CFZ Salary cap myths and other misunderstandings of player pay

[Bobhaze]

Since I don't listen to those buffoons, I will take your word for that. And, BTW, I consider that a very weak negotiating tactic, quite chicken poop!!!!

Overpaying your own keeps you from FA. Of course, the much bigger elephant in the room is that we absolutely suck at evaluating players. I mean, think of this:

Roy Williams(WR) was primarily a slant runner. Romo did not throw slants well. How did this make sense?
Brandon Carr was a #2 type CB. Didn't have the skillset to be a #1. How did paying him as a #1 make sense?
Cedric Thornton was a good rotational type 3 tech(Under Tackle). We signed him and immediately changed his position to NT.
Jaylon never got his lateral agility back. Why did we pay him huge?


Mistake after mistake after mistake due to very very poor player evaluations. That's why we don't sign FA's, we don't have anyone to evaluate them.

I wish someone would go ask Jerry why these guys failed. I bet he has no clue.

As @Hawkeye19 said earlier, if our roster building philosophy is “draft and develop”, after drafting and developing good players, why would we drag our feet when it comes to extending players performing at a high level? We already don’t spend money in FA, so why not spend it on the guys we have drafted and developed?

Lamb is a perfect example of a guy we drafted then developed into the leading receiver in the NFL last year, and now the team acts surprised that Cedee wants “top dollar” at the WR position? And doubly frustrating, we probably could have extended him at a lower price if the team had been more proactive instead of dragging their feet which they seem to do time after time.

Kev I agree with you that this FO has far too often overvalued their own talent and then overpaid them. That list is long - Tyrone Crawford, Jaylon Smith, Terrance Williams, Michael Gallup…and others. But Cedee Lamb? Why drag your feet on a guy like that?

 

[Hawkeye0202]

“Elite players should take less to help the team. NO!” Brandt says the call for players to take less money is ridiculous. It is the owner’s responsibility to make the cap work, not the players.

1000% ........I have read/heard this from many league insiders over the years. To me it's really simple........some GMs do an excellent job managing their cap/team and some don't.

I am really starting to attach the word(s) lazy/complacency.......to Jerry and Steven

 

[Bobhaze]

Is Mahomes being paid market value?

He certainly was when he signed his 10 year contract a few years ago. Now? No he‘s not. But that was a decision he and his agent made to make a long term commitment at the THEN market value. He’s not making market value now. But that happens to all top NFL players when they sign a 4-5 year deal too. The market rises every year,

 

[LittleD]

Dak and CeeDee are under contract for this season. CeeDee will be franchised next season just like a couple other Dallas players over the last 4 years. Dak will get his bank from
some other unsuspecting team. Dallas and Jerry will soldier on.

 

[kskboys]

what is a maxed out contract? this is not the NBA. or MLB

Another grey descriptive term among many grey descriptive terms being bandied about.

What is market value? This isn't the stock market.

 

[kskboys]

He certainly was when he signed his 10 year contract a few years ago. Now? No he‘s not. But that was a decision he and his agent made to make a long term commitment at the THEN market value. He’s not making market value now. But that happens to all top NFL players when they sign a 4-5 year deal too. The market rises every year,

Because Mahomes manned up and took a 10 year contract, realizing that 500 mil was all he'd ever need.

Market value in the case of NFL players is nothing more than a concept. Since players are not anywhere near equal, there's no such thing as market value.

 

[kskboys]

Why should Dallas Cowboys players not be able to sign for the most ever at their position?

Because that will keep us from winning a super bowl. If you are for players getting the most they can, then you are against winning a super bowl. If winning is not your thing and you're rooting strictly for the player's personal bank accounts, then that makes sense I guess.

 

[kskboys]

As @Hawkeye19 said earlier, if our roster building philosophy is “draft and develop”, after drafting and developing good players, why would we drag our feet when it comes to extending players performing at a high level? We already don’t spend money in FA, so why not spend it on the guys we have drafted and developed?

Lamb is a perfect example of a guy we drafted then developed into the leading receiver in the NFL last year, and now the team acts surprised that Cedee wants “top dollar” at the WR position? And doubly frustrating, we probably could have extended him at a lower price if the team had been more proactive instead of dragging their feet which they seem to do time after time.

Kev I agree with you that this FO has far too often overvalued their own talent and then overpaid them. That list is long - Tyrone Crawford, Jaylon Smith, Terrance Williams, Michael Gallup…and others. But Cedee Lamb? Why drag your feet on a guy like that?

Because if you pay the wrong positions, you're not winning a super bowl. Paying a WR 7% of the salary cap is not conducive to winning super bowls.

I do completely agree that Bozo and Laughingstock have no idea how to manage personnel in any way whatsoever. And now they're mismanaging Lamb. Paying him 35 mil/season is not the paved road to a super bowl.

 

[kskboys]

1000% ........I have read/heard this from many league insiders over the years. To me it's really simple........some GMs do an excellent job managing their cap/team and some don't.

I am really starting to attach the word(s) lazy/complacency.......to Jerry and Steven

They are very lazy. Jerry admitted he refuses to watch tape of possible draftees, but then wants a big part in who they take. Extremely lazy.

 

[Coogiguy03]

Because if you pay the wrong positions, you're not winning a super bowl. Paying a WR 7% of the salary cap is not conducive to winning super bowls.

I do completely agree that Bozo and Laughingstock have no idea how to manage personnel in any way whatsoever. And now they're mismanaging Lamb. Paying him 35 mil/season is not the paved road to a super bowl.

Listen to me, someone made a point that I just thought about. What happens let's say we sign all 3. You know how the contracts get structured: Year 1 cap hit, low example 4 million, year 2: 10 million, year 3: 43 million! What's going to happen when we have to pay all of these top players when their contracts have hit those high numbers????

 

[kskboys]

Listen to me, someone made a point that I just thought about. What happens let's say we sign all 3. You know how the contracts get structured: Year 1 cap hit, low example 4 million, year 2: 10 million, year 3: 43 million! What's going to happen when we have to pay all of these top players when their contracts have hit those high numbers????

4-13.

 

[Coogiguy03]

4-13.

yikes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[kskboys]

I see it this way:

Ever since the cap era has started it's all about timing and creating a window in which you take a shot at the title. You have to manage that window very carefully. But if done so, salaries don't matter as you basically cross-finance your talent pool. And this happens in waves. Once your window has closed you don't clinge yourself to dead freight. You start over by already projecting the contracts of the guys you wanna take into the next window and getting rid of everyone else. That means a couple of hunger years before you take your next shot.

Jerry just goes in a straight mediocre line instead of going in waves. The Jones boys are very bad at this. When they couldn't buy a great team anymore they missed the chance to hire someone who can play these tunes.

They never did buy a great team. What Jerry bought was the de facto GM in Jimmy Johnson who put that team together w/ wise trades, great drafting, and the Herschel robbery. Seriously, name one guy Jerry "bought" who was instrumental in those super bowl wins. Deion was "bought" for the 3rd one, but paying him was a huge factor in that super bowl team being torn down.

 

[CowboyoWales]

With all the big talk about contracts for Dak, Cedee Lamb, and at some point Micah Parsons, there is so much misunderstanding and myth about market value, ”greed”, etc. The biggest myth so often thrown about is that the players are greedy and if they would just take a “team friendly” deal (in and of itself also a myth) we could sign more players. That’s just not a fair assessment of what the cap is and how it works.

In 2023, Sports Illustrated published a good article by Andrew Brandt, a former Green Bay VP of player personnel who has negotiated numerous NFL contracts. The article is designed to separate fact from fiction regarding what the cap actually is and isn’t. The article is free - here’s the link: https://www.si.com/nfl/2023/05/17/nfl-business-football-explaining-salary-cap
It‘s a good read if you want to have a better view of how player salaries really impact the cap.

Just cherry picking a couple of key points from the SI article:

• “Cash is real money; the cap is simply accounting. Cash is what a player will actually receive in a contract. Cap is a mechanism of compliance, a way NFL teams account for a contract over the life of the deal.” What really matters in these player deals is the guaranteed amounts of cash and how long they can take to pay it out.
• “Elite players should take less to help the team. NO!” Brandt says the call for players to take less money is ridiculous. It is the owner’s responsibility to make the cap work, not the players.

One thought I’ve had for years: Whose job is it to manage the cap responsibly? Is it the players? Or the front office?

If our front office expects the players to help them manage the cap efficiently we are doomed. There are multiple NFL teams right now who are paying more stars at market value than the Cowboys and competing for championships.

The bickering over money at this point is silly. NFL stars are paid market value. Not a penny less. If you want them, you have to pay them market value. The Cowboys front office expecting their best players to take less than market value is crazy. If you want those players on your team, you pay them market value. If you don’t want to pay them market value, then you trade them or lose them in Free agency. That simple.

It's not about money, it's about years (and possibly, NTC). Don't worry Dak will get paid, it'll all depend on whether Jerry capitulates (as usual) and pays it.

 

[gtb1943]

He certainly was when he signed his 10 year contract a few years ago. Now? No he‘s not. But that was a decision he and his agent made to make a long term commitment at the THEN market value. He’s not making market value now. But that happens to all top NFL players when they sign a 4-5 year deal too. The market rises every year,

Mahomes and his agent; or Mahomes; understood that taking max money would in the end hurt him by not allowing the team all available avenues to keep competitive.
BUT this also showed trust on Mahomes part to the Chiefs that they WOULD do their best and so far they have lived up to that trust.
Can any Cowboys player believe that?

 

[Bobhaze]

Because if you pay the wrong positions, you're not winning a super bowl. Paying a WR 7% of the salary cap is not conducive to winning super bowls.

I do completely agree that Bozo and Laughingstock have no idea how to manage personnel in any way whatsoever. And now they're mismanaging Lamb. Paying him 35 mil/season is not the paved road to a super bowl.

Agree 100% on this. Having the highest paid WR is not the golden ticket to playoff success. What the Cowboys have failed to grasp is drafting and developing a top shelf DT that can stop the run AND pressure the QB is worth twice as much as a flashy WR. Jerry still thinks we won those 3 SBs solely because of the triplets.

 

[kskboys]

yikes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Can you name a team in last year's championship games/super bowl who had a top 5 paid WR? KC definitely does not, BALT does not, SF does not(Deebo: 3 yrs/71.55 mil), Lions do not. SF is currently fighting Aiyuk to not pay him top 5. Interesting to see how that works out.

 

[charron]

That's right it's up to the owners to manage the cap and let overpriced talent go but replace him with multiple talented players.

 

[kskboys]

Mahomes and his agent; or Mahomes; understood that taking max money would in the end hurt him by not allowing the team all available avenues to keep competitive.
BUT this also showed trust on Mahomes part to the Chiefs that they WOULD do their best and so far they have lived up to that trust.
Can any Cowboys player believe that?

Oh, absolutely not. If I were Dak, I'd want out of this olio.

 

[kskboys]

That's right it's up to the owners to manage the cap and let overpriced talent go but replace him with multiple talented players.

Yes, but add in overpriced positions. When you pay huge on a position, other positions will suffer. Unfortunately w/ Jerry that means paying CB's and WR's and DE's and going cheap at DT, where the game is really won.

Who's the last team who won a super bowl w/o great DT play?