Random Offensive Line Thoughts

[casmith07]

I'm sitting here on a little break at work, and just thinking about our trench buildup on both sides of the ball.

I wanted to share this one random thought, and there's a substantial likelihood I'm 100% wrong:

I think that by the end of the year, our starting line, from left to right, will be Smith, Leary, Frederick, Bernadeau, Martin.

I just think at some point we're going to have to get Free off the field and get Berny back in the rotation. He was better than Doug Free all year last year and was the sole reason the right side of the line was not a sieve. Removing him and inserting Martin just puts a rookie there instead of a proven vet, and I think we'll see some rushers in Tony's face from the right side early this year when Free is exposed.

Now if we run the ball, I think we'll do just fine. The line looks to be the best run-blocking line in football this year.

What are your thoughts on the present and future state of our offensive line?

 

[noshame]

Free had a great 2011, signed a fat contract and promptly had a bad 2012, only to rebound last year and honestly did a solid job. In fact I would have rated his play last season in the top 20 of Tackles, maybe top 15. I don't get the hate, to coin a phrase.

 

[xwalker]

Free had a great 2011, signed a fat contract and promptly had a bad 2012, only to rebound last year and honestly did a solid job. In fact I would have rated his play last season in the top 20 of Tackles, maybe top 15. I don't get the hate, to coin a phrase.

I've spent more time reviewing Free from 2013 than any other player. He was not nearly as good as most people believe. They did things in the scheme to hide his problems in both pass pro and run blocking. It was brilliant coaching by Pollack and Callahan, but it made the job of the 3 interior guys more difficult because of how the scheme tweaks affected them.

 

[jazzcat22]

I've spent more time reviewing Free from 2013 than any other player. He was not nearly as good as most people believe. They did things in the scheme to hide his problems in both pass pro and run blocking. It was brilliant coaching by Pollack and Callahan, but it made the job of the 3 interior guys more difficult because of how the scheme tweaks affected them.

Do you think Martin, though being his rookie year, can do his assignments and help Free, just by being a better G than Bernadeau. And will this allow Fredrick, Leary and Smith do their assignments better and more naturally.

I know it will be a work in progress at first. But eventually Free will only get scheme help from Martin. Or do you think that is too much to ask or expect from Martin.

 

[xwalker]

I'm sitting here on a little break at work, and just thinking about our trench buildup on both sides of the ball.

I wanted to share this one random thought, and there's a substantial likelihood I'm 100% wrong:

I think that by the end of the year, our starting line, from left to right, will be Smith, Leary, Frederick, Bernadeau, Martin.

I just think at some point we're going to have to get Free off the field and get Berny back in the rotation. He was better than Doug Free all year last year and was the sole reason the right side of the line was not a sieve. Removing him and inserting Martin just puts a rookie there instead of a proven vet, and I think we'll see some rushers in Tony's face from the right side early this year when Free is exposed.

Now if we run the ball, I think we'll do just fine. The line looks to be the best run-blocking line in football this year.

What are your thoughts on the present and future state of our offensive line?

I would be surprised if that happened. If Free doesn't play well I think they would try Parnell or Weems there before Martin. OL coaches don't like to move players during the season, especially rookies.

The other issue is that I don't see Martin as a good fit as an NFL OT. Yes, he could probably do it, but I think he'll always be better at OG due to his lack of length.

I've said it before, but I believe that Parnell could be much better than Free with some experience. The problem is that his development is probably maxed out from just practicing. He would have to play in real games to get better and could make a few mistakes in the beginning. He was solid in 1 start at LT in 2012. He also play the majority of another game at LT and split series with Free at RT in the final 4 games. He was solid in all of them and his run blocking was better than Free's. Physically, he has everything that you want in an OT with size, long arms, excellent power and "punch" and very good athleticism. Unfortunately, he was injured for most of the 2013 preseason and never got a chance to unseat Free. I'm looking forward to seeing him in the preseason games.

Also, Weem is an interesting player. He appears to have the physical ability to play in the NFL but was raw in preseason last year. He is Broaddus pet cat and Broaddus claims that he has made big improvements during the season. They had to really like him because they kept him on the 53 man roster as an inactive developmental player for the entire season.

 

[speedkilz88]

Free's salary is guaranteed so it would be nice if they felt good enough about Parnell and Weems and found a sucker team with injuries to take him off our hands.

 

[burmafrd]

I would be surprised if that happened. If Free doesn't play well I think they would try Parnell or Weems there before Martin. OL coaches don't like to move players during the season, especially rookies.

The other issue is that I don't see Martin as a good fit as an NFL OT. Yes, he could probably do it, but I think he'll always be better at OG due to his lack of length.

I've said it before, but I believe that Parnell could be much better than Free with some experience. The problem is that his development is probably maxed out from just practicing. He would have to play in real games to get better and could make a few mistakes in the beginning. He was solid in 1 start at LT in 2012. He also play the majority of another game at LT and split series with Free at RT in the final 4 games. He was solid in all of them and his run blocking was better than Free's. Physically, he has everything that you want in an OT with size, long arms, excellent power and "punch" and very good athleticism. Unfortunately, he was injured for most of the 2013 preseason and never got a chance to unseat Free. I'm looking forward to seeing him in the preseason games.

Also, Weem is an interesting player. He appears to have the physical ability to play in the NFL but was raw in preseason last year. He is Broaddus pet cat and Broaddus claims that he has made big improvements during the season. They had to really like him because they kept him on the 53 man roster as an inactive developmental player for the entire season.

ABF

















ANYONE BUT FREE!!

 

[xwalker]

Do you think Martin, though being his rookie year, can do his assignments and help Free, just by being a better G than Bernadeau. And will this allow Fredrick, Leary and Smith do their assignments better and more naturally.

I know it will be a work in progress at first. But eventually Free will only get scheme help from Martin. Or do you think that is too much to ask or expect from Martin.

I'm concerned about Martin. He is changing both positions OT to OG and sides Left to Right. In addition to that, Bern's job was more difficult than normal because of how they had him helping Free. That adds up to a lot to put on Martin as a rookie. I don't know if he is as good in game 1 as Bern was in game 16 of last season. I'm sure by the end of the season he'll be really good, but he could struggle in the first few games. The other issue is that he was only 308 at the combine. There are some NFL OGs that play at that weight, but their technique has to be perfect. Leary and Bern are both 320+.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

I could not disagree more with your assessment that Bernie was better than Free last year. Bernie was dreadful in the beginning of the year. Waters had to come in and then when Waters got injured and Bernie came back he was much improved and quite effective. Still, not sure I would exactly trust Bernie at this juncture. Maybe Waters' influence helped him and maybe he just had to get healthy, but he hasn't proven to me by any means that he is a quality NFL starter. He might be in the end, but at this point...no.

Free played really well the first half of the season. He started to slip a bit, but it's hard to keep up that level of performance for the entire year. Still, he had some really fantastic games in the 2nd half.

I think we drafted Martin because he was simply the best player on the board. I think if we had Anthony Barr or Aaron Donald or Shazier, they get drafted instead of Martin. But, Martin was available and we could use a step-up at the guard spot and we do have to consider what we'll do at RT after this year.

I just don't think for a second that the Cowboys are all that high on Bernie and would not be surprised if they are higher on Leary in the end given that he was paid so much for a UDFA, they kept him around when Oakland tried to pick him up and started him last season.

I also think people are underrating how well Free played last season. Perhaps it's because some where overrating his performance and truth is that Tyron is galaxies better than Free. So, when the tide shifts one way, many fans go the opposite direction and it skews reality.






YR

 

[Yakuza Rich]

I'm concerned about Martin. He is changing both positions OT to OG and sides Left to Right. In addition to that, Bern's job was more difficult than normal because of how they had him helping Free. That adds up to a lot to put on Martin as a rookie. I don't know if he is as good in game 1 as Bern was in game 16 of last season. I'm sure by the end of the season he'll be really good, but he could struggle in the first few games. The other issue is that he was only 308 at the combine. There are some NFL OGs that play at that weight, but their technique has to be perfect. Leary and Bern are both 320+.

I think the change can be done in his rookie year and he can make that change rather seamlessly. I'm just not a big fan of changing positions in their career until they have basically reached their potential in that position.

I think that is what hurt us with Arkin. We went from position to position for him and even the switch from rG to LG and vice versa is enough to make for a bumpy transition. I think this also hurt Free, going from LT to RT to LT back to RT.





YR

 

[Doomsday101]

Myself I think the Cowboys have the making of an out standing OL I also see very good depth along the OL, this to me appears to be the best shape this unit has been in, in a long time

 

[xwalker]

I could not disagree more with your assessment that Bernie was better than Free last year. Bernie was dreadful in the beginning of the year. Waters had to come in and then when Waters got injured and Bernie came back he was much improved and quite effective. Still, not sure I would exactly trust Bernie at this juncture. Maybe Waters' influence helped him and maybe he just had to get healthy, but he hasn't proven to me by any means that he is a quality NFL starter. He might be in the end, but at this point...no.

Free played really well the first half of the season. He started to slip a bit, but it's hard to keep up that level of performance for the entire year. Still, he had some really fantastic games in the 2nd half.

I think we drafted Martin because he was simply the best player on the board. I think if we had Anthony Barr or Aaron Donald or Shazier, they get drafted instead of Martin. But, Martin was available and we could use a step-up at the guard spot and we do have to consider what we'll do at RT after this year.

I just don't think for a second that the Cowboys are all that high on Bernie and would not be surprised if they are higher on Leary in the end given that he was paid so much for a UDFA, they kept him around when Oakland tried to pick him up and started him last season.

I also think people are underrating how well Free played last season. Perhaps it's because some where overrating his performance and truth is that Tyron is galaxies better than Free. So, when the tide shifts one way, many fans go the opposite direction and it skews reality.

YR

Bern was injured coming out of training camp. I think he is a solid player when healthy, but you can't count on him staying healthy because he's only done it for about 8 games out of 32 since he's been here.

 

[AbeBeta]

I would be surprised if that happened. If Free doesn't play well I think they would try Parnell or Weems there before Martin. OL coaches don't like to move players during the season, especially rookies.

The other issue is that I don't see Martin as a good fit as an NFL OT. Yes, he could probably do it, but I think he'll always be better at OG due to his lack of length.

I've said it before, but I believe that Parnell could be much better than Free with some experience. The problem is that his development is probably maxed out from just practicing. He would have to play in real games to get better and could make a few mistakes in the beginning. He was solid in 1 start at LT in 2012. He also play the majority of another game at LT and split series with Free at RT in the final 4 games. He was solid in all of them and his run blocking was better than Free's. Physically, he has everything that you want in an OT with size, long arms, excellent power and "punch" and very good athleticism. Unfortunately, he was injured for most of the 2013 preseason and never got a chance to unseat Free. I'm looking forward to seeing him in the preseason games.

Also, Weem is an interesting player. He appears to have the physical ability to play in the NFL but was raw in preseason last year. He is Broaddus pet cat and Broaddus claims that he has made big improvements during the season. They had to really like him because they kept him on the 53 man roster as an inactive developmental player for the entire season.

Dead on about not moving guys around. Particularly a rookie

 

[xwalker]

Dead on about not moving guys around. Particularly a rookie

One guy that I'm concerned about them moving around too much is Crawford. It kinda of puts him in limbo not knowing if he is primarily a LDE or 3-tech DT. It's both a mental an physical question because he would probably want to keep his weight on the high side for DT and on the low side for LDE.

 

[erod]

I've spent more time reviewing Free from 2013 than any other player. He was not nearly as good as most people believe. They did things in the scheme to hide his problems in both pass pro and run blocking. It was brilliant coaching by Pollack and Callahan, but it made the job of the 3 interior guys more difficult because of how the scheme tweaks affected them.

I thought Free looked fine with Waters next to him, and lost without him. Perhaps Martin can provide that same effect.

I'm against moving Martin. The thought is he's a decent tackle, but an all pro guard in the NFL. Put him where he shines, just like Steve Hutchinson or Larry Allen.

 

[Zimmy Lives]

I thought Free looked fine with Waters next to him, and lost without him. Perhaps Martin can provide that same effect.

I'm against moving Martin. The thought is he's a decent tackle, but an all pro guard in the NFL. Put him where he shines, just like Steve Hutchinson or Larry Allen.

Agree with statement in bold. If Martin is the potential first-year Pro Bowler (at guard) everyone thinks he is then it makes sense to have him support Free from a position he would be most effective playing this year.

 

[AbeBeta]

One guy that I'm concerned about them moving around too much is Crawford. It kinda of puts him in limbo not knowing if he is primarily a LDE or 3-tech DT. It's both a mental an physical question because he would probably want to keep his weight on the high side for DT and on the low side for LDE.

I'm a bit less worried about the mental as Marinelli is pretty simple in what he does with the DL

 

[burmafrd]

I think the change can be done in his rookie year and he can make that change rather seamlessly. I'm just not a big fan of changing positions in their career until they have basically reached their potential in that position.

I think that is what hurt us with Arkin. We went from position to position for him and even the switch from rG to LG and vice versa is enough to make for a bumpy transition. I think this also hurt Free, going from LT to RT to LT back to RT.





YR

what hurt us was DRAFTING Arkin and then not willing to admit it was a mistake.

 

[burmafrd]

Bern was injured coming out of training camp. I think he is a solid player when healthy, but you can't count on him staying healthy because he's only done it for about 8 games out of 32 since he's been here.

Bernie's problem is being injured and being inconsistent; he was inconsistent even when Healthy; just like Free.

 

[AbeBeta]

I just don't think for a second that the Cowboys are all that high on Bernie and would not be surprised if they are higher on Leary in the end given that he was paid so much for a UDFA, they kept him around when Oakland tried to pick him up and started him last season.

Bernie took a pay cut to stay with the team. Of course, his base was obscene (at something like 3.5 mill). He agreed to cut down to about 3 mill spread over this year and next. However, I believe that as part of that deal he received $500,000 in the form of a roster bonus. I don't think that bonus guarantees his role here but it sure makes it a bit less likely that we cut him. I do think it is clear that we see him as a backup though.