Peter King MMQB on Dallas draft weekend - Talks about the Paxton ,Ogbah and J.Smith situations

[TwoDeep3]

Listen, I am not trying to call people out. Or say I know better. I am wrong more than i am right about this team.

But sometimes, just sometimes, I think we all get into a position of over thinking it.

And that is what happened here for some.

I apologize if it looks like I was making fun or ridiculing your position of pre-draft. It's just all the tea leaves said this was a no brainer.

 

[Sydla]

Listen, I am not trying to call people out. Or say I know better. I am wrong more than i am right about this team.

But sometimes, just sometimes, I think we all get into a position of over thinking it.

And that is what happened here for some.

I apologize if it looks like I was making fun or ridiculing your position of pre-draft. It's just all the tea leaves said this was a no brainer.

It wasn't that you were making fun or ridiculing people's positions.

It was that you completely and utterly misrepresented the majority of the opinions against taking Elliott at 4.

 

[jjktkk]

Taking Floyd 6 overall would have been a disaster. Glad we stayed put and took Zeke. And I'm not worried about Lynch. He is a major project. Sure fire franchise QB's don't last until the end of round 1

Kurt Cousins, Russell Wilson, are two recent ones. Tom Brady, and our own Tony Romo, among others. Just a suggestion, but maybe add the word "usually" between 'QBs" and "don't".

 

[Yakuza Rich]

If all Jerry got was a 4th everyone would be *****ing about how he got hoodwinked again. On the value chart that is only getting half what he should.

And they would be idiots.

Getting the same guy and getting an extra pick is better than getting the same guy and getting nothing.





YR

 

[bsheeern]

What I find most interesting about that article, is that there is no mention of McCay or anyone else. Its all Stephen asking Jerry what do you want to do?

I also like the photo with Spaulding in the background. At least he is wearing a tie this year.

Because most of the Quoted talking was the Negotiation portion. McClay is not here to negotiated trades.

McClay is here to architect that draft board.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Disastrous isn't the word I'd use but I'm confused. I like the Elliott pick and see why they went that direction. If they could have moved back and gotten him then that was Jerry's bad. I also posted a quote the other day during the draft where we were trying to move to get one of the QBs and then someone else and Cleveland stuck it to us. Which makes me think Jerry is way too transparent in his plans. Think this happened with Paxton too considering Jerry was crestfallen afterward....according to King. My main issue isn't liking some of these guys we took but that it contradicts all we heard pre-draft. Elliott is "win now." Jaylon Smith is not "now." Dak Prescott is a project. A basketball player is a project. They could all be studs but they aren't win now. Throwing picks around to move up is not win now. I think our best situation post Elliott was to use our position and load the D...tackles and ends and at least have depth. But again, that's just me.

I believe in taking the BPA.

I think EE is a 'win now' player because I find it hard to believe that the scouts had him ranked higher than Ramsey. And from MMQB it sounds like the coaches liked EE better than Ramsey, but that may not have been the case with the scouts.

I just think that finding a caliber of Ramsey's talent in the draft isn't going to come around again while you could easily find a caliber of talent similar to EE. Hell, the Seahawks got Rawls in UDFA. We found Murray in the 3rd round. I think the scouts knew that and Ramsey was their guy. But Garrett and Marinelli really pushed for EE.

That's the thing with all of this...coaches are going to have a win now mentality and the scouts are going to have a long term mentality. The GM has to bridge that gap. Instead, Jerry goes with the coaches or the scouts and never really bridges the gap between the two.






YR

 

[jjktkk]

I believe in taking the BPA.

I think EE is a 'win now' player because I find it hard to believe that the scouts had him ranked higher than Ramsey. And from MMQB it sounds like the coaches liked EE better than Ramsey, but that may not have been the case with the scouts.

I just think that finding a caliber of Ramsey's talent in the draft isn't going to come around again while you could easily find a caliber of talent similar to EE. Hell, the Seahawks got Rawls in UDFA. We found Murray in the 3rd round. I think the scouts knew that and Ramsey was their guy. But Garrett and Marinelli really pushed for EE.

That's the thing with all of this...coaches are going to have a win now mentality and the scouts are going to have a long term mentality. The GM has to bridge that gap. Instead, Jerry goes with the coaches or the scouts and never really bridges the gap between the two.






YR

Ramsey might very well be a great player, but Ramsey's lack of ints had to be a concern with coaches, scouts etc. Dallas viewed Ramsey as a CB, but I can not recall in recent memory a great college CB prospect who had questions regarding his lack of ints and ball skills like Ramsey has.

 

[Oh_Canada]

A direct quote from the article.

I should never be surprised by the opinions on this board. Although there are some opinions that outright shock me. Hell, some of them are mine.

But the idea some brought to the table prior to the draft the Dallas running game wasn't the lynchpin to the success of 2014 was truly amazing. To the point for a brief moment I questioned what I knew. Yet there is no chance of getting away from the truth the running game benefited the passing game and the defense.

And after seeing all the players and coaches and GMs, and even what the team accepts as fact, I wonder where those folks are who put pencil to paper and did some statistical analysis to come away with an opinion contrary to not only what people in football were saying, but the most basic truth to what this game is about.

Moving the chains, staying ahead of third down, controlling the ball and clock, and protecting the defense, as most teams do.

Here it is, the way the team, along with most people associated with this game think about Elliott versus Ramsey. It's basic logic.

The point isn't that the running didn't help in '14, the point is you did it with a third rd back and the ufa that no one wanted last year ran for over 1000 yds in essentially eleven full games without the precense of Romo who by the way is THE most important cog make no mistake. No Romo= no playoffs Elliott or no Elliott.
For me it was Bosa or bust, so I was not heartbroken when they picked the rb, but I just don't feel any running back is worth a top four pick when you almost know you'll be looking for a new one in five to six years max.

 

[lkelly]

What I find most interesting about that article, is that there is no mention of McCay or anyone else. Its all Stephen asking Jerry what do you want to do?

I also like the photo with Spaulding in the background. At least he is wearing a tie this year.

He needed something to wipe the boogers on. He finally stopped eating them.

 

[JoeBoBBY]

The running game played a huge role, because for the first time, it allowed Romo to operate against defenses that were playing honest. But it wasn't Murray, it was the OL and a healthy Romo and Dez that were the key. The article quotes the team as saying what very few would argue with, that Elliott will be a significant upgrade over Murray.

Think about it. A significant upgrade over a RB who had well over 1,800 yards.

Were going to work that high class engine up-front and give them Mario Andretti as a driver. They will feed off the young buck.

And ohh by the way. Romo and Dez will be healthy. And Witten with all his experience and wisdom and leadership will be roaming around out there.....

The E-Train is getting fined tuned as we speak. Soon, everyone is going to want to jump on board. I pre-ordered my tickets, as soon as Goodell said Ezek....

 

[lkelly]

Those trumpeting the Jones strategy of "running the ball to improve the defense" need to consider Jones' 20 year track record of failure as a GM. Would you thump your chest that you had the brilliant idea of trading for WR Roy Williams just because Jones did it too?

A healthy Romo and HIS third down conversions to keep drives alive is what "helped" the defense in 2014. That same strategy also failed in the playoffs when they played against a great but hobbled QB who picked them apart.

 

[tyke1doe]

We don't lose Zeke.

Jerry wanted an extra 3rd, Baltimore was going to give up a 4th. I have no problem with this negotiation tactic because that's what negotiating is about...you go high and see if you can get that. They go low and see if you will budge on that.

But as MMQB explains...Baltimore never told Jerry they were going after Zeke if they moved up. SiriusXM reported the same thing...the Ravens wanted Ramsey or at least make sure they got Ronnie Stanley (they wanted Tunsil until the video came out).

It was *Jerry* that got into his own head of thinking that the Ravens would take Zeke. And he screwed the pooch because of it. Could have gotten the same guy with an extra 4th rounder and could have gotten Lynch.

And it shows that this idea that we would be giving up a 2nd, 3rd and 4th for Lynch is false. We just had to give up our 2nd and 3rd for Lynch and we get the deal done.

This is a disastrous draft.

YR

Seeing how we took an injured linebacker who may not play in the second and a rotational DT in Collins in the 3rd, we e should have given up the second and third for Lynch if we really wanted him that badly.

What's said to me is that the Ravens knew they needed pass rushers badly so they drafted three. The Seahawks knew they needed running backs so they drafted three.

We knew we needed edge rushers, and we draft one. We know we need interior lineman and we draft one - one who wasn't on most draft boards at three.

Once again, we seem like we strike gold with our first-round pick then we sleep through the rest of the draft.

And now we're once again taking refuge in "hoping" that our picks pan out.

 

[jjktkk]

The point isn't that the running didn't help in '14, the point is you did it with a third rd back and the ufa that no one wanted last year ran for over 1000 yds in essentially eleven full games without the precense of Romo who by the way is THE most important cog make no mistake. No Romo= no playoffs Elliott or no Elliott.
For me it was Bosa or bust, so I was not heartbroken when they picked the rb, but I just don't feel any running back is worth a top four pick when you almost know you'll be looking for a new one in five to six years max.

JMO, but after the QBs, there was no sure fire, can't miss prospect, sitting there at 4. Bosa had questions marks concerning if he could be a great DE, or just a solid DE. Ramsey, while a great physical talent, does have question marks concerning his lack of ball skills. Taking Elliot so high at 4 was a questionable pick for some, but he seemed the safest pick. Me personally, I wanted Dallas to trade down from 4.

 

[DenCWBY]

The running game played a huge role, because for the first time, it allowed Romo to operate against defenses that were playing honest. But it wasn't Murray, it was the OL and a healthy Romo and Dez that were the key. The article quotes the team as saying what very few would argue with, that Elliott will be a significant upgrade over Murray.

Think about it. A significant upgrade over a RB who had well over 1,800 yards.

There were a lot of good things that came together in 2014 that influenced our team. Dez (huge contract year), Beasely (under the radar), Williams (coming into his own). Romo was healthier and trusted the offensive line.
Most importantly we ran the hell out of the ball setting up our passing game leaving defenses on their heals with a new offensive philosophy.
If Romo stays healthy, this team has a chance.

 

[Oh_Canada]

JMO, but after the QBs, there was no sure fire, can't miss prospect, sitting there at 4. Bosa had questions marks concerning if he could be a great DE, or just a solid DE. Ramsey, while a great physical talent, does have question marks concerning his lack of ball skills. Taking Elliot so high at 4 was a questionable pick for some, but he seemed the safest pick. Me personally, I wanted Dallas to trade down from 4.

Agreed.

 

[JoeBoBBY]

The point isn't that the running didn't help in '14, the point is you did it with a third rd back and the ufa that no one wanted last year ran for over 1000 yds in essentially eleven full games without the precense of Romo who by the way is THE most important cog make no mistake. No Romo= no playoffs Elliott or no Elliott.
For me it was Bosa or bust, so I was not heartbroken when they picked the rb, but I just don't feel any running back is worth a top four pick when you almost know you'll be looking for a new one in five to six years max.

Who can predict any thing 5, 6 years down the road in the NFL? Anything, about any player?......................not much, I can tell you that right now.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Ramsey might very well be a great player, but Ramsey's lack of ints had to be a concern with coaches, scouts etc. Dallas viewed Ramsey as a CB, but I can not recall in recent memory a great college CB prospect who had questions regarding his lack of ints and ball skills like Ramsey has.

Antonio Cromartie played 4 years at FSU and had 5 INT's. In his 2nd season with the Chargers, he had 10 INT's. And making picks has never been a problem with his game.



YR

 

[NoLuv4Jerry]

It was widely viewed that Goff, Wentz and Lynch were the tier 1 QBs. Cook and Hackenberg were the tier 2 QBs and Prescott was among the tier 3 guys.

If you could get a tier 2 QB in the 4th...not too much of a shock that they might want him over the tier 3 guy. Not saying you were shocked...just putting things in perspective. Also remember...they did work cook out or have him in.

I think not getting Cook will be a mistake. I am not big on Prescott. He doesn't even seem like a Garrett QB. I almost think that if Prescott has to play...you will see the return of the game plan that calls for us to run, run, incompletion...punt...that we saw with Weeden...over and over and over.....

 

[tyke1doe]

Fantastic in what way? The fact that he totally misrepresented the opinion of a majority of posters who did not want Elliott at 4?

Did he misrepresent the opinion of a majority or did he highlight the opinion of a segment of our population here?

A healthy Romo and HIS third down conversions to keep drives alive is what "helped" the defense in 2014. That same strategy also failed in the playoffs when they played against a great but hobbled QB who picked them apart.

Using court lingo, "Defense Exhibit A."

 

[jjktkk]

Antonio Cromartie played 4 years at FSU and had 5 INT's. In his 2nd season with the Chargers, he had 10 INT's. And making picks has never been a problem with his game.



YR

But Cromartie was taken 19th overall in the 1st round. You can take a player with questions marks like that, picking at 19. But picking so high at 4, I would want more of a sure thing, less question marks, etc.