Recent downturn in OLine performance should be our biggest concern

[TheSkaven]

Let’s try a thread that isn’t Dak-focused.

By every reasonable statistic, this offensive line has been in decline since 2017. We’ve blamed Dak for holding the ball too long, Linehan for his lack of creativity, dearth of talent at WR, but the stats show that this comes back to the offensive line.

From 2014 to 2016 this was a dominant force up front. Even in 2015, the year ruined by Romo’s two brutal collarbone injuries, the team still ran for 4.63 yards per carry. That was before Zeke.

In 2016, Bryant went down injured and Dak and Zeke still killed it. They went 13-3.

2017 was OK until Tyron Smith got hurt and the dreaded Chaz Green experiment. And that’s when things have started to come undone.

There were 56 sacks given up in 2018, and even if you give a lot of them to Dak (unfair, but whatever), you can’t get past the poor play on the line.

1. Conner Williams was the biggest culprit. Undersized, he gave up the most sacks even though he didn’t play 16 games. He shouldn’t have been thrown into the fire so soon.

2. Collins gets a free pass here but his play was also really poor. I have to imagine that this is his last year here.

3. Obviously we were missing Fredbeard. Looney is the only starter who didn’t give up any sacks (Martin only gave up 2), but we miss Fredbeard’s adjustments and athleticism.

4. Tyron Smith was playing hurt again. He’s not getting any younger.

So to me, the team’s success in 2019 comes down to the offensive line. When they play well, this team wins a lot of games. When they don’t... well, you know.

And the Dallas Cowboys have more salary cap money invested in OL then any other team in the league.

In 2019..

- Frederick is back, but is he his old self
- Martin is a stud, no worry there.
- Collins is a worry, and he’s likely gone after this year. Can he be replaced a year early
- Will T.Smith stay injury free?
- Will Conner Williams’ bulk make him a better player?
- How willing Conner McGovern contribute?

Too many questions... this is my biggest worry going into training camp.

 

[noshame]

Here's you're answer:
The defense won't know the play.

 

[Rockport]

Let’s try a thread that isn’t Dak-focused.

By every reasonable statistic, this offensive line has been in decline since 2017. We’ve blamed Dak for holding the ball too long, Linehan for his lack of creativity, dearth of talent at WR, but the stats show that this comes back to the offensive line.

From 2014 to 2016 this was a dominant force up front. Even in 2015, the year ruined by Romo’s two brutal collarbone injuries, the team still ran for 4.63 yards per carry. That was before Zeke.

In 2016, Bryant went down injured and Dak and Zeke still killed it. They went 13-3.

2017 was OK until Tyron Smith got hurt and the dreaded Chaz Green experiment. And that’s when things have started to come undone.

There were 56 sacks given up in 2018, and even if you give a lot of them to Dak (unfair, but whatever), you can’t get past the poor play on the line.

1. Conner Williams was the biggest culprit. Undersized, he gave up the most sacks even though he didn’t play 16 games. He shouldn’t have been thrown into the fire so soon.

2. Collins gets a free pass here but his play was also really poor. I have to imagine that this is his last year here.

3. Obviously we were missing Fredbeard. Looney is the only starter who didn’t give up any sacks (Martin only gave up 2), but we miss Fredbeard’s adjustments and athleticism.

4. Tyron Smith was playing hurt again. He’s not getting any younger.

So to me, the team’s success in 2019 comes down to the offensive line. When they play well, this team wins a lot of games. When they don’t... well, you know.

And the Dallas Cowboys have more salary cap money invested in OL then any other team in the league.

In 2019..

- Frederick is back, but is he his old self
- Martin is a stud, no worry there.
- Collins is a worry, and he’s likely gone after this year. Can he be replaced a year early
- Will T.Smith stay injury free?
- Will Conner Williams’ bulk make him a better player?
- How willing Conner McGovern contribute?

Too many questions... this is my biggest worry going into training camp.

Valid concern but all the deficiencies can be traced solely to injuries. Losing Fred last year was a huge blow that affected the entire line. By all accounts he’s back to 100% strength. If he feels good once the pads come on, and the rest of the OL stay healthy, it will once again be a strength. Also, there’s more depth now than we’ve ever had before with Looney, Fleming and Su’s Filo.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Let’s try a thread that isn’t Dak-focused.

By every reasonable statistic, this offensive line has been in decline since 2017. We’ve blamed Dak for holding the ball too long, Linehan for his lack of creativity, dearth of talent at WR, but the stats show that this comes back to the offensive line.

From 2014 to 2016 this was a dominant force up front. Even in 2015, the year ruined by Romo’s two brutal collarbone injuries, the team still ran for 4.63 yards per carry. That was before Zeke.

In 2016, Bryant went down injured and Dak and Zeke still killed it. They went 13-3.

2017 was OK until Tyron Smith got hurt and the dreaded Chaz Green experiment. And that’s when things have started to come undone.

There were 56 sacks given up in 2018, and even if you give a lot of them to Dak (unfair, but whatever), you can’t get past the poor play on the line.

1. Conner Williams was the biggest culprit. Undersized, he gave up the most sacks even though he didn’t play 16 games. He shouldn’t have been thrown into the fire so soon.

2. Collins gets a free pass here but his play was also really poor. I have to imagine that this is his last year here.

3. Obviously we were missing Fredbeard. Looney is the only starter who didn’t give up any sacks (Martin only gave up 2), but we miss Fredbeard’s adjustments and athleticism.

4. Tyron Smith was playing hurt again. He’s not getting any younger.

So to me, the team’s success in 2019 comes down to the offensive line. When they play well, this team wins a lot of games. When they don’t... well, you know.

And the Dallas Cowboys have more salary cap money invested in OL then any other team in the league.

In 2019..

- Frederick is back, but is he his old self
- Martin is a stud, no worry there.
- Collins is a worry, and he’s likely gone after this year. Can he be replaced a year early
- Will T.Smith stay injury free?
- Will Conner Williams’ bulk make him a better player?
- How willing Conner McGovern contribute?

Too many questions... this is my biggest worry going into training camp.

What many don't understand is that some of the pressure and sacks where due to the horrid blocking of our young TE's. Garrett's horrid offense depends on lots of 2 and 3 TE sets. With Witten and Swain injured, there went our best two blocking TE's. So in steps a rookie and a practice squad TE and Rico. Only takes ONE breakdown on the line to give up pressure or a sack.

Then there was the run blocking. And although a little better than the pass blocking, still not close to what it was prior.

Smith also missed a few games as did Martin last year. Martin playing several games hurt.

The Oline clearly the #1 culprit in the downward spiral of the offense.

#2 I would say was the receiver by committee nonsense/lack of familiarity and discomfort of Dak

#3 predictable nature of the scheme and inability to adjust.

When you have an entire position group decimated like the TE, you HAVE to adjust your scheme.

 

[Melonfeud]

It's all still pretty iffy from my vantage point,I'm hoping the #72 splash lands back in a big way(but ain't holding my breath) and, if the guys remain relatively healthy/injury free, we gotta' lot to look forward to,,,but I'm keeping my fingers crossed just for luck, as having just one key starter go down& then the reshuffling/ next man up& in off the bench, "could" be the snowball to disaster on the season

 

[OmerV]

I disagree with the OP. I think the O-Line is looking up. That’s not to say all questions are answered, but that’s rarely the case before training camp in any season, even those that prove to be very good.

It appears Frederick will be back at or near full strength. That improves the center position and allows Looney to compete at LG with a bulked up Conner Williams and Su’a Filo, who proved to be a nice surprise last year. McGovern is pretty highly regarded and could fit into the picture as well. At least one of those should capably handle the position, with the others being great depth and insurance. Tyron Smith, while being a somewhat lesser player than his peak, is still an upper tier LT, and Fleming is good depth. And Collins, while clearly a lesser player than his All Pro cohorts along the O-Line, is not as bad as the OP makes him out to be. Sorry, but a team can’t have elite players at every position.

 

[Stash]

Let’s try a thread that isn’t Dak-focused.

By every reasonable statistic, this offensive line has been in decline since 2017. We’ve blamed Dak for holding the ball too long, Linehan for his lack of creativity, dearth of talent at WR, but the stats show that this comes back to the offensive line.

From 2014 to 2016 this was a dominant force up front. Even in 2015, the year ruined by Romo’s two brutal collarbone injuries, the team still ran for 4.63 yards per carry. That was before Zeke.

In 2016, Bryant went down injured and Dak and Zeke still killed it. They went 13-3.

2017 was OK until Tyron Smith got hurt and the dreaded Chaz Green experiment. And that’s when things have started to come undone.

There were 56 sacks given up in 2018, and even if you give a lot of them to Dak (unfair, but whatever), you can’t get past the poor play on the line.

1. Conner Williams was the biggest culprit. Undersized, he gave up the most sacks even though he didn’t play 16 games. He shouldn’t have been thrown into the fire so soon.

2. Collins gets a free pass here but his play was also really poor. I have to imagine that this is his last year here.

3. Obviously we were missing Fredbeard. Looney is the only starter who didn’t give up any sacks (Martin only gave up 2), but we miss Fredbeard’s adjustments and athleticism.

4. Tyron Smith was playing hurt again. He’s not getting any younger.

So to me, the team’s success in 2019 comes down to the offensive line. When they play well, this team wins a lot of games. When they don’t... well, you know.

And the Dallas Cowboys have more salary cap money invested in OL then any other team in the league.

In 2019..

- Frederick is back, but is he his old self
- Martin is a stud, no worry there.
- Collins is a worry, and he’s likely gone after this year. Can he be replaced a year early
- Will T.Smith stay injury free?
- Will Conner Williams’ bulk make him a better player?
- How willing Conner McGovern contribute?

Too many questions... this is my biggest worry going into training camp.

Rather than a "worry", they are among my biggest reasons for optimism this upcoming season. That optimism stems from the majority of the players past performances and knowing what they're capable of. As good as Looney played, he's no Frederick, and we missed that in the middle of the line. Williams rookie struggles are well know, but he looks to have come a long way in fixing his issues, only on-filed work will say for sure.

But I think if the group can remain relatively healthy, the results should be much improved.

I'd like to touch on something that you haven't, the offensive line coaching. I think there's been a noticeable dropoff the longer they've gotten away from Bill Callahan's departure. Things were good in 2015 and 2016, but in the years following, there looks to be a dropoff in coaching. 2018 was a particular mess, with the awful hire of Paul Alexander and his decision to fix what wasn't broken. Things have to be truly awful to fire a newly hired coach halfway through a season. But we'll likely never get the real story of how bad they were.

It truly bothers me that Garrett chose Alexander over Mike Solari. Solari ended up in Seattle and turned one of the worst lines in the league into the NFL's top rushing attack - in just his first season. Meanwhile, we fire the guy we just hired, that's an epic failure. And we ultimately give the job to the in-house candidate we had all along in Marc Colombo. I think the line showed some improvement after the switch and I only hope that Colombo gets better results the more he gets to work with these guys. Word is that he took things back to what they did best.

I do agree on one major thing however, the results have to drastically improve because this team has invested far too much in this line to be average.

 

[silvrNblue]

Solid agreement, and HAVE stated this very same thing in the past. BUT, the light shining down on us is this, take a look back to last season, no fredbeard for the whole season. Add in a rookie guard who was NOT ready for prime time and our 1st 8 games looked as if we were headed to a dumpster fire. BUT, then things started to turn around, the WR by committee went the way it should have, out the door and JJ brought in a solid damn fine top receiver in AC and our O started making plays, and we begin to gain ground in the win column. Enough so we finished off the seahags in a playoff game and went to the division game against the rams. One thing I WILL agree on, THAT rams game once again showed clapper and the walking vanilla queen OC had learned not a damn thing about adjusting, and not just that side, but our solid #5 D was run over like school yard ducklings, with NO adjustments to what the Rams were doing to them. Let us all hope JJ put the fear of God in clap and he simply does what he is SO good at, IE butt slapping and clapping along the side lines, and NEVER is allowed to input a damn thing into the play on the field. Cowboys have had a solid football team for the past 5 + years, we simply did NOT have leadership in the HC, OC and now it seems the DC positions. That being said, ole Rod is still there but, like most I'm hopeful the big decision making has been handed over to Richard. As is always the case, it's a wait and see process.......

 

[BigCatMonaco]

Let’s try a thread that isn’t Dak-focused.

By every reasonable statistic, this offensive line has been in decline since 2017. We’ve blamed Dak for holding the ball too long, Linehan for his lack of creativity, dearth of talent at WR, but the stats show that this comes back to the offensive line.

From 2014 to 2016 this was a dominant force up front. Even in 2015, the year ruined by Romo’s two brutal collarbone injuries, the team still ran for 4.63 yards per carry. That was before Zeke.

In 2016, Bryant went down injured and Dak and Zeke still killed it. They went 13-3.

2017 was OK until Tyron Smith got hurt and the dreaded Chaz Green experiment. And that’s when things have started to come undone.

There were 56 sacks given up in 2018, and even if you give a lot of them to Dak (unfair, but whatever), you can’t get past the poor play on the line.

1. Conner Williams was the biggest culprit. Undersized, he gave up the most sacks even though he didn’t play 16 games. He shouldn’t have been thrown into the fire so soon.

2. Collins gets a free pass here but his play was also really poor. I have to imagine that this is his last year here.

3. Obviously we were missing Fredbeard. Looney is the only starter who didn’t give up any sacks (Martin only gave up 2), but we miss Fredbeard’s adjustments and athleticism.

4. Tyron Smith was playing hurt again. He’s not getting any younger.

So to me, the team’s success in 2019 comes down to the offensive line. When they play well, this team wins a lot of games. When they don’t... well, you know.

And the Dallas Cowboys have more salary cap money invested in OL then any other team in the league.

In 2019..

- Frederick is back, but is he his old self
- Martin is a stud, no worry there.
- Collins is a worry, and he’s likely gone after this year. Can he be replaced a year early
- Will T.Smith stay injury free?
- Will Conner Williams’ bulk make him a better player?
- How willing Conner McGovern contribute?

Too many questions... this is my biggest worry going into training camp.

Tyron didn’t allow any sacks in 18 and only 15 pressures

 

[starfan1]

our issues recently are all inclusive. pathetic OC. Line problems. WR corps that didnt scare anyone and Dak holding ball too long. All those things played a role IMO

 

[John813]

Really curious how training camp goes for the OL.

Do we see McGovern or Williams at RT here and there?

I believe they'll start to address finding a better backup option for Smith next draft. I like Mitch Hyatt but think he's either a RT or guard if he makes it in the NFL.

I think Looney did an excellent job filling in, but maybe with Fredbread back, the line can be better prepared on pre-snap reads?

 

[baltcowboy]

Let’s try a thread that isn’t Dak-focused.

By every reasonable statistic, this offensive line has been in decline since 2017. We’ve blamed Dak for holding the ball too long, Linehan for his lack of creativity, dearth of talent at WR, but the stats show that this comes back to the offensive line.

From 2014 to 2016 this was a dominant force up front. Even in 2015, the year ruined by Romo’s two brutal collarbone injuries, the team still ran for 4.63 yards per carry. That was before Zeke.

In 2016, Bryant went down injured and Dak and Zeke still killed it. They went 13-3.

2017 was OK until Tyron Smith got hurt and the dreaded Chaz Green experiment. And that’s when things have started to come undone.

There were 56 sacks given up in 2018, and even if you give a lot of them to Dak (unfair, but whatever), you can’t get past the poor play on the line.

1. Conner Williams was the biggest culprit. Undersized, he gave up the most sacks even though he didn’t play 16 games. He shouldn’t have been thrown into the fire so soon.

2. Collins gets a free pass here but his play was also really poor. I have to imagine that this is his last year here.

3. Obviously we were missing Fredbeard. Looney is the only starter who didn’t give up any sacks (Martin only gave up 2), but we miss Fredbeard’s adjustments and athleticism.

4. Tyron Smith was playing hurt again. He’s not getting any younger.

So to me, the team’s success in 2019 comes down to the offensive line. When they play well, this team wins a lot of games. When they don’t... well, you know.

And the Dallas Cowboys have more salary cap money invested in OL then any other team in the league.

In 2019..

- Frederick is back, but is he his old self
- Martin is a stud, no worry there.
- Collins is a worry, and he’s likely gone after this year. Can he be replaced a year early
- Will T.Smith stay injury free?
- Will Conner Williams’ bulk make him a better player?
- How willing Conner McGovern contribute?

Too many questions... this is my biggest worry going into training camp.

Finally someone actually posting the real issue with the team last season. I will never forget the Colts game, when the interior of the offensive line was back ups. We had major injuries along the offensive line last year and at the end of the season Tyron was the healthiest. Fredbeard was the best center in the game and we lost him for the season in training camp. Nobody will ever give the team credit but we managed to make it the divisional round. It looks like we have good depth this year so we will see.

 

[Stash]

Really curious how training camp goes for the OL.

Do we see McGovern or Williams at RT here and there?

I believe they'll start to address finding a better backup option for Smith next draft. I like Mitch Hyatt but think he's either a RT or guard if he makes it in the NFL.

I think Looney did an excellent job filling in, but maybe with Fredbread back, the line can be better prepared on pre-snap reads?

I'd like to see McGovern get some snaps at left guard and Williams some work at right tackle, but McGovern's missed time with the lex strain may rule out any quick moves. I'd prefer to get a look at Williams at right tackle this year to next, but the team may have other plans.

 

[TexasHillbilly]

Our Oline is a tossup. We won't know anything until TC especially with Fredbeard. He is the core and the leader. Barring injuries, we should be pretty strong on the line on both sides of the ball. I think our biggest question is T Smith. Can he stay injury free? I doubt it from past history but we will see.

 

[Silly]

I disagree with the premise. Zeke was the #1 rusher in 2018. If the OL was so bad that would not have happened. I think what hurt the team was a combination of DAK, WRs, Coaching, and TEs. That combination stymied the team's red zone production.

 

[BigCatMonaco]

https://cowboyszone.com/threads/evaluating-all-56-sacks-the-cowboys-allowed-in-2018.434228/

 

[BigCatMonaco]

Tyron for his career averages 14.75 games played per regular season.

His contract in he next 5 years for 58 mil.

He allowed just over one pressure per game played last year and zero sacks.

 

[Stash]

Tyron for his career averages 14.75 games played per regular season.

This feels intentionally misleading.

 

[InTheZone]

O-line and receivers suddenly all have a down year, not buying it.

 

[Bullflop]

Tyron Smith had his share of difficulties last year but still managed to fare reasonably well, despite them. I'm somewhat encouraged by his claim to be in good health this year, although it's clearly too early yet to assume he'll be OK throughout the upcoming season. It remains to be seen if Connor Williams would be able to replace him if worse comes to worst. He's bigger and stronger in 2019, so there's reasoning to believe he can handle it.

Of course, if Williams is forced to move over to LT to relieve Tyron, Connor McGovern will be able to provide his talent to help at LG. Let's hope La'el Collins is able to put forth decent pass protection at RT while also keeping the injury bug at bay. If not, OT Cameron Fleming would be available to fill in adequately. As always, avoiding injury will be paramount for the ongoing success of our OL throughout the season. Our added backup depth should help.