News: Several Former Cowboys make pre-lim list of HOF Nominees

GimmeTheBall!

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Moose's chances of being voted into the HOF are about as good as your chances of winning a spelling bee. lol He would be an impossible sell because he didn't have the career numbers and it's all about numbers when it comes to RB's/FB's for HOF induction. He was a great blocking FB but that won't score him many points with the committee.

As for Walker he's 39th on the all-time rushing list and those aren't near HOF numbers. He was an excellent player but only rushed for over 1000 yards twice in his 13 year NFL career. He was a better college player than an NFL player and will best be remembered for the blockbuster trade with Minn in 89 that helped the Cowboys build a dynasty.

Them are interesting numbers for Herschell. You half convinced me that his chances are not so good.

As for Moose, few half appreciated his blocking more than me. Emmitt has that diamond to thank for many of his yards.

As for me winning a spelling bee, spelling is overrated. I am just content to be earnest, good looking and a genus at football analisis.
 

tyke1doe

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you my friend are....as they used to say in the 90's......buggin.....
haley was a monster for the boys....got 3 sb's with the boys.... (5 total I believe)
he was a game changer.... and left the niners with much tension, the reason why he came here if I'm not mistaken.

I think the story is he peed on teammates' cars (may have been a high-ranking 49er official too) so they had to cut him loose. He continued that strange behavior in Dallas. But the Cowboys brass didn't care as long as he helped them win Super Bowls. There's little doubt in my mind that his bizzare behavior, combined with his anti-social attitudes toward the media, is the reason he hasn't been inducted earlier. He'll get in. But like Michael Irvin, his off-field antics has made him wait a little longer.
 

Gameover

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I think the story is he peed on teammates' cars (may have been a high-ranking 49er official too) so they had to cut him loose. He continued that strange behavior in Dallas. But the Cowboys brass didn't care as long as he helped them win Super Bowls. There's little doubt in my mind that his bizzare behavior, combined with his anti-social attitudes toward the media, is the reason he hasn't been inducted earlier. He'll get in. But like Michael Irvin, his off-field antics has made him wait a little longer.

He(Haley) hasn't gotten in, because he's a borderline candidate. Irvin waited because his numbers didn't warrant first ballot inclusion. Why is this so hard for people to accept?

Irvin got in on his third ballot; only six other pass catchers in history have gotten in sooner!

Cris Carter got in on his sixth ballot. Reed wasn't even a fanalist his first year of eligibility. Tim Brown's waiting. Art Monk was on the ballot for ten years and never made it to the Yes or No final six vote.My opinion: When Mike got in, I do think some powerful people were pissed he swooped past Monk. Monk had never made to the Final 6, then boom he's a HOF. Even Peter King "reevaluated" Monk after the 2007 vote. JMO

James Lofton wasn't a finalist his first year of eligabilty. All these guys have better numbers than Michael, they've all had a longer wait, and Michael's the one being punished for off field behavior?

Do people research these things or do they just whine, when "their guy" doesn't get in? I believe third ballot is the proper spot for Michael!

A lil knowledge....http://www.footballperspective.com/2013-pro-football-hall-of-fame-class/
 

RonSpringsdaman20

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I think the story is he peed on teammates' cars (may have been a high-ranking 49er official too) so they had to cut him loose. He continued that strange behavior in Dallas. But the Cowboys brass didn't care as long as he helped them win Super Bowls. There's little doubt in my mind that his bizzare behavior, combined with his anti-social attitudes toward the media, is the reason he hasn't been inducted earlier. He'll get in. But like Michael Irvin, his off-field antics has made him wait a little longer.

Whaaaat!???!
crazy if that's true.....
 

joseephuss

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He(Haley) hasn't gotten in, because he's a borderline candidate. Irvin waited because his numbers didn't warrant first ballot inclusion. Why is this so hard for people to accept?

Irvin got in on his third ballot; only six other pass catchers in history have gotten in sooner!

Cris Carter got in on his sixth ballot. Reed wasn't even a fanalist his first year of eligibility. Tim Brown's waiting. Art Monk was on the ballot for ten years and never made it to the Yes or No final six vote.My opinion: When Mike got in, I do think some powerful people were pissed he swooped past Monk. Monk had never made to the Final 6, then boom he's a HOF. Even Peter King "reevaluated" Monk after the 2007 vote. JMO

James Lofton wasn't a finalist his first year of eligabilty. All these guys have better numbers than Michael, they've all had a longer wait, and Michael's the one being punished for off field behavior?

Do people research these things or do they just whine, when "their guy" doesn't get in? I believe third ballot is the proper spot for Michael!

A lil knowledge....http://www.footballperspective.com/2013-pro-football-hall-of-fame-class/

I don't agree that Irvin's numbers didn't warrant first ballot inclusion. His numbers at the time he retired were pretty darn good. He averaged 74.9 receiving yards per game, which ranked third behind Rice and Largent when he retired. He still ranks 9th all time in that category. That average went up in the playoffs to 82.2 yards per game. He raised his game to a higher level in the post-season over a lot of games. Look at many of the other receivers in the top twenty for yards per game. Their averages go down in the playoffs. It is because Irvin raised his game in the playoffs that Dallas was able to win Superbowls.

The receivers you mentioned Carter, Reed, Brown, Lofton and Monk combined for 3 Supebowl rings, which is the same amount that Irvin has. Monk has those 3 rings as a member of the Commanders, but remember he didn't play in the playoffs or Superbowl at the end of the 1982 season. He had no impact on those games since he was out injured. Irvin was a major impact in winning Superbowls and even in 1994 when Dallas lost the NFCC game.

Irvin had it all, the numbers, the impact, the championships. I thought that was the whole point of the HoF.
 

Gameover

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Keep in mind he didn't retire. He had a career ending injury that forces him out of the game early. There is a reason his numbers wre not higher. The reason he was a 3rd ballot HOFer was due to his off the field crap.

Proof of this?

He would've made it on second ballot had the class not had three first ballot hof in it.

Did his off field crap(your word) cost him a vote or two? Sure. It could've . Is it the sole reason he didn't make it until the third ballot? Nonsense.

Do you realize how many guys sit on that ballot and wait years to make it to the final 6 cut down? Do you realize Mike made it that far his first time as a finalist? And that's punishment for off field crap(your word)? If he didn't make the cut after the first vote to decide the "final 10", then you could talk about him being punished, but not when you make it to the final 6 yes or no vote on your first ballot. By letting him get that far but voting him down, that was the committee saying, youre a hof, just not a 1st ballot hof.
 

Gameover

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I don't agree that Irvin's numbers didn't warrant first ballot inclusion. His numbers at the time he retired were pretty darn good. He averaged 74.9 receiving yards per game, which ranked third behind Rice and Largent when he retired. He still ranks 9th all time in that category. That average went up in the playoffs to 82.2 yards per game. He raised his game to a higher level in the post-season over a lot of games. Look at many of the other receivers in the top twenty for yards per game. Their averages go down in the playoffs. It is because Irvin raised his game in the playoffs that Dallas was able to win Superbowls.

The receivers you mentioned Carter, Reed, Brown, Lofton and Monk combined for 3 Supebowl rings, which is the same amount that Irvin has. Monk has those 3 rings as a member of the Commanders, but remember he didn't play in the playoffs or Superbowl at the end of the 1982 season. He had no impact on those games since he was out injured. Irvin was a major impact in winning Superbowls and even in 1994 when Dallas lost the NFCC game.

Irvin had it all, the numbers, the impact, the championships. I thought that was the whole point of the HoF.

Not enough longevity, which I for got to bring up in the above post. You are right in your arguments tho.

Mike's ACL injury and 6 game suspension cost him 1st ballot inclusion. Cost him pretty much 2 1/2 years of his PRIME. Youre looking at 7 probwols and about 14,000 yards in just over 11 year stretch had it not been for the injuries and suspension. would've been one of the most dominate stretches by a pass catcher in history.
 

KJJ

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Proof of this?

He would've made it on second ballot had the class not had three first ballot hof in it.

Did his off field crap(your word) cost him a vote or two? Sure. It could've . Is it the sole reason he didn't make it until the third ballot? Nonsense.

Do you realize how many guys sit on that ballot and wait years to make it to the final 6 cut down? Do you realize Mike made it that far his first time as a finalist? And that's punishment for off field crap(your word)? If he didn't make the cut after the first vote to decide the "final 10", then you could talk about him being punished, but not when you make it to the final 6 yes or no vote on your first ballot. By letting him get that far but voting him down, that was the committee saying, youre a hof, just not a 1st ballot hof.

There's no proof Irvin was being snubbed by the HOF committee due to his off the field transgressions but many feel they played a role. No one from the committee would ever admit they didn't vote for a player due to their off the field issues or because they don't like a player but many feel it happens. Al Michaels said all it takes is one member of the committee to not like a player to keep them out of the HOF. Outside Cowboys Nation Irvin wasn't liked due to his rub it in your face personality. His drug and infidelity issues caused even more people to dislike him.

The image of him walking into a courtroom wearing a fur coat looking like a pimp rubbed even Cowboy fans the wrong way. A player has to be hated for a stadium full of fans to cheer as they lay injured on the field. Below is an article with Emmitt Smith blaming Irvin's off the field issues for him being snubbed by the HOF his first 2 years of eligibility.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2319306
 
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joseephuss

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Paul Zimmerman who was a Hall of Fame voter at one time, claimed that he spoke to other voters who had a bias against Michael Irvin.
 

KJJ

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Do you realize Mike made it that far his first time as a finalist? And that's punishment for off field crap(your word)? If he didn't make the cut after the first vote to decide the "final 10", then you could talk about him being punished, but not when you make it to the final 6 yes or no vote on your first ballot. By letting him get that far but voting him down, that was the committee saying, youre a hof, just not a 1st ballot hof.

For a player that's viewed as a first ballot Hall of Famer or at the very least a second ballot Hall of Famer it's a huge disappointment for that player to be snubbed and have to wait so it is punishment. Irvin said he cried when he didn't get in on the first ballot. If you don't think off the field issues or committee members not liking a player play a role in HOF snubs than why do you think Charles Haley has yet to be voted in?
 

Gameover

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For a player that's viewed as a first ballot Hall of Famer or at the very least a second ballot Hall of Famer it's a huge disappointment for that player to be snubbed and have to wait so it is punishment. Irvin said he cried when he didn't get in on the first ballot. If you don't think off the field issues or committee members not liking a player play a role in HOF snubs than why do you think Charles Haley has yet to be voted in?

Haley hasn't gotten in because he only had a hundred sacks, only 5 probowls, not a long enough period of dominance. Won 5 rings but who couldn't win with Montana, Rice, Craig(should be in), Aikman, Emmitt and Irvin etc. Just a few reasons
 

Gameover

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There's no proof Irvin was being snubbed by the HOF committee due to his off the field transgressions but many feel they played a role. No one from the committee would ever admit they didn't vote for a player due to their off the field issues or because they don't like a player but many feel it happens. Al Michaels said all it takes is one member of the committee to not like a player to keep them out of the HOF. Outside Cowboys Nation Irvin wasn't liked due to his rub it in your face personality. His drug and infidelity issues caused even more people to dislike him.

The image of him walking into a courtroom wearing a fur coat looking like a pimp rubbed even Cowboy fans the wrong way. A player has to be hated for a stadium full of fans to cheer as they lay injured on the field. Below is an article with Emmitt Smith blaming Irvin's off the field issues for him being snubbed by the HOF his first 2 years of eligibility.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2319306

Emmitt is just falling for the okie doke. People like swimming in the shallow waters, I like the deep end of the pool.I remember when Carter was snubbed early in the process, I believe it was the factor back(Hoge) who questioned was it his off field issues being used against him. No!!! Getting into the HOF is hard, especially for pass catchers. Do some research. Only six others have made it in sooner than Irvin. He was not punished. Did his persona cost him a vote or two? I'm sure it may have. Was there a committee wide conspiracy to assure he didn't make it on the first ballot? Please. People need to think sometimes.

Michael's second ballot, Reggie White, Aikman and Warren Moon were all first ballot Hof. And for a couple of years, the maximum allowed in per class was 6 w/ two seniors who automatically made it the final 6 Yes or No vote. That left one spot between Harry Carson, Thurman Thomas and Irvin. I believe the committee made a deal of, Carson's been waiting for years(and whinnying like the fans of players who don't make it) let's give him his day now, Michael and Thurman will have their day soon.
 

KJJ

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Haley hasn't gotten in because he only had a hundred sacks, only 5 probowls, not a long enough period of dominance. Won 5 rings but who couldn't win with Montana, Rice, Craig(should be in), Aikman, Emmitt and Irvin etc. Just a few reasons

Most feel Haley is being snubbed by the HOF due to his treatment of teammates and members of the media do a google and see for yourself. I haven't seen anyone using his number of sacks and Pro Bowls as the reason he's being kept out. The word "snubbed" keeps being used to describe Haley's omission and the word "snubbed" isn't used for players who don't have the numbers necessary to get voted in. The Pro Bowl is mostly a popularity contest with fans voting so you have to figure Haley got snubbed by the Pro Bowl voters a few times. I've heard some of the most respected and knowledgeable football people including John Madden say Haley should already be in the HOF.
 

Gameover

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Most feel Haley is being snubbed by the HOF due to his treatment of teammates and members of the media do a google and see for yourself. I haven't seen anyone using his number of sacks and Pro Bowls as the reason he's being kept out. The word "snubbed" keeps being used to describe Haley's omission and the word "snubbed" isn't used for players who don't have the numbers necessary to get voted in. The Pro Bowl is mostly a popularity contest with fans voting so you have to figure Haley got snubbed by the Pro Bowl voters a few times. I've heard some of the most respected and knowledgeable football people including John Madden say Haley should already be in the HOF.

Haley's a borderline candidate who has to wait his turn ala the Vikings old time dlineman who waited about 10-10 plus years. There will always be people who believe a certain player should be in, the committee decides who and when. I believe Roger Craig should be in and I bet there are respected people who agree. Haley will get in the next three years.
 

Gameover

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Paul Zimmerman who was a Hall of Fame voter at one time, claimed that he spoke to other voters who had a bias against Michael Irvin.

Zimmerman had a bias against Irvin's tv persona and he was pulling the committee into his on personal beef , when he said that. He also called them hatchet men when they voted down Harry Carson and Irvin in 2005. Speaking of Carson anybody think maybe he was voted down because he was teammates with LT and they punished him for that association? /sarcasm Taking a turn a being shallow on this issue like the rest of the public!
 

perrykemp

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Haley's a borderline candidate who has to wait his turn ala the Vikings old time dlineman who waited about 10-10 plus years. There will always be people who believe a certain player should be in, the committee decides who and when. I believe Roger Craig should be in and I bet there are respected people who agree. Haley will get in the next three years.

Unless it's strictly based on Superbowl appearances, how does Haley with his 100.5 sacks get in ahead of Kevin Greene and his 160 sacks?
 

KJJ

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Emmitt is just falling for the okie doke. People like swimming in the shallow waters, I like the deep end of the pool.I remember when Carter was snubbed early in the process, I believe it was the factor back(Hoge) who questioned was it his off field issues being used against him. No!!! Getting into the HOF is hard, especially for pass catchers. Do some research. Only six others have made it in sooner than Irvin. He was not punished. Did his persona cost him a vote or two? I'm sure it may have. Was there a committee wide conspiracy to assure he didn't make it on the first ballot? Please. People need to think sometimes.

Michael's second ballot, Reggie White, Aikman and Warren Moon were all first ballot Hof. And for a couple of years, the maximum allowed in per class was 6 w/ two seniors who automatically made it the final 6 Yes or No vote. That left one spot between Harry Carson, Thurman Thomas and Irvin. I believe the committee made a deal of, Carson's been waiting for years(and whinnying like the fans of players who don't make it) let's give him his day now, Michael and Thurman will have their day soon.

Find an article from someone who shares your opinion on Irvin and Haley's HOF omissions. You claim they didn't have the production to get in sooner and I'm not buying that. There's many besides Emmitt who think Irvin's off the field issues caused him to have to wait for enshrinement. You mentioned Irvin's regular season numbers but I doubt many if any of the pass catchers who got voted into the HOF ahead of him had the postseason numbers or contributed to the number of championships he did. During the postseason/SB Irvin produced 105 catches for 1319 yards and 8 TD's. That would be a Pro Bowl season for most WR's in todays pass happy league. In the Cowboys 92 SB win over Buffalo Irvin had 6 catches for 114 yards and 2 TD's.

During the postseason in 94 Irvin had 12 catches for 192 yards and 2 TD's vs SF with arguably the greatest cover corner in the history of the game Deion Sanders draped all over him. The week prior he had 6 catches for 111 yards vs GB. Irvin had 6 hundred yard games during the postseason. Postseason numbers and championships is what got Lynn Swann voted into the HOF or do you think it was his regular season numbers that finally got him the nod? Swann's postseason numbers weren't nearly as good as Irvin's. Swann put up 41 catches for 893 yards and 9 TD's during the postseason/SB. Say what you will but Irvin should have gotten voted in by at least his second year of eligibility.
 

KJJ

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Haley's a borderline candidate who has to wait his turn ala the Vikings old time dlineman who waited about 10-10 plus years. There will always be people who believe a certain player should be in, the committee decides who and when. I believe Roger Craig should be in and I bet there are respected people who agree. Haley will get in the next three years.

Find an article claiming Haley is a "borderline" HOF candidate. You're going to have a difficult time finding anyone who shares that opinion.
 
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