Video: Stephen Jones: Will Jaylon Play? Zeke Update

[Sydla]

I never said he had complete control over it. I said if he had won, he would have. His agreements, outside of the NFL, were worth much, much more. Instead, he had to share with the rest of the league. Jerry, according to the rules, was clearly wrong, but there is no question that Jerry lost. He could have made much, much more money on his own, rather then sharing with all of the other teams. I don't even think that's debatable.

The only reason he slapped the second lawsuit on the league was because the league tried to take his stadium deals from him. If the NFL had not tried to get those stadium deals as part of the revenue sharing, Jones never would have sued the NFL. It was all legal posturing. Jones wanted the league to back down from his stadium deals. In fact, prior to that, he had publicly stated he had planned to stay in the licensing agreement with the NFL through 2003.

In the end, Jones walked away with millions in sponsorships outside of the NFL revenue sharing plan and didn't have to give up anything additional to the league, and you call that a "loss".

You'd be hard pressed to find any sports finance expert who would claim Jones "lost" in 1995-96.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

That's some creative spin.

The only reason he slapped the second lawsuit on the league was because the league tried to take his stadium deals from him. If the NFL had not tried to get those stadium deals as part of the revenue sharing, Jones never would have sued the NFL. It was all legal posturing.

In the end, Jones walked away with millions in sponsorships outside of the NFL revenue sharing plan and didn't have to give up anything additional to the league, and you call that a "loss".

You'd be hard pressed to find any sports finance expert who would claim Jones "lost" in 1995-96.

OK.

Look, I never said what you claim and you can go back and read for yourself. Jerry was trying to write his own deals and he was trying to create his own Network and he was strying to market Cowboys stuff on his own, outside of the NFL. He was trying to do all of those things.

I'm not saying Jerry hasn't made money but what I am saying is that he didn't win. He had to give up the Network, he had to share revenue on all of the Cowboys apparel and all the rest.

The discussion here is what Jerry might or might not do with the NFL. Well, I guess we'll see but if Jerry does sue the NFL, there is no guarantee he will win and it will most certainly cost him more if he does it,then it will if he doesn't, assuming a 4 game suspension at the beginning of the season.

 

[dogunwo]

Personal conduct. This is always about image and marketing. It's almost never about what a player is actually doing. I mean, you know this. This is about money and it doesn't matter if folks think it's fair or not. This is a player that represents millions and millions of dollars to the NFL. For all we know, they want to send a message to him. They want him to understand that he needs to get his crap together.

I think they are going to suspend him.

I will not be surprised at all if he gets suspended. I am just curious to know how they will justify it. They can't come out publicly with the reasons you gave.

 

[Sydla]

OK.

Look, I never said what you claim and you can go back and read for yourself. Jerry was trying to write his own deals and he was trying to create his own Network and he was strying to market Cowboys stuff on his own, outside of the NFL. He was trying to do all of those things.

I'm not saying Jerry hasn't made money but what I am saying is that he didn't win. He had to give up the Network, he had to share revenue on all of the Cowboys apparel and all the rest.

The discussion here is what Jerry might or might not do with the NFL. Well, I guess we'll see but if Jerry does sue the NFL, there is no guarantee he will win and it will most certainly cost him more if he does it,then it will if he doesn't, assuming a 4 game suspension at the beginning of the season.

He already was sharing merchandising revenue on Cowboys apparel. He didn't give up anything that wasn't already given to the league. In fact, at that time, Jones made it clear he was going to stay in the NFL properties licensing agreement through 2003 but at that point would want to dissolve the agreement (he knew he couldn't dissolve the agreement in 95-96, which is why he went around the league and cut deals for Texas Stadium).

His countersuit wasn't to try to get out of the NFL Properties agreement altogether. It was simply a legal tactic to try to cut off the NFL's $300 million dollar lawsuit trying to take away his stadium deals.

So any notion that he "lost" in 1995-96 is pretty outrageous. In fact, that whole situation is mentioned as one of the reasons that he revolutionized the way NFL does business and why he's now sitting in the Hall of Fame.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

And the basis for this statement is?

People like to bring up the salary cap issue but there was a logical reason why the Cowboys and Skins backed off.

I never said this has anything to do with Cap. You are the only one who said this. I said it would be costly and it would be. The money associated with the suspension would be a drop in the bucket in comparison to what it might cost in terms of litigation.

 

[Sydla]

I never said this has anything to do with Cap. You are the only one who said this. I said it would be costly and it would be. The money associated with the suspension would be a drop in the bucket in comparison to what it might cost in terms of litigation.

I never said you said it had anything to do with the Cap. I said "people", not you. I mentioned the cap because that's the reason most people believe shows that Jerry will just cave to the NFL. I was curious if you were going down that line of thinking.

You overestimate the cost of litigation. Further, this isn't going to be about dollar signs. If the Cowboys feel Elliott is wrongfully suspended and that could have an effect on their season, they most certainly could and potentially would push this issue regardless of the cost.

The fact that both Jerry and Stephen have been so vocal about this situation and even going as far as claiming they have seen nothing that should lead to a suspension should indicate to you that they aren't exactly leaning towards letting the league just smack them on the rump again.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I will not be surprised at all if he gets suspended. I am just curious to know how they will justify it. They can't come out publicly with the reasons you gave.

I think they would just lean on personal conduct clause, to be honest. The NFL does have it's own investigative assets so they may have their own proof, outside of what the Authorities have shared. Who knows and in reality, doesn't even matter. The NFL has the power and you know they will use it if it suits them. JMO

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I never said you said it had anything to do with the Cap. I said "people", not you. I mentioned the cap because that's the reason most people believe shows that Jerry will just cave to the NFL. I was curious if you were going down that line of thinking.

You overestimate the cost of litigation. Further, this isn't going to be about dollar signs. If the Cowboys feel Elliott is wrongfully suspended and that could have an affect on their season, they most certainly could and potentially would push this issue regardless of the cost.

Fair enough. I guess I would ask, why comment on that at all? It has nothing to do with the discussion at hand. Perhaps you should just post that comment towards whomever you intended it for.

 

[Jarv]

I never said he had complete control over it. I said if he had won, he would have. His agreements, outside of the NFL, were worth much, much more. Instead, he had to share with the rest of the league. Jerry, according to the rules, was clearly wrong, but there is no question that Jerry lost. He could have made much, much more money on his own, rather then sharing with all of the other teams. I don't even think that's debatable.

Never liked a statement that ends with "I don't even think that's debatable."

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I never said you said it had anything to do with the Cap. I said "people", not you. I mentioned the cap because that's the reason most people believe shows that Jerry will just cave to the NFL. I was curious if you were going down that line of thinking.

You overestimate the cost of litigation. Further, this isn't going to be about dollar signs. If the Cowboys feel Elliott is wrongfully suspended and that could have an effect on their season, they most certainly could and potentially would push this issue regardless of the cost.

The fact that both Jerry and Stephen have been so vocal about this situation and even going as far as claiming they have seen nothing that should lead to a suspension should indicate to you that they aren't exactly leaning towards letting the league just smack them on the rump again.

LOL..... No, I don't. It would be costly and that fact that you say this, tells me a great deal here.

Jerry says a lot of things. It doesn't mean he is or is not going to do any of them. So, as I said before, I don't see them doing anything for four games. They may appeal but they are not going to take this to the mat IMO.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Never liked a statement that ends with "I don't even think that's debatable."

Well, feel free to debate it then.

 

[Sydla]

Fair enough. I guess I would ask, why comment on that at all? It has nothing to do with the discussion at hand. Perhaps you should just post that comment towards whomever you intended it for.

I posted that comment as a reference point. When one says the Jones will pretty much do what the league says, the example most often given is the cap fiasco. So I brought it up so see if you would agree with that reference.

 

[Sydla]

LOL..... No, I don't. It would be costly and that fact that you say this, tells me a great deal here.

Jerry says a lot of things. It doesn't mean he is or is not going to do any of them. So, as I said before, I don't see them doing anything for four games. They may appeal but they are not going to take this to the mat IMO.

Costly in what sense? We are talking about a billion dollar organization here. You don't think that Jones would spend a million dollars fighting for a player's rights, especially one that would have widespread implications down the road for the Cowboys and the league? He's already taken on the league over marijuana much to the chagrin of other owners and some in the league office, granted that hasn't cost him any money.

You don't believe Jones would spend some money to protect a current and potential future players?

I think he would.

And in the end, if the Cowboys sue the league, it's probably just legal posturing to see if the NFL will jump, especially if the punishment is heavy handed. The Cowboys could simply be using a lawsuit as a tactic to get the NFL to negotiate down any penalty they hand down.

 

[Jarv]

I will not be surprised at all if he gets suspended. I am just curious to know how they will justify it. They can't come out publicly with the reasons you gave.

Agreed Dog, the DV issue is dead unless there's evidence we haven't heard about or seen. If they want him suspended, they'll make up some BS that is detrimental to the league.

To circle back to the salary cap penalty and why Jerry just accepted it. I had heard at one point that because of the "gentlemen's" agreement, the other owners would be so pissed, he could forget about ever hosting a future superbowl.

This case is different and is against league management, not the owners. So he will throw down on this, or so he says and I hope he does. Mostly because of the difference in the way Brown (NYG) and Bell (Steelers) vs. Gregory have been treated in comparison.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

He already was sharing merchandising revenue on Cowboys apparel. He didn't give up anything that wasn't already given to the league. In fact, at that time, Jones made it clear he was going to stay in the NFL properties licensing agreement through 2003 but at that point would want to dissolve the agreement (he knew he couldn't dissolve the agreement in 95-96, which is why he went around the league and cut deals for Texas Stadium).

His countersuit wasn't to try to get out of the NFL Properties agreement altogether. It was simply a legal tactic to try to cut off the NFL's $300 million dollar lawsuit trying to take away his stadium deals.

So any notion that he "lost" in 1995-96 is pretty outrageous. In fact, that whole situation is mentioned as one of the reasons that he revolutionized the way NFL does business and why he's now sitting in the Hall of Fame.

Yes he was, but he was trying to sign a deal where by he would be exclusive with one of the Department Store chains and I believe he was trying to keep revenue on sales inside the Stadium or Cowboy owned stores. Like the Cowboys Stores you see in malls all over the place. That was all supposed to be Jerry's but instead, he shares it with the rest of the league. It's been a long time so I can not remember all of the details exactly but yeah, he was trying to do a side deal on Merchandising so yes, he did give up those exclusives and the profits from sales. He did give up all exclusive rights to Cowboys Network and media.

He did lose a considerable amount of money and he lost even more in futures. The whole hall of fame thing may paint it a certain way but there is no question that Jerry lost a lot on that deal. He lost because he did not have support of the rest of the league.

If Jerry fights this thing and he has no support from the rest of the league, it's going to be both expensive and extensive. I don't think he will win but we will see.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Costly in what sense? We are talking about a billion dollar organization here. You don't think that Jones would spend a million dollars fighting for a player's rights, especially one that would have widespread implications down the road for the Cowboys and the league? He's already taken on the league over marijuana much to the chagrin of other owners and some in the league office, granted that hasn't cost him any money.

You don't believe Jones would spend some money to protect a current and potential future players?

I think he would.

And in the end, if the Cowboys sue the league, it's probably just legal posturing to see if the NFL will jump, especially if the punishment is heavy handed. The Cowboys could simply be using a lawsuit as a tactic to get the NFL to negotiate down any penalty they hand down.

An you don't think that the rest of the league would fight it as well? The league are all the rest of the owners. You think that's going to bode well for Jerry? The next time Jerry wants a Super Bowl, you think those guys are going to forget? The next time Stephen wants another stadium, you think those guys are going to forget?

I don't think so.

 

[JoeyBoy718]

So what about putting your hand on a girl's butt in the dance floor at the club? What about rude cat calls? What about lap dances?

I don't care that Zeke pulled a girl's top down. I'm not a prude. But he's a professional athlete, it was caught on camera, and the NFL is trying to clean up their image. It wouldn't be outrageous for him to get a 1-game suspension for the incident.

 

[Sydla]

An you don't think that the rest of the league would fight it as well? The league are all the rest of the owners. You think that's going to bode well for Jerry? The next time Jerry wants a Super Bowl, you think those guys are going to forget? The next time Stephen wants another stadium, you think those guys are going to forget?

I don't think so.

Using this logic how did Jerry ever get a SB to begin with? He sued the league in 1995 and he broke the NFL licensing agreement in 2001.

Apparently the owners forgot those things.

 

[Sydla]

Yes he was, but he was trying to sign a deal where by he would be exclusive with one of the Department Store chains and I believe he was trying to keep revenue on sales inside the Stadium or Cowboy owned stores. Like the Cowboys Stores you see in malls all over the place. That was all supposed to be Jerry's but instead, he shares it with the rest of the league. It's been a long time so I can not remember all of the details exactly but yeah, he was trying to do a side deal on Merchandising so yes, he did give up those exclusives and the profits from sales. He did give up all exclusive rights to Cowboys Network and media.

He did lose a considerable amount of money and he lost even more in futures. The whole hall of fame thing may paint it a certain way but there is no question that Jerry lost a lot on that deal. He lost because he did not have support of the rest of the league.

If Jerry fights this thing and he has no support from the rest of the league, it's going to be both expensive and extensive. I don't think he will win but we will see.

I think you have some of your timelines off. The department store chain deal was in 2002, with JC Penney, after the Cowboys broke from the NFL Licensing agreement. When the league signed Reebok as the official apparel producer in 2001, there was language in the contract that would allow teams to opt out and handle their own merchandising is they saw fit. Jones acted upon that language in July of 2015 and within a week, had a deal signed with JC Penney.

Cowboys owned stores didn't come about until around then too.

In the end, Jones walked away with more money in his pocket than he did before the league sued him. He didn't give up any merchandising rights that weren't already pledged to the league. You'd be hard pressed to find any article at that time or since or any expert on the business of sports that would call Jones a loser there.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Using this logic how did Jerry ever get a SB to begin with? He sued the league in 1995 and he broke the NFL licensing agreement in 2001.

Apparently the owners forgot those things.

Jerry's done a lot of things. He tried to get a Super Bowl from almost the day he bought the Cowboys. Took him over 20 years. Your right, it was a miracle. If you want to continue to see those kinds of miracles, I think the writing is on the wall but hey, I don't really claim to know much about that kind of stuff.