The Calvin Johnson Rule Does Not Apply

[Yakuza Rich]

I saw the play. I thought he caught the ball. But according to the rules, he catches the ball then he's starting to fall and extends the ball toward the goal line and the ball hits the ground. And according to the rules and the way that play has been called, it's not a catch.

Extending the ball and the body is a 'football move.' Stetatore says that he didn't see a football move. There was one...Dez extending his body and arm toward the goal line (which you admitted he did).

The problem is that you're reading the CJ rule which does not apply as I mentioned in the first post. The CJ rule doesn't talk about a 'football move common to the game.' When a player makes a move common to the game (i.e. Dez's move), then that means he has completed the process of the catch.




YR

 

[The Quest for Six]

If it's in the endzone, he does not try to stretch it out and just pulls it into his chest....Touchdown

if it's in the end zone and when he hits the ground and the ball comes out, it's incomplete, if he catches and gets two feet in bounds and hits the ground out of bounds and the ball comes lose, it's an incomplete pass...

 

[tyke1doe]

I disagree. Watch his left foot and you can see he digs into the ground for leverage to leap forward.

Look, I believe he caught the ball. But he doesn't stop his movement significantly enough to where it's clear he established a football move. But we can argue this forever. It won't change anything. We loss. It hurts, yes. But it's time to move on.

 

[KC10Sooner]

he must maintain control of the ball throughout the process of the catch when he goes to the ground....he didn't maintain possession when he hit the ground

How many steps does he need to qualify as a possession? Is that a judgement by the ref? Can he go ten steps? 20?

It's obvious he had control, then made a play for the TD by switching hands with the ball and lunging for the goal line. The fact that his whole body hit before the arm with the ball did just proves the point.

 

[JD_KaPow]

Look, I believe he caught the ball. But he doesn't stop his movement significantly enough to where it's clear he established a football move. But we can argue this forever. It won't change anything. We loss. It hurts, yes. But it's time to move on.

Hey, that's fine. As long as we're arguing about the right thing: did the third step and lunge constitute a football move? It's obvious to me that it did. You disagree. But that's the right argument.

 

[Irvin88_4life]

Whether Dez caught the ball in play, on the sidelines or in the end zone, he must maintain control of the ball throughout the process of the catch when he goes to the ground, clearly he did not, the ball came lose when he hit the ground, so therefore it would be an incomplete pass regardless where he caught it on the field...it was the correct call, I hate the rule, always have, but it's the rule....

The ball can come loose as long as it doesn't touch the ground. He ball came loose but never touched the ground.

How can it be incomplete pass when the ball never touches. .....

 

[CATCH17]

Watch it in fast motion.. You have to watch it slow for this to even be debatable.

And if you're saying Dez was being selfish then you're just a Dez hater. That was a catch and him trying to score.

[youtube]

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Do you have the video clip of that entire play?

The picture doesn't give us the full, er, picture of what happened before Miles extends.

I don't have to give you a video.

His body is in extension. His arm is extended while it is cupped around the ball.

This is 'common to the game' as we see this all of the time.

You have possession, you are trying to advance the ball without fumbling it *before* you hit the ground. This is exactly what Dez did. Stetatore says, in print, that he didn't see a football move common to the game. We see clearly that this is the move that Dez used and it's common to the game.




YR

 

[The Quest for Six]

Alright, so exactly what frame of video does Dez lose control. Just because the ball hits the ground does not define loss of control. He still had the ball controlled in his possession in the end zone. What you are saying is that he lost control for a sufficient amount of time that was far more relevant to you and others than the time he took to catch the ball, take three steps, exchange hands, extend his body, landed on his right elbow, etc. I say he at least controlled the ball long enough to establish a catch but then gave up the ball when he tried to score. He would not have bobbled the ball if it wasn't for the football move to try and advance the ball. The football move preceded the ground contact thereby making it a completion followed by a controlled fumble. If treated objectively, Dez scores. There was too much action that preceded the ground contact that verified a catch. What you need here is a three second rule -I. E. you have to count to three before you touch the ball to the ground to prevent lousy replay refs from missing football moves.

as soon as the ball hits the ground, the ball pops up and therefore it's an incomplete pass...you have to maintain control of the ball throughout the process of the catch, it's the letter of the rule...and Dez did not..

 

[TheCount]

Hindsight Count, hindsight. So easy to pass judgement rather than Dez just stopping and securing the ball, etc... Hes one yeard from the end zone. I'm not going to fault Dez for trying to score on that play.

I am not passing judgement. You can't even begin to understand the depths of my man love for Dez Bryant.

Even with that being said, you have to have the awareness to know, "If I do not secure this thing 100%, that's the game." and that should come before securing & scoring.

 

[JD_KaPow]

as soon as the ball hits the ground, the ball pops up and therefore it's an incomplete pass...you have to maintain control of the ball throughout the process of the catch, it's the letter of the rule...and Dez did not..

You're still confused about the two different rules in play.

 

[The Quest for Six]

Watch it in fast motion.. You have to watch it slow for this to even be debatable.

And if you're saying Dez was being selfish then you're just a Dez hater. That was a catch and him trying to score.

[youtube]

looks like an incomplete pass to me fast or slow...and that's the letter of the rule, unfortunately

 

[JD_KaPow]

I am not passing judgement. You can't even begin to understand the depths of my man love for Dez Bryant.

Even with that being said, you have to have the awareness to know, "If I do not secure this thing 100%, that's the game." and that should come before securing & scoring.

I think he did. He thought, "I'd better secure this thing 100%." Then he secured it 100%. Then he thought, "okay, let's go score now."

 

[WV Cowboy]

Whether Dez caught the ball in play, on the sidelines or in the end zone, he must maintain control of the ball throughout the process of the catch when he goes to the ground, clearly he did not, the ball came lose when he hit the ground, so therefore it would be an incomplete pass regardless where he caught it on the field...it was the correct call, I hate the rule, always have, but it's the rule....

How many steps over rule this? One, three, six, ... ten yards. Dez took three steps.

He clearly caught the ball. The catch is never in doubt. No bobble, no nothing.

Eventually you can go down and not have to control the ball throughout the process of the catch. How many steps make it a catch?

 

[tideh20heel]

Are you insane? Are you trying to drag Jim Crow laws in this discussion? Really?

Pick another law if you want. The point is just because a guy can articulate why he chose to do something doesn't make it right.Clarity of explanation does not constitute something being correct. They asked you to ignore every key component of a catch and suspend time from the time of the grab until he finally fell and just concentrate on those two elements and you appreciate them for clarity. Of course about six things happened during that time that were actually pertinent.

 

[The Quest for Six]

You're still confused about the two different rules in play.

son, you're the one confused about the call, not me, every official is stating it's an incomplete pass...I didn't need an NFL posting to verify what I saw live, I said it was an incomplete pass before they even reviewed it by the letter of the NFL rule and I hate the rule, always have.

 

[CATCH17]

looks like an incomplete pass to me fast or slow...and that's the letter of the rule, unfortunately

To me it looks like he caught the ball and started trying to get to the endzone after the catch.

If he makes a football move then the catch had been established and the ground can't cause a fumble.

Didn't look like Dez caught the ball and went straight down at all.

 

[AbeBeta]

Your logic does not allow the NFL to avenge a wrong against the Lions last week.

Wait. The fix was in last week because the Cowboys draw such big ratings. Yet this week, the league is trying to get them out?

Can't even keep the conspiracy theory consistent, eh?

 

[TheCount]

Do you have the video clip of that entire play?

The picture doesn't give us the full, er, picture of what happened before Miles extends.

The Miles play wasn't anything like Dez's. Miles never lost the ball, even when it hit the ground - which is legal as long as it's under control.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

as soon as the ball hits the ground, the ball pops up and therefore it's an incomplete pass...you have to maintain control of the ball throughout the process of the catch, it's the letter of the rule...and Dez did not..

You just told us to read Stetore's ruling.

Stetatore said that they did not see a move in common with the game.

It *completely* negates the rule you are talking about (CJ Rule) where it talks about maintaining control of the ball *throughout the process of the catch*.

That's why I wrote this thread. Two different rules.

Stetatore interpreted it correctly in the sense this is not the CJ Rule as you foolishly have tried to claim.

But his claim that he did not see a 'move common to the game' is ridiculous as I showed with the Miles Austin extension of the body and arm with the ball cupped around his arm.




YR