T.O.-Top 10 Receivers of all time?

[Hostile]

When I think all time great WRs I would think of him, but not as one of the top 10 of all time. He doesn't have great hands like Rice, Berry, Biletnikoff, or Maynard. He doesn't run precise routes like Largent, Harrison, or Hutson.

I do think he's one of the greatest WRs of all time but I just can't put him in the top 10 all time. Todays WRs have bloated stats because of the evolution of the game.

I've never thought of a top 10 list at WR. Rice is the no doubt #1, but I just don't have Owens in the top 10. I would however put Bob Hayes in the top 10. Under today's relaxed rules and passing attacks he might be even more unstoppable. Moss would be there. Harrison, Berry, Maynard, Hutson, & Biletnikoff for sure would be.

I can't even say Owens would be there above Irvin and I'm not sure Irvin is top 10 for me. He might be at the bottom of the top 10 or just outside it, but I'd put him above Owens.

This probably will not be a popular opinion.

 

[TNCowboy]

TO's dropped passes are a huge deal. He's perennially amongst the NFL leaders in drops, even when he doesn't have the injured-finger excuse.

Jerry Rice, Don Hutson, Michael Irvin, Raymond Berry, and Marvin Harrison are better players. With the exception of Moss, they were all guys you want in the lockerroom.

TO is in that next group, with Carter, Largent, Brown, Holt, Reed, etc.

I'm not sure where I'd put Hayes. His game was so different in his hey-days, but he's in the discussion, IMO.

Randy Moss is the most physically-gifted WR I've ever seen, and should've finished his career with all of Jerry Rice's records, but like TO, he's such a knucklehead that he's tainted his own greatness.

 

[Doomsday101]

What is funny is when ranking QB's it comes down to how many rings he has for many fans yet when talking WR or some other postion you look at the stats. :laugh2:

 

[Zaxor]

My top 10 Wr's of all Time

Don Hutson
Jerry Rice
Randy Moss
Micheal Irvin
Paul Warfield
Lance Alworth
Raymond Berry
Charley Taylor
Steve Largent
Bobby Hayes (my list, so I can put on it who I want)

 

[joseephuss]

I don't think TO is a top 10 receiver of all time. There is nothing wrong with being #11 on such a list if that is where TO ends up. He is one of the best the league has seen, but there have been some greats.

Marvin Harrison is not better than TO and not a top ten receiver, either. Harrison has great regular season stats, but that is it. He plays in a very offensive friendly era and a pass happy scheme. The thing that keeps him out of the top ten for me is that he disappears in the playoffs.

Harrison has has played in 16 career playoff games, which is equivalent to a full season. He has 65 receptions, 882 yards and two touchdowns in those 16 playoff games. That is 55. 13 yards per game down from his career regular season average of 76.7 yards per game. He has one game of over 100 yards. His 100 yard game and both touchdowns were produced in the same wildcard game against Denver.

He has played in two conference championship games and one Superbowl. In those 3 biggest games of his career he has 12 receptions for 119 yards(9.92 avg per reception) and again 0 TDs. That is 39.67 yards per game.

The bigger the game, the smaller the contribution from Harrison. That is not top ten in my book.

 

[tyke1doe]

Long enough to know that those guys were great in their era, but TO has more talent in his left leg than them.

It's difficult to compare receivers from different eras because the game's rules have change as have conditioning programs. Who's to say T.O. would have been the same receiver had he played in the downfield bump coverage days of Alworth, Otis Taylor (he's been forgotten in this conversation) and Paul Warfield.

T.O. has been a great receiver, no doubt about that. But I don't know if I'd put him in my top 10 category.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

TO doesnt have the luxury of pushing off either.
DB's are much better than now than they were back in the day.


I dont really care if he was top 10 or 20. But the WR second to only Jerry Rice in TD's should get some legitimately debated discussion for top 10.

If he was a Brett Favre good ole' boy type then there would be little doubt by many that TO was in the top 5 if not the greatest ever. Not the "real" "greatest ever".... I mean like Brett Favre "greatest ever" - cause he is not.

Same thing, but different.

 

[Hostile]

TO doesnt have the luxury of pushing off either.
DB's are much better than now than they were back in the day.


I dont really care if he was top 10 or 20. But the WR second to only Jerry Rice in TD's should get some legitimately debated discussion for top 10.

If he was a Brett Favre good ole' boy type then there would be little doubt by many that TO was in the top 5 if not the greatest ever. Not the "real" "greatest ever".... I mean like Brett Favre "greatest ever" - cause he is not.

Same thing, but different.

I disagree with his attitude being a factor. Randy Moss has the same attitude and most of us would put him right behind Rice on the top 10.

 

[Plumfool]

watched game over 4 decades and TO is top 10 yes bad hands, yes to a lot of the other things that people say about him. But bottom line in evey offense he's been in, he's the man you've got to stop. Only a few WR you can say that about. And the stats also speak for themselves. And although offenses have been given soo much leeway, you have to admit that defenses are so much more sofisticated and the athletes on the defensive side of the ball are so much better than in years past. So to try and make an excuse/reason for someones numbers is not totally fair. Just different eras. If TO was a nicer person no one would even try to make such arguments.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

I disagree with his attitude being a factor. Randy Moss has the same attitude and most of us would put him right behind Rice on the top 10.

I disagree. Randy Moss really hasnt been mounted the way TO has been mounted. Atleast not for any long periods of time.

People have wood for TO. There is no denying.
Yes people can blame him for some or all if you want and rightfully so in some cases.

Moss rans over traffic person, hit a woman, knocked someone up etc.... all forgotten in minutes.

TO is a talker - that bothers people.
Moss is not a talker - he give them nothing,
They are both diva's but you cant compare the two.

 

[avaj]

When I think all time great WRs I would think of him, but not as one of the top 10 of all time. He doesn't have great hands like Rice, Berry, Biletnikoff, or Maynard. He doesn't run precise routes like Largent, Harrison, or Hutson.

I do think he's one of the greatest WRs of all time but I just can't put him in the top 10 all time. Todays WRs have bloated stats because of the evolution of the game.

I've never thought of a top 10 list at WR. Rice is the no doubt #1, but I just don't have Owens in the top 10. I would however put Bob Hayes in the top 10. Under today's relaxed rules and passing attacks he might be even more unstoppable. Moss would be there. Harrison, Berry, Maynard, Hutson, & Biletnikoff for sure would be.

I can't even say Owens would be there above Irvin and I'm not sure Irvin is top 10 for me. He might be at the bottom of the top 10 or just outside it, but I'd put him above Owens.

This probably will not be a popular opinion.

See Hostile that what I was thinking. When Sharpe said that, I really had to think for a minute. Now if the list was top 20, sure he would make it, but top 10 I have a hard time putting him in it.

Wow some great receivers have been mention that I forgot about. Going down memory lane.

 

[CF74]

Well, let's see...off the top of my head...

He's not better than Jerry Rice, Raymomd Berry, Paul Warfield, Randy Moss, Lance Alworth, Marvin Harrison, Michael Irvin, Steve Largent, Charlie Taylor...

Then there's Don Hutson, Cris Carter, Art Monk, Tim Brown...Who are close to top ten...

So...uh, maybe.

And PLEEEEEEEEASE folks, when ya start debating this, REMEMBER the era some of these guys played in...Don Hutson, Paul Warfield are not going to have great numbers....but remember, the game was VERY different back then.

No love for Drew Pearson?

 

[McCordsville Cowboy]

The only thing we have to judge by is what they were in their era...

I wonder how you define "talent". If the ability to catch the ball is part of talent, Owens isn't a top 100 WR.

Given your perspective, I guess Jim Brown wouldn't be a top ten all time running back.

Of course everyones definition is going to be different..

But I define talent as "God-Given ability or natural physical prowess."

You cant teach size, speed and arm strength.

But you CAN teach hands and route running. To some people in just comes easier to catch a ball than others. Alot of this happens to be how early hand-eye coordination is developed. Alot of B-ball players have soft hands because you eventually develop it.

Everyone's body can only be maxed out so much physically. TO has done more with what he was given than most. I believe he ran a 4.65 at his combine but steadily improved his body with the tutelage of probably the GOAT.

The most talented WR EVER to play is Randy Moss... If Randy Moss had TO's work ethic he would be unreal and unstoppable. Thats TO's chip. He has worked harder than Marvin Harrison , Keyshawn, Eric Moulds, Terry Glenn, Mushin Muhammedand Bobby Engram. All guys that were taken before him.

He made the most with what he was naturally given and it shows.

Comparing Era's is hard to do but you have too a bit if you are comparing talent to some extent.

 

[THUMPER]

Well, let's see...off the top of my head...

He's not better than Jerry Rice, Raymomd Berry, Paul Warfield, Randy Moss, Lance Alworth, Marvin Harrison, Michael Irvin, Steve Largent, Charlie Taylor...

Then there's Don Hutson, Cris Carter, Art Monk, Tim Brown...Who are close to top ten...

So...uh, maybe.

And PLEEEEEEEEASE folks, when ya start debating this, REMEMBER the era some of these guys played in...Don Hutson, Paul Warfield are not going to have great numbers....but remember, the game was VERY different back then.

Great list Juke! I fully agree with you, Owens isn't in my top-20 all-time. Heck he isn't even in my top-5 Cowboys WRs, I'd take Bob Hayes, Drew Pearson, and Tony Hill, Michael Irvin, and Lance Rentzel ahead of Owens.

I'd add: Hines Ward, Marvin Harrison, Issac Bruce, Tory Holt, Elroy Hirsch, Tom Fears Don Maynard, Cliff Branch, Charlie Joiner, James Lofton, Jimmy Smith, Herman Moore, Stanley Morgan, Fred Biletnikoff, Tommy McDonald, etc. Well you get the idea.

For all Owens' stats he is not a winner.

 

[McCordsville Cowboy]

Great list Juke! I fully agree with you, Owens isn't in my top-20 all-time. Heck he isn't even in my top-5 Cowboys WRs, I'd take Bob Hayes, Drew Pearson, and Tony Hill, Michael Irvin, and Lance Rentzel ahead of Owens.

I'd add: Hines Ward, Marvin Harrison, Issac Bruce, Tory Holt, Elroy Hirsch, Tom Fears Don Maynard, Cliff Branch, Charlie Joiner, James Lofton, Jimmy Smith, Herman Moore, Stanley Morgan, Fred Biletnikoff, Tommy McDonald, etc. Well you get the idea.

For all Owens' stats he is not a winner.

You are obviously not Pro-TO by your list.....

 

[DallasEast]

Great list Juke! I fully agree with you, Owens isn't in my top-20 all-time. Heck he isn't even in my top-5 Cowboys WRs, I'd take Bob Hayes, Drew Pearson, and Tony Hill, Michael Irvin, and Lance Rentzel ahead of Owens.

I'd add: Hines Ward, Marvin Harrison, Issac Bruce, Tory Holt, Elroy Hirsch, Tom Fears Don Maynard, Cliff Branch, Charlie Joiner, James Lofton, Jimmy Smith, Herman Moore, Stanley Morgan, Fred Biletnikoff, Tommy McDonald, etc. Well you get the idea.

For all Owens' stats he is not a winner.

Rentzel and Hayes were a little before my time, but from personal experience, I wouldn't blink twice about taking Irvin, Pearson and Hill before Owens.

 

[CATCH17]

No question he is top 10 and some of these guys that played in the prehistoric days were great at the time but wouldn't even be on Bernard Berrians level if they played now.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

TO has done more with what he was given than most. I believe he ran a 4.65 at his combine but steadily improved his body with the tutelage of probably the GOAT.

This is not complete.

TO is a made man. He has done MORE with what HE added to his own self. Pass the biscuits.

 

[DallasEast]

No question he is top 10 and some of these guys that played in the prehistoric days were great at the time but wouldn't even be on Bernard Berrians level if they played now.

Just curious. Do you have two or three of those "prehistoric" wide receivers as examples?

 

[sonnyboy]

When I think all time great WRs I would think of him, but not as one of the top 10 of all time. He doesn't have great hands like Rice, Berry, Biletnikoff, or Maynard. He doesn't run precise routes like Largent, Harrison, or Hutson.

I do think he's one of the greatest WRs of all time but I just can't put him in the top 10 all time. Todays WRs have bloated stats because of the evolution of the game.

I've never thought of a top 10 list at WR. Rice is the no doubt #1, but I just don't have Owens in the top 10. I would however put Bob Hayes in the top 10. Under today's relaxed rules and passing attacks he might be even more unstoppable. Moss would be there. Harrison, Berry, Maynard, Hutson, & Biletnikoff for sure would be.

I can't even say Owens would be there above Irvin and I'm not sure Irvin is top 10 for me. He might be at the bottom of the top 10 or just outside it, but I'd put him above Owens.

This probably will not be a popular opinion.

You make a lot of sense here Hos.

He's definetly in my top 10, but the concerns you have are valid.

He's just not a natural receiver. Not just my top 10, but if I made a top 50 list, he's be my least skilled in the group.

He doesn't have great hands, he doesn't run precise routes. He also lacks a natural feel for the position. He's also not good on jump balls. At least not as good as you'd think he should be with his physical ability. He simply lacks a good nose for the ball, doesn't track it well to make those type plays enough.

Something else he doesn't do that Parcells pointed out once. When Parcells said it I thought wow, I knew there was something off there, I just couldn't put it in words.
When Owens is running a deep patern for the ball, as the ball approaches him, he doesn't come under controll by changing his stride and running on his toes for the last few steps.
This is something I was never coached to do, I just did it instinctively.

That's his short coming in a nutshell, he has little instincts for the position.


So how the hell can he be in anyones top 10?

Well because in my opinion he's the best athlete to ever play the position and he's perhaps one of the best ever after the catch. His size, strength, speed and quickness are off the charts. It's just not fair that someone as big and strong as he is, is as fast and quick as he is. At times it appears he violates the basic laws of physics.

Most importantly he's perhaps the best at the most critical attribute of the the position. Uncovering. He may be the most difficult WR to cover in the games history.