RB debate continues, R Rice vs. Felix Jones

[03EBZ06]

Ray Rice will be a real good back on Sundays, .. whether for us or whoever.

Yup, I agree. I love watching RR run, he can break tackle, run around the corner and run through the middle. He also have enough of speed break big ones.

I don't have anything against F. Jones, but I much prefer RR.

 

[marchetta]

Highlight videos

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_1Z4uKtios&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qgYSTLIdLg0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8z8BgIsySk&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ck_5prAxNVY&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVlWPs8z1Ok

Thx for the vids! Just check out the 10 sec mark for an excellent example of the explosive lateral agility that RR has. This is what makes him stand out from EVERY RB in this draft. He can actually "slide" up and down the LOS from tackle to tackle w/o wasting motion or taking steps to redirect his momentum. It's as if he's wearing ice skates. He can move laterally in an instant, and he does so instinctively. He can "feel" the soft spots along the LOS, find the hole before it even appears, and slide to it while maintaining momentum and keeping his natural body lean and shoulders parallel to the LOS. This is something that can't be taught. This is what makes good backs great, and RR does it effortlessly and instinctively. This is one of the main attribute that Drew looks for in order to determine the impact a RB will have in the NFL, and this is why RR is his/my favorite RB in this draft.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_1Z4uKtios&feature=related

 

[btcutter]

Thx for the vids! Just check out the 10 sec mark for an excellent example of the explosive lateral agility that RR has. This is what makes him stand out from EVERY RB in this draft. He can actually "slide" up and down the LOS from tackle to tackle w/o wasting motion or taking steps to redirect his momentum. It's as if he's wearing ice skates. He can move laterally in an instant, and he does so instinctively. He can "feel" the soft spots along the LOS, find the hole before it even appears, and slide to it while maintaining momentum and keeping his natural body lean and shoulders parallel to the LOS. This is something that can't be taught. This is what makes good backs great, and RR does it effortlessly and instinctively. This is one of the main attribute that Drew looks for in order to determine the impact a RB will have in the NFL, and this is why RR is his/my favorite RB in this draft.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_1Z4uKtios&feature=related

sliding along the OL until he found a hole was a thing of beauty. I would be very happy with him in our back field.

I agree with "you just can't teach that". Occasionally some late bloomers develop that skill later but if he's available.....wow..no more running into the pile and stop.

He may not be superfast but he may end up leading the league in 10+ yd runs.

 

[marchetta]

I should mention one more thing, and Drew hit on this in his analysis. This is something that most people, including myself, overlook when watching RR run. If you look carefully at RR's runs, when he's juking and cutting, half the time he's not doing so to fake out a defender. No, he's doing it to put the defender in a position where his teammates can block them easier. Most RBs will just take the ball and run with it, but he's so intelligent, and disciplined, that he will make a conscious effort to juke defenders into positions where his teammates can block them w/o having to lunge/grab for them. Can you name me another RB in this draft that does this consistently(rhetorical)? None.

 

[marchetta]

...He may not be superfast but he may end up leading the league in 10+ yd runs.

Yeah, kind like... Emmitt.

 

[Nexx]

Highlight videos

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_1Z4uKtios&feature=relatedhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8z8BgIsySk&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVlWPs8z1Ok

watch the first ray rice run on this video. the vision and cut back ability without losing speed is amazing. julius in his wildest dreams couldnt pull that run off.

 

[AsthmaField]

watch the first ray rice run on this video. the vision and cut back ability without losing speed is amazing. julius in his wildest dreams couldnt pull that run off.

Yep, very true.

Rice is going to be a very good NFL back. I'd love to see him in Dallas.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

There are some very nice runs by Ray Rice to see on several sets of highlight packages.

But those are, afterall, highlight packages.

RR is a very nice back and, as I and some others have said, we wouldn't be unhappy with him. I just think there might be better options than him.

 

[marchetta]

watch the first ray rice run on this video. the vision and cut back ability without losing speed is amazing. julius in his wildest dreams couldnt pull that run off.

Wow! How's that for lateral agility and explosion!? That was just plain nasty! Thanx, I hadn't seen that run before.

 

[khiladi]

Does anybody have what Drew said on McFadden? I'm just curious...

 

[America's Team]

From reading this board, it seems that most think that F Jones would be a great complementary back to MBIII. And I think he would.

But who is the better overall RB?

Wouldn't you draft the best RB available, or do you draft the best complementary RB available?

I would tend to draft the best RB available.

very good point

 

[btcutter]

Yeah, kind like... Emmitt.

BP would say "hold your reservations for Canton".

I don't dare comparing him to Emmitt when he hasn't played a single down in NFL.
:
He may not look fast but he sure picks up a chuck at a time.

 

[marchetta]

Does anybody have what Drew said on McFadden? I'm just curious...

Darren McFadden RB Arkansas​

STRENGTHS
Darren has the size, strength, speed and instincts to be one of the best RB’s at the next level to ever play. He shows great change of speed and burst. He has the strength and balance to run both inside and outside the tackles. He looks to be a tough kid who can play nicked up and take the pounding at the next level. Darren has the athletic ability to make the players around him better. It looks like he has good hands when catching the ball out of the backfield, and is an excellent special teams player. Darren is worthy of being a top five pick in this draft and has the potential to be one of the better backs to ever play at the NFL level.

NEEDS TO IMPROVE
Fumbles, fumbles, fumbles! He must learn to protect the ball better or he will be a bust at the next level. He must learn to pass block to stay on the field as an every down player. Darren also must learn how to set up his blocks. Right now, he just outruns everyone. He also must mature on the field and off the field to become the player his talents suggest that he can become. I have no doubt that he will do just that.

TALENT BOARD ROUND 1
Darren has to learn to refine his overall game to become the Pro Bowl player that I know he can become. It’s the little things -- like setting up blocks, picking up blitzes, NOT FUMBLING, not trying to do everything all by himself, learning that every play does not have to be a big play, etc. These are the normal issues that a very talented college football player has to learn to be successful at the next level. It’s simple: it comes down to on-the-field football maturity! While Darren learns these things, he can be a weapon and a match-up nightmare on special teams. If Darren is used in his first year like Reggie Bush or Cadillac Williams by their respective NFL teams, he will impact right away. But Darren has something that both of those two players lacked coming into the NFL. Darren has the strength and ability to be a force as a RB in-between the tackles as well as outside the tackles. This makes him special. This makes his long range upside potential even greater than both those two players when they came into the NFL. Darren can carry the load, but to do so, he must learn to stay healthy. He must learn when running through the tackles to burst through the hole and then, at the second level, to run inside/outside so that when he is tackled, his body motion is going with the tackle and not against the tackle. All the great backs learned this early in their careers. Look at film of Curtis Martin, Emmitt Smith, Thurman Thomas and others and you will see that unless they were in the red zone, they ran through the tackles to the second level and then inside/outside so that their bodies would not take the full punishment of a tackle. Darren has immature RB football skills. A smart team will realize this and draft him knowing that Darren can impact right away without touching the ball that much and give him a chance to develop into a complete back. If Darren is put on the field as an every down back right now, the team that drafts him will run a big risk in Darren becoming a bust. He will continue to fumble and he will get injured because of his running style. I have seen some film of the great Gayle Sayers (RB Chicago Bears); Darren looks like a bigger, stronger version of him. I love this kid’s talent and I would draft him in a New York minute if I had the first pick in this draft!

- Drew Boylhart (thehuddlereport.com)

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Here is a write-up of a RB that may drop in the Draft, simply because this is a deep draft for RBs.

Maybe we look at this guy later on in Day 2 . . . .


Thomas Brown RB Georgia

STRENGTHS
Thomas is a fast, shifty, quick RB with good balance and strength. He is a strong blocker and plays bigger than his size because of his bulk and intelligence. Thomas reminds me a lot of Darren Sproles (RB San Diego Chargers). He has the strength and power to get the tough yards between the tackles as well as the speed to turn the corner. Thomas runs with excellent vision in the hole and if you don’t tackle him at the line of scrimmage, you run the risk of looking at his numbers all the way down the field as he scores a TD. He is a very underrated back who has good hands out of the backfield as well as down the field. Thomas will be able to help your offense at multiple positions with not a lot of touches and will impact for the team that drafts him right away.

NEEDS TO IMPROVE
Thomas will always have the injury issue question hung on him because of his size. All he has to do is stay injury free and he will shut those critics up real fast.

TALENT BOARD ROUND 2
Thomas is an impact player because of his unique size, speed, strength and athletic talents. He is a match-up nightmare, which is what makes him so valuable to the team that drafts him. He is too fast for the LB’s and Safeties and too strong for the CB’s. He is so quick between the tackles that DT’s will not be able to shed quickly enough to make a tackle. He is a little bit stronger when he runs the ball than Darren Sproles, but he’s not as strong as Maurice Jones Drew (RB Jacksonville Jaguars). Thomas will help a team the day after they draft him because of his multiple talents and his ability to play more than one position, which is all you can ask for when you draft a player. In this draft, with so many RB’s, it is very hard to say in what round Thomas will be drafted. I can tell you this, the team that drafts him will be very happy they did and the fans will be happier.

that's my boy!

mucho thanks for posting the write-up, it made my day

 

[khiladi]

Darren McFadden RB Arkansas​

STRENGTHS
Darren has the size, strength, speed and instincts to be one of the best RB’s at the next level to ever play. He shows great change of speed and burst. He has the strength and balance to run both inside and outside the tackles. He looks to be a tough kid who can play nicked up and take the pounding at the next level. Darren has the athletic ability to make the players around him better. It looks like he has good hands when catching the ball out of the backfield, and is an excellent special teams player. Darren is worthy of being a top five pick in this draft and has the potential to be one of the better backs to ever play at the NFL level.

NEEDS TO IMPROVE
Fumbles, fumbles, fumbles! He must learn to protect the ball better or he will be a bust at the next level. He must learn to pass block to stay on the field as an every down player. Darren also must learn how to set up his blocks. Right now, he just outruns everyone. He also must mature on the field and off the field to become the player his talents suggest that he can become. I have no doubt that he will do just that.

TALENT BOARD ROUND 1
Darren has to learn to refine his overall game to become the Pro Bowl player that I know he can become. It’s the little things -- like setting up blocks, picking up blitzes, NOT FUMBLING, not trying to do everything all by himself, learning that every play does not have to be a big play, etc. These are the normal issues that a very talented college football player has to learn to be successful at the next level. It’s simple: it comes down to on-the-field football maturity! While Darren learns these things, he can be a weapon and a match-up nightmare on special teams. If Darren is used in his first year like Reggie Bush or Cadillac Williams by their respective NFL teams, he will impact right away. But Darren has something that both of those two players lacked coming into the NFL. Darren has the strength and ability to be a force as a RB in-between the tackles as well as outside the tackles. This makes him special. This makes his long range upside potential even greater than both those two players when they came into the NFL. Darren can carry the load, but to do so, he must learn to stay healthy. He must learn when running through the tackles to burst through the hole and then, at the second level, to run inside/outside so that when he is tackled, his body motion is going with the tackle and not against the tackle. All the great backs learned this early in their careers. Look at film of Curtis Martin, Emmitt Smith, Thurman Thomas and others and you will see that unless they were in the red zone, they ran through the tackles to the second level and then inside/outside so that their bodies would not take the full punishment of a tackle. Darren has immature RB football skills. A smart team will realize this and draft him knowing that Darren can impact right away without touching the ball that much and give him a chance to develop into a complete back. If Darren is put on the field as an every down back right now, the team that drafts him will run a big risk in Darren becoming a bust. He will continue to fumble and he will get injured because of his running style. I have seen some film of the great Gayle Sayers (RB Chicago Bears); Darren looks like a bigger, stronger version of him. I love this kid’s talent and I would draft him in a New York minute if I had the first pick in this draft!

- Drew Boylhart (thehuddlereport.com)

Thanks man!

 

[Rack]

Yup, I agree. I love watching RR run, he can break tackle, run around the corner and run through the middle. He also have enough of speed break big ones.

I don't have anything against F. Jones, but I much prefer RR.

RR is the closest thing to an Emmitt Smith that's come out of the draft since, well, Emmitt Smith.

Very similiar body builds, virtually the same running style, and both solid in blitz pickup (Emmitt was one of the best ever at this).

That doesn't mean RR will have a similiar career as ES. It's one thing to run like that for 3-4 seasons, it takes a great one to do it for 10+ seasons.

If we got RR at #22 or #28 I'd be incredibly happy.

 

[marchetta]

RR is the closest thing to an Emmitt Smith that's come out of the draft since, well, Emmitt Smith.

Very similiar body builds, virtually the same running style, and both solid in blitz pickup (Emmitt was one of the best ever at this).

That doesn't mean RR will have a similiar career as ES. It's one thing to run like that for 3-4 seasons, it takes a great one to do it for 10+ seasons.

If we got RR at #22 or #28 I'd be incredibly happy.

I just left a chat room w/ Drew. He said that Ray Rice rates as a top 10 player in this draft, even though he won't be selected that high. He says that RR is a combination of Emmitt Smith and Thurman Thomas (2 Hall of Famers). Wow! Also, RR has what BP calls the perfect RB body type. He's ~5'10 ~200Lbs. He has huge thighs, like Emmitt and Barry, and not a lot of surface area to hit. Guys of his stature usually have longer careers than guys like DMac, because no one is tackling them by cutting them at the knees. They're just to short for defenders to dive at their legs, so most of their contact is from the waist up. This makes guys like this extremely durable.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I just left a chat room w/ Drew. He said that Ray Rice rates as a top 10 player in this draft, even though he won't be selected that high. He says that RR is a combination of Emmitt Smith and Thurman Thomas (2 Hall of Famers). Wow! Also, RR has what BP calls the perfect RB body type. He's ~5'10 ~200Lbs. He has huge thighs, like Emmitt and Barry, and not a lot of surface area to hit. Guys of his stature usually have longer careers than guys like DMac, because no one is tackling them by cutting them at the knees. They're just to short for defenders to dive at their legs, so most of their contact is from the waist up. This makes guys like this extremely durable.

Thats actually a good point. Being short for a running back has several advantages. hes going to be coming from behind 6 and a half foot tall widebodies and that makes it more difficult to see him coming for safties and linebackers. He will be a harder target to hit and hit well as tall defenders are going to have to get even lower to truly hit him square which translate the momentum down instead of into the defender. As a blocker this is an advatage as he automatically has leverage on taller defenders to drive them up and backwards. The downisde of course is that he is a smaller target on pass plays.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

a great center of gravity, w/ a huge lower body, combined w/ keeping your legs churning, and you have a hard back to stop

 

[Kobal]

a great center of gravity, w/ a huge lower body, combined w/ keeping your legs churning, and you have a hard back to stop

Unlike Julius. He loves his guns and running to the pile. :