Pre-Snap motion through 4 weeks

[stilltheguru]

Yeah I hate those type of responses….there’s more then one issue.

It's only 1 issue. If I asked you before the year if Jordan Mason was an upgrade over what we have you'd say what? Let's stop the nonsense

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

It's only 1 issue. If I asked you before the year if Jordan Mason was an upgrade over what we have you'd say what? Let's stop the nonsense

I didn’t even know he was but at the very least I’d say trust the 49ers front office. Yes, we know he benefits off a great scheme and offense. He also has a good offensive live. Just curious why do you think he’s having the success he is?

 

[stilltheguru]

I didn’t even know he was but at the very least I’d say trust the 49ers front office. Yes, we know he benefits off a great scheme and offense. He also has a good offensive live. Just curious why do you think he’s having the success he is?

Scheme. Wth makes the niners line good? trent williams and what else? Karen Williams before last year what's so special about him? Rams oline good too?

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Scheme. Wth makes the niners line good? trent williams and what else? Karen Williams before last year what's so special about him? Rams oline good too?

So how the hell is it one issue and you just rattled off more than one lol?

Kyren is a beasts though. Everyone doesn’t have success with the Rams…Akers got cut because he couldn’t cut it.

 

[stilltheguru]

So how the hell is it one issue and you just rattled off more than one lol?

Kyren is a beasts though. Everyone doesn’t have success with the Rams…Akers got cut because he couldn’t cut it.

No the only issue is scheme. Akers 2022 2nd half of the season proved its scheme. Mcvay just liked Williams better. Neither are anything special

 

[thunderpimp91]

You’re only looking at the 1st column which is motion AT the snap. The total in the 2nd column tells the whole story. For instance Buffalo runs some type of motion on 66% and Baltimore is 61% of the plays where the Cowboys are 47%.
Maybe Washington is the outlier…also we’ll see on them, it’s still early. I would also say that having an extremely mobile QB can negate the need for some of the confusion pre-snap

Most of that motion isn't anything revolutionary though. Motioning your Y to the other side of the field or sending your RB out wide and bringing him in really wont confuse a defense. What does are these movements right before or during the snap that can catch a defense off guard and create open space.

Even so if we do go off just the motion column the Cowboys are using it on nearly half their plays which makes them pretty close to league average in the category. Factor in that two of their four games so far have been lopsided losses where they've had to play quicker on offense and they're probably a little higher. First game of the season was a blowout victory which may or may not have effected what the Cowboys wanted to put on tape.

I think there are some small things I would like to see more of from the Cowboys. I think some late motion to set up wham blocks, and some jet motion when you catch teams with a safety in the box would be nice to see more of and could help the run game, but overall I'm just not seeing much of an issue with motion. If you want to talk about some of the route concepts they are running I think that is a better argument for an outdated offense. Motion seems to be the flavor of the month right now, but typically in the NFL once you're trying to catch up with the trends its too late and defenses have caught on.

 

[thunderpimp91]

Is this what McCarthy has always done or does Dak not like motion? I guess it’s asking for a miracle to have anyone in the media ask

Good question. Based on the Jets numbers here it looks like Rodgers isn't that big on motion either. Some QBs seem to favor motion, some not as much and don't want defenders moving during the snap. Very possible that Dak is a QB who prefers more traditional motion instead of the at the snap motion. IDK much about Daks college offense, but since he has been in Dallas I dont think hes ever had an OC that asked him to do a high volume of motion.

 

[Chuck 54]

There was absolutely nothing wrong with this offense schematically last season. Even with poor run blocking, Pollard was a real threat. We used motion. We lined Lamb up everywhere. Receivers were schemed open most of the year.
The problem is not the scheme or the playcaller. The problem is a serious lack of talent on offense. Outside of Lamb, we do not have a single receiver who would start on any other team in the NFC East, much less the overall NFL. We don’t have a RB who would even get rotational carries, imo. And we take that lack of talent and plug them into an OL with an aging star, an avg RT still fighting to get back to form, a young stud at LG, and 2 rookies at the two most important positions on the OL.

How far below the CAP are we right now after resigning DAK and Lamb? It was never a money issue. Jerry is dreaming if he thinks two stars can get it done. We need threats everywhere. They don’t have to be stars, but a threat now and then is always a threat to the defense.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

No the only issue is scheme. Akers 2022 2nd half of the season proved its scheme. Mcvay just liked Williams better. Neither are anything special

He liked him better because he is better lol. You don’t notice this is the same scheme as last year? What’s the difference? The talent got worse.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

There was absolutely nothing wrong with this offense schematically last season. Even with poor run blocking, Pollard was a real threat. We used motion. We lined Lamb up everywhere. Receivers were schemed open most of the year.
The problem is not the scheme or the playcaller. The problem is a serious lack of talent on offense. Outside of Lamb, we do not have a single receiver who would start on any other team in the NFC East, much less the overall NFL. We don’t have a RB who would even get rotational carries, imo. And we take that lack of talent and plug them into an OL with an aging star, an avg RT still fighting to get back to form, a young stud at LG, and 2 rookies at the two most important positions on the OL.

How far below the CAP are we right now after resigning DAK and Lamb? It was never a money issue. Jerry is dreaming if he thinks two stars can get it done. We need threats everywhere. They don’t have to be stars, but a threat now and then is always a threat to the defense.

It’s just embarrassing how our competitors are built and how we are built. His idea is less is better and it’s a moronic logic.

 

[tm1119]

Most of that motion isn't anything revolutionary though. Motioning your Y to the other side of the field or sending your RB out wide and bringing him in really wont confuse a defense. What does are these movements right before or during the snap that can catch a defense off guard and create open space.

Even so if we do go off just the motion column the Cowboys are using it on nearly half their plays which makes them pretty close to league average in the category. Factor in that two of their four games so far have been lopsided losses where they've had to play quicker on offense and they're probably a little higher. First game of the season was a blowout victory which may or may not have effected what the Cowboys wanted to put on tape.

I think there are some small things I would like to see more of from the Cowboys. I think some late motion to set up wham blocks, and some jet motion when you catch teams with a safety in the box would be nice to see more of and could help the run game, but overall I'm just not seeing much of an issue with motion. If you want to talk about some of the route concepts they are running I think that is a better argument for an outdated offense. Motion seems to be the flavor of the month right now, but typically in the NFL once you're trying to catch up with the trends its too late and defenses have caught on.

Motion doesn’t have to be revolutionary or about confusion. A lot of time it is purely about gathering intel on what the D is doing. And I’m not saying not enough motion is THE problem with the offense, but it is 1 of several examples of how the scheme McCarthy/Schottenheimer is outdated and hurting the team.

Also not saying the Cowboys need to suddenly become the Dolphins, but of course there is a happy medium. Right now our offense relies on 3 things-
1. Ceedee being great
2. Ferguson finding room underneath the D
3. Tight window throws to below average WR’s

The coach and coordinator can do a lot to fix that, but unfortunately I’m not sure they are willing to change.

 

[tm1119]

There was absolutely nothing wrong with this offense schematically last season. Even with poor run blocking, Pollard was a real threat. We used motion. We lined Lamb up everywhere. Receivers were schemed open most of the year.
The problem is not the scheme or the playcaller. The problem is a serious lack of talent on offense. Outside of Lamb, we do not have a single receiver who would start on any other team in the NFC East, much less the overall NFL. We don’t have a RB who would even get rotational carries, imo. And we take that lack of talent and plug them into an OL with an aging star, an avg RT still fighting to get back to form, a young stud at LG, and 2 rookies at the two most important positions on the OL.

How far below the CAP are we right now after resigning DAK and Lamb? It was never a money issue. Jerry is dreaming if he thinks two stars can get it done. We need threats everywhere. They don’t have to be stars, but a threat now and then is always a threat to the defense.

1- Adapt or die. The league will adjust to you and if you can’t adapt to the adjustments you are going to fail. Thinking you can just do the same thing over from last year is never going to work

2- The coaching staff knew what they had and plenty of time to plan for it. I’m not arguing that the team should have more talent, but that doesn’t excuse a coach from putting the players they do have in the best possible position to succeed. When you don’t have great talent at WR running simple 10 yard routes every play certainly isn’t going to help that. Neither are telegraphed runs straight up the gut.

 

[stilltheguru]

He liked him better because he is better lol. You don’t notice this is the same scheme as last year? What’s the difference? The talent got worse.

Ok you got me.....the oline matters a little less. The running backs are a far far distant third. I was wrong to say it was only scheme.

 

[BermyStar]

ooh i agree with your assesment of MM's scheme so far but bringing KM back is not the answer..without KM the Beagles would start winning games...

If you think KM is the reason their losing you haven't been paying attention. Their problems started last year before Kellen ever arrived. And I am no KM fan.

 

[thunderpimp91]

Motion doesn’t have to be revolutionary or about confusion. A lot of time it is purely about gathering intel on what the D is doing. And I’m not saying not enough motion is THE problem with the offense, but it is 1 of several examples of how the scheme McCarthy/Schottenheimer is outdated and hurting the team.

Also not saying the Cowboys need to suddenly become the Dolphins, but of course there is a happy medium. Right now our offense relies on 3 things-
1. Ceedee being great
2. Ferguson finding room underneath the D
3. Tight window throws to below average WR’s

The coach and coordinator can do a lot to fix that, but unfortunately I’m not sure they are willing to change.

Agree with your three points, also agree that there are other examples of scheme that could be addressed. I'm staying pretty stubborn on the motion issue though haha....If we are just talking about standard motion to help diagnose a defense the Cowboys are already doing that at a pretty reasonable rate, and would likely be higher if not for half their games so far forcing them into a quicker pace where motion just isn't going to be an option as often. The area I think the Cowboys actually could benefit from more motion is going to be in the run game.

Just my opinion but in the pass game I simply think this is a limited offense with a shaky OL that depends on quicker routes. Dak hasnt used a lot of motion throughout his career so he may just not prefer it at this point for an offense based more on efficiency than explosive plays, and the analytics team is probably feeding McCarthy info that comeback routes have the highest separation rates.

 

[blueblood70]

I bet you weren't saying the same last year when the Chargers were sucking and our offense was humming along. So why say it now, only four games in?

I'm just pointing out that this is 2 years in a row now that Mike McCarthy has started the first quarter of the season doing this, I think all of us thought this office was gonna take the next step they would come out this year with the way we ended last year that it would be more pages and more plays they would learn more of the offense and it would be much more dynamic and it comes out and it's just as bad as last year this is the problem I'm saying at least more try to create and come up with better play calling like designing plays they may have been out there sometimes and some of them made no sense but Mike McCarthy is creating an offense that is so basic that our players are not benefiting from it they're not getting open the separation rates are not there we don't have a run game so now Prescott's gotta throw into such tight coverage it's ridiculous I'm surprised he doesn't have 10 interceptions already the man has had to be laser sharp on 80% of his passes just to get it into the catch zone..

I watch the 49ers and the Rams and some of these other teams the Vikings these players are so open it's not because they're more skilled it has everything to do with the scheme... This is a head scratcher This is why I say I'd rather have more back at least we knew what we were getting from him he would go like outside the box more than he wouldn't I'm not saying he's that much better but we moved on from him for this reason we thought Mike McCarthy could do more and he's not he's doing the running game is as bad or worse and his route trees you remember we used to talk about the depth the running too many of the same actual route trees for all three wide receivers at the same time at the same depth and they were causing issues in 2022 when calamari the interceptions for Prescott that's why receivers were happening to catch these balls in traffic and a lot of them were bouncing off them or or intercepted because they were such a small room for error and I'm saying it again I'm surprised Prescott doesn't have a **** ton of interceptions right now..

I mean I don't know who else is seeing this up in the front office but why they haven't or maybe they have I don't know 'cause I'm not in the building told this guy to open this **** up because you're not helping the team or were taking it away from you and giving it to schottenheimer and anybody could say they think schottenheimer would be worse I'd rather see it for myself I don't think it could get worse...

 

[coult44]

Yes, our pre-historic offensive scheme is holding the team back

Combined record of the top 10 teams on this list is 20-21 right now. I don’t necessarily like our offense right now, but pre snap motion doesn’t tell you crap!!!

Just so you know , the bottom 10 teams on this list are a combined 17-23. It a huge difference at all.

 

[BoysfanfromCanada]

to be honest last year the offense started off like this..now it got better as the year went on but kinda makes you wonder what is the lag in year 2?

Just laziness. It takes effort to make complicated plays, MM would rather use plays from before until someone complains (CeeDee last year vs SF and then played at a all pro level once he got the damn ball thrown his way)

 

[FanofJerry]

I mean...Dak cant draw up a better scheme? Or motivate his D3 talent level receivers?

What are we paying him for?

 

[CWR]

I'm just pointing out that this is 2 years in a row now that Mike McCarthy has started the first quarter of the season doing this, I think all of us thought this office was gonna take the next step they would come out this year with the way we ended last year that it would be more pages and more plays they would learn more of the offense and it would be much more dynamic and it comes out and it's just as bad as last year this is the problem I'm saying at least more try to create and come up with better play calling like designing plays they may have been out there sometimes and some of them made no sense but Mike McCarthy is creating an offense that is so basic that our players are not benefiting from it they're not getting open the separation rates are not there we don't have a run game so now Prescott's gotta throw into such tight coverage it's ridiculous I'm surprised he doesn't have 10 interceptions already the man has had to be laser sharp on 80% of his passes just to get it into the catch zone..

I watch the 49ers and the Rams and some of these other teams the Vikings these players are so open it's not because they're more skilled it has everything to do with the scheme... This is a head scratcher This is why I say I'd rather have more back at least we knew what we were getting from him he would go like outside the box more than he wouldn't I'm not saying he's that much better but we moved on from him for this reason we thought Mike McCarthy could do more and he's not he's doing the running game is as bad or worse and his route trees you remember we used to talk about the depth the running too many of the same actual route trees for all three wide receivers at the same time at the same depth and they were causing issues in 2022 when calamari the interceptions for Prescott that's why receivers were happening to catch these balls in traffic and a lot of them were bouncing off them or or intercepted because they were such a small room for error and I'm saying it again I'm surprised Prescott doesn't have a **** ton of interceptions right now..

I mean I don't know who else is seeing this up in the front office but why they haven't or maybe they have I don't know 'cause I'm not in the building told this guy to open this **** up because you're not helping the team or were taking it away from you and giving it to schottenheimer and anybody could say they think schottenheimer would be worse I'd rather see it for myself I don't think it could get worse...

Yeah, I can't disagree with that.

I do question how much of it is him being more conservative due to a young, inexperienced oline. In any event he's going to have to open it up and take some risks.