QBs rarely win Superbowls on extension expensive contracts

[CowboyFrog]

If we stink like I’m assuming you were getting at in the first post to me even he couldn’t mess that up. If he did it would at least be the guy most draft types and the like would say you should take. The players you mentioned were all further along in the first not top qb taken.

when he had a top pick he picked Zeke...again im for it but i think your settign yourself up for failure believing Jerry can do this..he literally had a QB who was broken and picked an RB..hell he almost lucked into it working with a 4th round flyer JG wanted...

 

[Flamma]

He was this season and the numbers prove it. Dak had more yards. TDs, and a higher completion percentage. Plus he had a higher passer rating and won more games. Stroud has more potential and if he continues to improve he will be better than Dak.

None of what you said matters. If you just go by stats taking nothing else into consideration, you'll be overpaying for some QB. Dak didn't play for Houston, and Stroud didn't play on Dallas. Put Mahomes on Carolina this year and they still don't make the playoffs. That doesn't make Dak better than Mahomes.

 

[KJJ]

None of what you said matters. If you just go by stats taking nothing else into consideration, you'll be overpaying for some QB. Dak didn't play for Houston, and Stroud didn't play on Dallas. Put Mahomes on Carolina this year and they still don't make the playoffs. That doesn't make Dak better than Mahomes.

If you read my post I said Dak had a better season than Stroud. He had better numbers, had more wins and was in the MVP race. It doesn’t matter who they play for. Stroud may end up being a better QB and he probably will but that wasn’t the discussion. It was about this season.

 

[CowboyFrog]

If you read my post I said Dak had a better season than Stroud. He had better numbers, had more wins and was in the MVP race. It doesn’t matter who they play for. Stroud may end up being a better QB and he probably will but that wasn’t the discussion. It was about this season.

yup again its crazy... Dak and CD decided to take a dive in the playoffs after what 8 good games are some crap like that...its unexplainable..

 

[Philmonroe]

when he had a top pick he picked Zeke...again im for it but i think your settign yourself up for failure believing Jerry can do this..he literally had a QB who was broken and picked an RB..hell he almost lucked into it working with a 4th round flyer JG wanted...

I don’t think I’m setting myself up for failure. He picked Zeke and that was a good pick for some years. What qb should he had got at that pick? Romo if not broken would’ve done nice with Zeke and nobody could predict Romo would go down in the preseason.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

You're ranting again. The bottom line is that in 3 consecutive years Dak, after leading the same team in a successful regular season, has failed ,due to his lack of composure, to lead the team at the crucial moment.
It doesn't really come down to contract, players around him, it's evident he has the mental make-up under pressure....AND this isn't the first year I've made this point to your good self.

So you liked the way parsons played the last two playoffs?

Doesn't mean dak didn't suck. He sure did. The forest you keep missing because of the trees is that there was more players and coaches that sucked.

If you think you replace Dak and we hoist Lombardi trophies then you really don't get football. And I can't help you there. Perhaps you want to buy a book from Amazon.

 

[CowboyoWales]

So you liked the way parsons played the last two playoffs?

Doesn't mean dak didn't suck. He sure did. The forest you keep missing because of the trees is that there was more players and coaches that sucked.

Dak, by the very position he plays, is held to greater account (win or lose). As you brought him up, which one Dak or Parsons had a greater affect upon the defeat, again it's Dak who couldn't get his offense to score until last drive of the first half. He gets the ball in his hand every offensive snap.

If you think you replace Dak and we hoist Lombardi trophies then you really don't get football. And I can't help you there. Perhaps you want to buy a book from Amazon.

I (we) dont know whether a replacement would win it all (with CAP redirected to improving the roster), what we are certain is that Dak's repeated inability to perform under play-off pressure indicates he'll never hoist a Lombardi.....so why pay him a higher CAP% (QED - lessen the roster) as it doesnt overcome his apparent fragile psyche.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Dak, by the very position he plays, is held to greater account (win or lose). As you brought him up, which one Dak or Parsons had a greater affect upon the defeat, again it's Dak who couldn't get his offense to score until last drive of the first half. He gets the ball in his hand every offensive snap.


I (we) dont know whether a replacement would win it all (with CAP redirected to improving the roster), what we are certain is that Dak's repeated inability to perform under play-off pressure indicates he'll never hoist a Lombardi.....so why pay him a higher CAP% (QED - lessen the roster) as it doesnt overcome his apparent fragile psyche.

I never said he was not held accountable, nor ever said it was less or more than anybody else.

where you are solely focused on one player and want to singluarly place all of the blame on one player. you are missing the forest because of the trees. there is more wrong with this team than Dak. but I know you. you are stubborn. you goal is to win an argument. your argument has been about Dak being the sole reason we lost. and you have spun that in many different forms. you still miss the point.

Cap is not the issue and has not been the issue in us building the team. that's a p!ss poor reason everyone keeps going to and no one has yet to say why the cap stopped us from building a team. nobody!

and Dak is what he is. average QB. some want to say he sucks and is worse than average, and the worst ever. so be it. does it matter? given you seemingly been a fan over the past 8 or 10 years. there is 28 years of failure under this GM. different cast. same results.

 

[Flamma]

If you read my post I said Dak had a better season than Stroud. He had better numbers, had more wins and was in the MVP race. It doesn’t matter who they play for. Stroud may end up being a better QB and he probably will but that wasn’t the discussion. It was about this season.

You were asked a simple question. Do you think Dak is better than Stroud? Not who had better stats. You provided the latter. You didn't answer the question properly, or you thought stats determines the better QB. He didn't ask who had the better season statistically.

 

[KJJ]

You were asked a simple question. Do you think Dak is better than Stroud? Not who had better stats. You provided the latter. You didn't answer the question properly, or you thought stats determines the better QB. He didn't ask who had the better season statistically.

I answered the question. Not my fault you can’t comprehend. This season Dak was better than Stroud. The stats point to who the better QB was. Like I said Dak had more yards, TDs, a higher completion percentage and a higher passer rating and he had more wins. The fact Dak was in the MVP race also points to him being the better QB. What makes you think Stroud is “currently” better than Dak? Because he was a top 5 pick that had a great rookie season? As good as his season was it wasn’t better than Dak’s. Eventually Stroud will be the better QB once he gains more experience but this season Dak was better.

 

[Flamma]

I answered the question. Not my fault you can’t comprehend. This season Dak was better than Stroud. The stats point to who the better QB was. Like I said Dak had more yards, TDs, a higher completion percentage and a higher passer rating and he had more wins. The fact Dak was in the MVP race also points to him being the better QB. What makes you think Stroud is “currently” better than Dak? Because he was a top 5 pick that had a great rookie season? As good as his season was it wasn’t better than Dak’s. Eventually Stroud will be the better QB once he gains more experience but this season Dak was better.

He didn't ask you who was better this season based on statistics. He could have looked that up himself. He just asked you who you thought was the better QB. Two different things. But I'll assume that's how you judge it.

I don't know that Stroud is better. I need more than one season. But a few things hint towards that he is. I'm not going to care about stats because they play on two different teams.

Houston was 3-13 last year. Enter Stroud, they're a 10-7 division winner. That suggests he's a difference maker. Dallas is more talented than Houston. That makes it a lot easier for Dak.

This is just speculation, but if Dak was Houston's QB last year, you think they go 10-7? I don't.

 

[KJJ]

He didn't ask you who was better this season based on statistics. He could have looked that up himself. He just asked you who you thought was the better QB. Two different things. But I'll assume that's how you judge it.

I don't know that Stroud is better. I need more than one season. But a few things hint towards that he is. I'm not going to care about stats because they play on two different teams.

Houston was 3-13 last year. Enter Stroud, they're a 10-7 division winner. That suggests he's a difference maker. Dallas is more talented than Houston. That makes it a lot easier for Dak.

This is just speculation, but if Dak was Houston's QB last year, you think they go 10-7? I don't.

You’re just wasting your time repeating yourself. I answered his question and detailed the reasons. Do you see him arguing? Lol No one knows what Houston’s record would have been with Dak. I do know know Stroud would have had a tough time winning 12 games with the Cowboys because Dak and CeeDee carried our offense this season. We would have never won 12 games with a QB only throwing 23 TDs with our lack of a running game and only one consistent WR.

 

[Buzzbait]

Great post. I think the key difference is that Mahomes had already shown that he could 'get it done' before he got his big extension and even that extension was (relatively) team friendly. All the talk from Chiefs was that Mahomes was reasonable in the negotiations and whilst it was a rich contract, it was not the richest in the league nor was it the potential market setting amount that others might have paid. I would also say that Mahomes on 17% is still less than the 20.4% hit that Dak will be next year... How you can justify paying Dak more than Mahomes is just beyond me. I literally do not understand how this is not ringing huge alarm bells in the front office.

So the options are the same two options you've always had.. a rookie deal QB OR a superstar truly elite Brady/Mahomes level on about 15% (ideally)

The rest is just trying to 'catch lightning in a bottle' and get lucky.

HUGE alarm bells! And not only in the front office but right here on CZ as well!

 

[CowboyoWales]

He didn't ask you who was better this season based on statistics. He could have looked that up himself. He just asked you who you thought was the better QB. Two different things. But I'll assume that's how you judge it.

I don't know that Stroud is better. I need more than one season. But a few things hint towards that he is. I'm not going to care about stats because they play on two different teams.

Houston was 3-13 last year. Enter Stroud, they're a 10-7 division winner. That suggests he's a difference maker. Dallas is more talented than Houston. That makes it a lot easier for Dak.

This is just speculation, but if Dak was Houston's QB last year, you think they go 10-7? I don't.

Yep, and it's not just the player its the $20m CAP we'd of had to spend, and not having to worry about Dak's $34m salary in 2025.

 

[CowboyoWales]

and Dak is what he is. average QB. some want to say he sucks and is worse than average, and the worst ever. so be it. does it matter? given you seemingly been a fan over the past 8 or 10 years. there is 28 years of failure under this GM. different cast. same results.

But part of the problem's Jerry's created is due to his loyalty and overpaying players he thinks are 'stars'.

Dak's apparent anxiety issues, in pressure moments, have resurfaced in the last three play-off loses, with a top paid extension (especially with the deferred bonus) we wont have the CAP to give him a team that will guarantee we can lead (or stop the opposition from scoring).

Play-offs + deficit = loss. Certainly defense isnt playing their part......but one of the reasons for that is the money afforded to Dak who certainly isnt doing his part......and he gets the ball in every offensive snap.

 

[Flamma]

You’re just wasting your time repeating yourself. I answered his question and detailed the reasons. Do you see him arguing? Lol No one knows what Houston’s record would have been with Dak. I do know know Stroud would have had a tough time winning 12 games with the Cowboys because Dak and CeeDee carried our offense this season. We would have never won 12 games with a QB only throwing 23 TDs with our lack of a running game and only one consistent WR.

Well that's the thing. I don't know that Stroud throws only 23 TDs on Dallas. Why? Because he's on HOUSTON!! Dak don't throw 36 TD passes on Carolina. That's why you can't go by stats alone because players deal with different talent.

Based on what Stroud did with the talent he had, there is no reason to believe he would not have had a good connection with Lamb. None what so ever. But we all know how good Dak looked before Cooper. He looked worse than Davis Mills on Houston.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

But part of the problem's Jerry's created is due to his loyalty and overpaying players he thinks are 'stars'.

Dak's apparent anxiety issues, in pressure moments, have resurfaced in the last three play-off loses, with a top paid extension (especially with the deferred bonus) we wont have the CAP to give him a team that will guarantee we can lead (or stop the opposition from scoring).

Play-offs + deficit = loss. Certainly defense isnt playing their part......but one of the reasons for that is the money afforded to Dak who certainly isnt doing his part......and he gets the ball in every offensive snap.

you tried to say this is a team problem, jerry problem, but couldn't help yourself and immediately pivoted to Dak and made him the source of all the problems.

again, and I have asked multiple times and you have avoided answering. We had 20M on the cap last year, 10M this year and didn't choose to sign anyone. how did it stop us from signing and building a defense through FA? which FA did you want to sign and we couldn't (didn't and couldn't are different). so lets say cap not a problem, which FAs would you sign to make this team elite!

Dak sucks. you have made that clear. I am not going to argue one way or the other. nobody has put forth any other QB solution including you, except for dsaying lets draf one and get the next mahomes. lets just draft the next mahomes. problem solved!!! let's dial 1-800-ELITE-QBS and order an elite QB. Problem solved. I have never argued against drafting a QB. in fact I have advocated for drafting a QB, in first 3 rounds every 3 or 4 years. continuously keeping the pipeline warm. always give yourself an option.

and Jerry handed Zeke a stupid contract. Lawrence got the most number of guaranteed years in a contract for NFL player ever!. we handed Steele a 84M contract. tagged Pollard for 10M. on and on and on and on. we don't have Dak cap problem. we have a Jerry cap management problem. we have a GM problem.

and again, the QB market is what it is. you can click your heels three times and wish you were back in Kansas, but this ain't the yellow brick road. 16 QBs make 30M AAV and more. 12 of them make 40M and more AAV. and you can't tell me they are all elite or good. the market is what it is. those numbers are about to go even higher and not because of Dak's contract.....

 

[Captain-Crash]

QBs rarely win Superbowls on extension expensive contracts. Well, dak is a different duck. He's only getting better.

 

[CowboyoWales]

you tried to say this is a team problem, jerry problem, but couldn't help yourself and immediately pivoted to Dak and made him the source of all the problems.

again, and I have asked multiple times and you have avoided answering. We had 20M on the cap last year, 10M this year and didn't choose to sign anyone. how did it stop us from signing and building a defense through FA? which FA did you want to sign and we couldn't (didn't and couldn't are different). so lets say cap not a problem, which FAs would you sign to make this team elite!

Dak sucks. you have made that clear. I am not going to argue one way or the other. nobody has put forth any other QB solution including you, except for dsaying lets draf one and get the next mahomes. lets just draft the next mahomes. problem solved!!! let's dial 1-800-ELITE-QBS and order an elite QB. Problem solved. I have never argued against drafting a QB. in fact I have advocated for drafting a QB, in first 3 rounds every 3 or 4 years. continuously keeping the pipeline warm. always give yourself an option.

and Jerry handed Zeke a stupid contract. Lawrence got the most number of guaranteed years in a contract for NFL player ever!. we handed Steele a 84M contract. tagged Pollard for 10M. on and on and on and on. we don't have Dak cap problem. we have a Jerry cap management problem. we have a GM problem.

and again, the QB market is what it is. you can click your heels three times and wish you were back in Kansas, but this ain't the yellow brick road. 16 QBs make 30M AAV and more. 12 of them make 40M and more AAV. and you can't tell me they are all elite or good. the market is what it is. those numbers are about to go even higher and not because of Dak's contract.....

No other 'QB solution' doesn't mean you keep throwing top market money at the option you see coming up short time and time again.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

No other 'QB solution' doesn't mean you keep throwing top market money at the option you see coming up short time and time again.

when did I say throw money? you keep going back to that line, because I am not sure if that's all you are trying to argue about.

lets get another QB. why not? who? where? how much? are they better? replacement is not the only goal. getting better is the goal. so lets get better.

and you still can't answer, who would you spend the "supposed" money we would have and how does it make the team better.

you are just complaining. you have one line of argument you want to stick to. I get it.