Reason to believe in Kyle Kosier (sarcasm)

[wileedog]

I also think we are talking about two different things.

I think he had one of the top five performances of any corner LAST YEAR.

This is the quote I specifically responded to:

Certainly not.............I agree, but calling him the Best Cover Corner last year is pure homerism.

Yes, I am only talking about last year, as was Pompei.

And I've already said I think its too early to declare Newman one of the best in the league. But I strongly believe we could be saying it next January.

 

[Charles]

Conversely, when did his opinion mysteriously become something that is relevant?

Oh wait, when he ranks Newman the best and I agree with it. That's right.

Homerism 101 great post

 

[Vintage]

I also think we are talking about two different things.

I think he had one of the top five performances of any corner LAST YEAR.

That is what Pompei is ranking. And you could make a case with it being the best, statistically, if you believe in that gibberish.

But I am referring to those who suggest, right now, Newman is the best in the league. I would wait for consistent production to make that kind of statement. I don't see that as unreasonable in the least.

Which is what I said above....

And what I agree with wholeheatedly...

Newman played like a top tier corner last year.

Let's see him string it together with another season like that before we consider him the league's best (or whatever else you want too).

But let me say this...I think its going to be near impossible for Newman to follow up this season with an equal or better season.

Not bec. he doesn't have the talent...he does....its just hard not to give up any TD's for back to back seasons.

There might be a bit of a dropoff...

 

[ravidubey]

No, I feel like I'm fighting against a bunch of homers who have bought into the hype that gets shoveled for this team.

Ah the homer insult. Perfect for those who have no basis for argument, yet wish to sound smart and cool.

I dont care if you, or anyone else, agrees with me, but when people start calling Newman the best corner in football, or Drew Bledsoe a top 5 QB, or Kyle Kosier an upgrade over maybe the greatest lineman to ever live, I feel obligated to say something. This board is turning into Extremeskins, what with the blue and silver glasses that everyone seems to be sporting.

This is the kind of crap that makes me hate the written word. Who said Newman was the best corner in football? I remember posting that he was the best cover guy out there. His problem is his ratio of passes defended vs. passes intercepted is very high-- though he may have more passes defended than jsut about anyone he doesn't make QB's pay for throwing at him.

There's no such thing as a "top 5" anymore when it comes to QB's. There's Brady all by his lonesome, then a 1000 feet below him there's Manning, then miles below lives everyone else.


Roethlisburger makes plays with an excellent supporting cast but is a pedestrian passer at this point in his career. Bledsoe is an excellent passer but fails to make plays without a supporting cast. Hasselbeck is efficient but lacks any kind of killer instinct. McNabb makes plays with his arm and feet but gets flustered too easily and loses accuracy in big games.

As for Kosier being an upgrade- there's no question that over the next five years Kyle Kosier will be better than Larry Allen will be and at a fraction of the cost. The past means nothing when building a team for 2006. You're turning the signing of Kosier and fans' approval of Newman and Bledsoe into an excuse for an anti-homer soapbox stand. Total BS and unwillingness to read posts.

 

[Vintage]

Charles, I disagree with the "#5 pick" comment...

As a rookie, Newman played as well as you could hope for. Pro Bowl Alternative. Repeatedly left on an island....etc. Certainly worth the billing his rookie year.

2004- I agree, he didn't play like a #5 selection.

2005- He played like the #5 selection. His finest year in the league IMO. Certainly worth the billing.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

I don't think anyone has said that Newman is the best corner. Closest is ravidbuey saying he was the best cover corner last year. By the numbers, it is hard to argue that.

But being the best cover corner doesn't necessarily make you the best corner period.

We need to know what the rules are. if you go by numbers, Newman is right there. If you go by what you see, maybe someone else is better.

 

[wileedog]

Which is what I said above....

And what I agree with wholeheatedly...

Newman played like a top tier corner last year.

Let's see him string it together with another season like that before we consider him the league's best (or whatever else you want too).

But let me say this...I think its going to be near impossible for Newman to follow up this season with an equal or better season.

Not bec. he doesn't have the talent...he does....its just hard not to give up any TD's for back to back seasons.

There might be a bit of a dropoff...

Newman's problem is lack of picks. He hasn't had more than 4 in a season, and like DE's are judged by sacks CBs tend to be judged by picks.

He could literally give up 6 or 7 TDs this year, but if he gets 8 or 9 INTs to go with it he will actually get twice the media attention that he got this year. If he returns 2 of them for TDs he will be a lock for the Pro Bowl, even if he technically has an inferior season.

 

[Alexander]

I don't think anyone has said that Newman is the best corner.

Oh, I bet I could find a few.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

First, I have to question anyone that would put Daniel Craig as James Bond in his avatar. Any self respecting Bond fan just wouldn't do that.

So what are you insinuating

He isn't insinuating anything. He stated clearly that despite the fact that Delhomme passed for 260 yds it wasn't against Newman's man. And Smith wasn't booted until the second half if I remember correctly, so your post is bubkis.

For the 2005 season, Newman was among the best corners in the league. can we all agree on that?

For the three year period from 2003-2005, I think he might be in the top 10, certainly top 15.

 

[Vintage]

Newman's problem is lack of picks. He hasn't had more than 4 in a season, and like DE's are judged by sacks CBs tend to be judged by picks.

He could literally give up 6 or 7 TDs this year, but if he gets 8 or 9 INTs to go with it he will actually get twice the media attention that he got this year. If he returns 2 of them for TDs he will be a lock for the Pro Bowl, even if he technically has an inferior season.

I know...

But I don't care.

I'd rather Newman have the same exact season he just had than to get 6 picks, return 2 for TD's, and give up 6 TD's and make the Pro Bowl.

The Pro Bowl doesn't help us win games.

Production does.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

Oh, I bet I could find a few.

Are you talking this thread? Or elsewhere? Because the only best comment was that he was the best "cover corner" last year. Because there are other tasks that corners are asked to do, that wouldn't necessarily make him the best corner.

 

[wileedog]

I know...

But I don't care.

I'd rather Newman have the same exact season he just had than to get 6 picks, return 2 for TD's, and give up 6 TD's and make the Pro Bowl.

The Pro Bowl doesn't help us win games.

Production does.

Oh I agree wholeheartedly. Just pointing out why he hasn't gotten the media attention that other CBs get, and why he might not get the ranking he deserves when compared to other CBs by the 'experts'.

I'll take 2005 T-New for the rest of his career and be darned happy about it.

 

[Alexander]

Are you talking this thread? Or elsewhere? Because the only best comment was that he was the best "cover corner" last year. Because there are other tasks that corners are asked to do, that wouldn't necessarily make him the best corner.

Elsewhere.

 

[Charles]

This is the quote I specifically responded to:



Yes, I am only talking about last year, as was Pompei.

And I've already said I think its too early to declare Newman one of the best in the league. But I strongly believe we could be saying it next January.

I get it........ after the season was over, CNNSI, Dan Pompei and a couple of Dallas fans came to the conclusion that Newman was the best cover corner in the league

But during the season only two player got those type of accolades from the Head Coach. Anthony Henry and Demarcus Ware.

For a couple of games Parcells stated that Henry was the best defensive player on the team. I fail to see how Newman can be playing like the best cover corner in the League and not get similar accolades.

The best cover corner cannot go unnoticed for an entire season, then mysteriously CNNSI and Pompei crunch some stats and voila Newman is the best and the fans devour the fish wraps.

Newman had a very good year PERIOD!!!!

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

Is there any corner that you would trade him for straight up? Consider age and what they are asked to do in their given defense. For most people, I doubt there is more than 1-2 guys that they would take as a corner in our defense.

 

[Charles]

Charles, I disagree with the "#5 pick" comment...

As a rookie, Newman played as well as you could hope for. Pro Bowl Alternative. Repeatedly left on an island....etc. Certainly worth the billing his rookie year.

2004- I agree, he didn't play like a #5 selection.

2005- He played like the #5 selection. His finest year in the league IMO. Certainly worth the billing.

Thats cool, we can agree to disagree.

IMHO Newman hasn't been a game changer ala Roy Williams. He hasn't had a signature game, thats a shame considering he was also supposed to be a punt return phenom.

 

[wileedog]

I get it........ after the season was over, CNNSI, Dan Pompei and a couple of Dallas fans came to the conclusion that Newman was the best cover corner in the league

But during the season only two player got those type of accolades from the Head Coach. Anthony Henry and Demarcus Ware.

For a couple of games Parcells stated that Henry was the best defensive player on the team. I fail to see how Newman can be playing like the best cover corner in the League and not get similar accolades.

The best cover corner cannot go unnoticed for an entire season, then mysteriously CNNSI and Pompei crunch some stats and voila Newman is the best and the fans devour the fish wraps.

Newman had a very good year PERIOD!!!!

I see you are going with option A) Dan Pompei is a Cowboys Homer.

Be sure to shoot him an e-mail and let him know he needs to stop being so biased towards our players.

And give me a break with Parcells. How many guys has he praised up and down on this team a week before he cut them?

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

Henry is not a "cover corner" in the same sense of the word as Newman. Henry is physical and can match up with bigger guys. But Henry did answer the challenge. When teams avoided Newman, Henry did make them pay at times. But he also got lit up like a Christmas tree against Lloyd and SF. Or are you forgetting that? Maybe you will accept the tired legs argument.

And during the season, I don't think Ware ever got those accolades as a corner. LOL. But seriously, most of the time Parcells downplayed what Ware did and constantly said he had to improve.

I think if you took one player on the team and evaluated how well he played his position throughout the year, there would be no contest as to who it was.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

I hate to help his argument, but Pompeii is the one that picked Dallas to go to the Super Bowl in 2004. He is the one responsible for the jinx.

 

[Vintage]

Thats cool, we can agree to disagree.

IMHO Newman hasn't been a game changer ala Roy Williams. He hasn't had a signature game, thats a shame considering he was also supposed to be a punt return phenom.

Now, if you want to argue about game changing (i.e., interceptions), then you have something.

But what more could you have realistically asked for from a rookie corner than what Newman gave us?

2004, I conceded, he didn't play like a number 5 overall draft pick...

But last year, he did by playing excellent coverage.

Maybe he didn't have the flashes of game changing plays...but he did not give up game changing plays either. He covered his guy, defensed passes, and prevented conversions.