wrong.

You seem to missing the point. Do you understand the role of the NCAA or have you read their by-laws?

The NCAA as much right sanctioning Penn State's football team for a criminal matter as the NAACP does of stripping Alabama of their MNC for racism of past coaches.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

All of the investigators, all of the investigations, found whatever they found and came to the conclusions that they did, dealt out the punishments that they did, .. and Penn St. never said a word, but just accepted it all.

You need to let that all sink in a bit.

Well, the Grand Jury didn't find all those things. As a matter of fact the main fall gay at Penn State (outside of the real criminals) was Paterno who THEY said didn't do anything wrong. Yet, he also was fired. Stripped of his wins and forced to live the last few months of his life wondering what the hell happened. And all without die process.

And you need to let the whole situation sink in. The entire score of the lemmings wanted to make their "I hate child molesters just as much as you" statement so they had enormous amounts of public pressure put on the board of trustees while it was in a state of flux and made a rash decision.

And that is why the NCAA is being sued because they levied punishment outside of their rules and guidelines just to satisfy the blood lust of the public who LOVES to see something great torn down. Just as you and others in this thread are displaying without even considering the facts.

Let THAT sink in.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

One can only imagine the state of the world when an organization deems foul child molestation and the support of it as foul and worthy of punishment, it is seen by the general populace as insanity...

Also, I guess cheating and fair play isn't a moral issue? In fact, one can only imagine under what basis the NCAA rules were originally written if not from a moral basis...

Just because the NCAA has become hypocrites does not mean all their actions are wrong.

Can you point to anybody in this thread who has supported child molestation? Because if you can point out the post. I for one would love to know who that is.
Thanks in advance.

 

[StanleySpadowski]

All of the investigators, all of the investigations, found whatever they found and came to the conclusions that they did, dealt out the punishments that they did, .. and Penn St. never said a word, but just accepted it all.

You need to let that all sink in a bit.

The NCAA never investigated, the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania investigated and have delayed any trials against any Penn State administrators because at this minute they'd lose.

So what investigations are you referring to other that the media firestorm?

 

[WV Cowboy]

Well, the Grand Jury didn't find all those things. As a matter of fact the main fall gay at Penn State (outside of the real criminals) was Paterno who THEY said didn't do anything wrong. Yet, he also was fired. Stripped of his wins and forced to live the last few months of his life wondering what the hell happened. And all without die process.

Why did all of that happen if he was totally not at fault? Why would they do that to a completely innocent man?

And you need to let the whole situation sink in. The entire score of the lemmings wanted to make their "I hate child molesters just as much as you" statement so they had enormous amounts of public pressure put on the board of trustees while it was in a state of flux and made a rash decision.

You seriously think that they punished Penn St. based solely on peer pressure?

And that is why the NCAA is being sued because they levied punishment outside of their rules and guidelines just to satisfy the blood lust of the public who LOVES to see something great torn down. Just as you and others in this thread are displaying without even considering the facts.

Let THAT sink in.

So you are thinking that Penn St. is completely innocent here? A victim themselves evidently? And were punished unjustly?

Nobody singled Penn St. out and said let's "tear them down."

They brought this all on themselves.

When the investigators came in, .. they didn't determine that "it was only Sandusky, and everybody else didn't know a thing."

No, they found a lot more than that, enough to bring down the hammer, a big hammer.

That was very revealing to me.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

Why did all of that happen if he was totally not at fault? Why would they do that to a completely innocent man?

The Grand jury didn't. Read it more closely.

You seriously think that they punished Penn St. based solely on peer pressure?

Yes because they had no business doing so.

So you are thinking that Penn St. is completely innocent here? A victim themselves evidently? And were punished unjustly?

The university, yes. The players, yes. The teachers, yes. The alumni, yes.

Nobody singled Penn St. out and said let's "tear them down."

Actually that's pretty much what happened every night on ESPN and every other news outlet.

They brought this all on themselves.

Ummm, no, Sandusky did by raping children. Schultz and Curley did by covering it up. Can you point to a teacher, or alumni or current player who did so?

When the investigators came in, .. they didn't determine that "it was only Sandusky, and everybody else didn't know a thing."

Right, the Freeh investigation indicated that Curley and Schultz and to a lesser extent Paterno were involved. Individuals, not an entire institution.

No, they found a lot more than that, enough to bring down the hammer, a big hammer.

That was very revealing to me.

They found NOTHING more than three individuals mentioned. And yet you condemn thousands of others for that.

 

[WV Cowboy]

They found NOTHING more than three individuals mentioned. And yet you condemn thousands of others for that.

I condem nobody. I have no clue who all was/is at fault.

I am only going on what I read happened.

Obviously I was not there, ever. I only know what I read. And honestly I have not read very jot and tittle on this.

But I just cannot believe that they randomly punished people without just cause, .. other than the colleteral damage which I tried to point out with my "completely and utterly absurd" analogy.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

I condem nobody. I have no clue who all was/is at fault.

I am only going on what I read happened.

Obviously I was not there, ever. I only know what I read. And honestly I have not read very jot and tittle on this.

But I just cannot believe that they randomly punished people without just cause, .. other than the colleteral damage which I tried to point out with my "completely and utterly absurd" analogy.

You can't believe they punish the collective for the acts of a few? Really? Have you read the news lately on gun control? Or even to the silly point of banning large sodas in NY because some people are fat? It's the world we live in today. Punish everyone and anyone and it will keep the faceless masses in line. The Penn State saga is an epic portrait of that very thing.

You punish the perpetrators and that is it. Not the collective.

 

[WV Cowboy]

You punish the perpetrators and that is it. Not the collective.

Perhaps if you are right, .. they will not have to pay the $60 million, they will get the wins back, they will put the statue back up, they will be eligible for bowls, .. etc, etc.

But it is hard to imagine that they went to those extremes without a reason.

 

[StanleySpadowski]

I condem nobody. I have no clue who all was/is at fault.

I am only going on what I read happened.

Obviously I was not there, ever. I only know what I read. And honestly I have not read very jot and tittle on this.

But I just cannot believe that they randomly punished people without just cause, .. other than the colleteral damage which I tried to point out with my "completely and utterly absurd" analogy.

That's the problem with the instant gratification of today's society. People were in an uproar, the NCAA, or more correctly Mark Emmert, knew that people would laud them for acting. The truth be damned. Now that the truth is slowly filtering out, no one cares, their mind's already been made up.

It's a fascinating tale of political corruption, a rush to judgment, an NCAA power play...everything from a former judge doing things a first year knows is unacceptable and breaking laws(see Cynthia Baldwin), a State AG delaying action until after his Governor election, railroading Sandusky (not referring to his guilt but his trial) to get it out of the headlines, news outlets sitting on the story until after an important victory, ESPN power brokers deciding the outcome before they knew any facts...

There's several studies that show people seldom change their opinions, regardless of new information. The media plays on this and can get away with anything. You seem to remember what you thought you read or heard but are having trouble pointing to specifics. That's not a slam on you but rather a damnation of everyone because we all do it.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

Perhaps if you are right, .. they will not have to pay the $60 million, they will get the wins back, they will put the statue back up, they will be eligible for bowls, .. etc, etc.

But it is hard to imagine that they went to those extremes without a reason.

I have no faith in the courts to do the right thing in anything any more.

 

[Cajuncowboy]

That's the problem with the instant gratification of today's society. People were in an uproar, the NCAA, or more correctly Mark Emmert, knew that people would laud them for acting. The truth be damned. Now that the truth is slowly filtering out, no one cares, their mind's already been made up.

It's a fascinating tale of political corruption, a rush to judgment, an NCAA power play...everything from a former judge doing things a first year knows is unacceptable and breaking laws(see Cynthia Baldwin), a State AG delaying action until after his Governor election, railroading Sandusky (not referring to his guilt but his trial) to get it out of the headlines, news outlets sitting on the story until after an important victory, ESPN power brokers deciding the outcome before they knew any facts...

There's several studies that show people seldom change their opinions, regardless of new information. The media plays on this and can get away with anything. You seem to remember what you thought you read or heard but are having trouble pointing to specifics. That's not a slam on you but rather a damnation of everyone because we all do it.

Well, there are people who still think O.J. is innocent, so there ya go.

 

[joseephuss]

Well, there are people who still think O.J. is innocent, so there ya go.

No, there isn't.