The Calvin Johnson Rule Does Not Apply

[ConstantReboot]

Disagree fully. Too many football moves and ball control prior to the ground contact. That's why we have video. Maybe you should rewatch the video and write down what transpired after Dez caught the ball.

Whats so funny about this is that they said that they had many angles to this play. They also said that this was the right call. But based on what? And if they had many angles why are they showing only two different angles? Why aren't they showing it in slo mo? Why was the decision done so quickly as though they already made up their mind?

I think the more they show this the more that it proves its a catch. There is nothing here to say that this wasn't a catch. Should not have been overturned and they should have left it at that.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Whats so funny about this is that they said that they had many angles to this play. They also said that this was the right call. But based on what? And if they had many angles why are they showing only two different angles? Why aren't they showing it in slo mo? Why was the decision done so quickly as though they already made up their mind?

I think the more they show this the more that it proves its a catch. There is nothing here to say that this wasn't a catch. Should not have been overturned and they should have left it at that.

As one poster said, it's 'lawyer ball.'

It really reminds me of the OJ Simpson case. Yes, 2 people that are not twins can have the same DNA, but the odds are so miniscule it's just not going to happen. So what do the lawyers do? They start to take each word of the law and interpret that word in 1 form to prove their case.

What we are hearing a lot of people say is that it is a 'bad rule.'

I actually don't think it is a bad rule, just the league is apparently clueless to what the rule is. Stetatore even admitted that he was looking for a football move. So he wasn't looking at the rule that the league is looking at.

If it truly is a bad rule, then why not look to change it?

I think if they look at the rule they would then see that it's not a bad rule, they just interpreted it incorrectly and that Dez made a 'football move.'



YR

 

[ConstantReboot]

As one poster said, it's 'lawyer ball.'

It really reminds me of the OJ Simpson case. Yes, 2 people that are not twins can have the same DNA, but the odds are so miniscule it's just not going to happen. So what do the lawyers do? They start to take each word of the law and interpret that word in 1 form to prove their case.

What we are hearing a lot of people say is that it is a 'bad rule.'

I actually don't think it is a bad rule, just the league is apparently clueless to what the rule is. Stetatore even admitted that he was looking for a football move. So he wasn't looking at the rule that the league is looking at.

If it truly is a bad rule, then why not look to change it?

I think if they look at the rule they would then see that it's not a bad rule, they just interpreted it incorrectly and that Dez made a 'football move.'



YR

Funny you mentioned that OJ Simpson case because that was exactly what I was thinking about all of this.

Its funny the more they show the replay over and over the more its beginning to look like a catch. Thus I think what their doing is diverting the public from catch and having these so called experts weigh in on their opinions.

Yes its nothing more than the OJ Simpson case. Mike Pereira and Blandino are paid specialist to give testimony why its the right call. They are paid to say the things the NFL wants.

However, people outside of the NFL circle or even the other teams are calling it as they see it. Labron James and even Odelle Beckham are calling it a catch. I even saw a tweet that Jordy is sympathizing with us regarding that play as well.

The NFL screwed up. This will even make them look even worst than all the other professional sports and they deserve it.

 

[Sarge]

The bottom line is, the stupid rule needs to be changed.

 

[TwoDeep3]

The Calvin Johnson Rule does apply.


Dez caught ball.
Before first step, ball dislodged by DB
First foot falls as Dez recaptures the ball
Dez second step is now his first step with the ball
Third step is now true second step, and since the ball was juggled because of DB, this means he has to maintain control all the way to the ground.

The intentions of Dez to score mean nothing. He should have controlled the ball to the ground and allowed the offense to take it from there. No fault of Dez.

But - if he had caught it clean before first step with no dislodge by DB, then this was the refs making the wrong call.

 

[MarionBarberThe4th]

Joe buck and the official too late In his correct reversal screwed us. Bc the Detroit Non PI was correct but they exacerbated those thing being bad at their jobs(buck an the officiating crew initially). Thus we got the shaft bc it was the very next week and in gb.

***Nobody watching that game yesterday aeven thought it was worth a replay. Dez caught the ball the cb got owned romo made the clutch play and the game was ready to get epic.

 

[MarionBarberThe4th]

Two feet =possession
Possession? Yep. Ok I'm going to try to score now.

The Calvin Johnson Rule does apply.


Dez caught ball.
Before first step, ball dislodged by DB
First foot falls as Dez recaptures the ball
Dez second step is now his first step with the ball
Third step is now true second step, and since the ball was juggled because of DB, this means he has to maintain control all the way to the ground.

The intentions of Dez to score mean nothing. He should have controlled the ball to the ground and allowed the offense to take it from there. No fault of Dez.

But - if he had caught it clean before first step with no dislodge by DB, then this was the refs making the wrong call.

 

[TwoDeep3]

Two feet =possession
Possession? Yep. Ok I'm going to try to score now.

Juggled ball means maintain the control to the ground. Intent has no bearing. It's the same as going out of bounds after two feet hit. If you are falling, no matter that you got two feet down, you still must maintain control to the ground.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

The Calvin Johnson Rule does apply.


Dez caught ball.
Before first step, ball dislodged by DB
First foot falls as Dez recaptures the ball
Dez second step is now his first step with the ball
Third step is now true second step, and since the ball was juggled because of DB, this means he has to maintain control all the way to the ground.

The intentions of Dez to score mean nothing. He should have controlled the ball to the ground and allowed the offense to take it from there. No fault of Dez.

But - if he had caught it clean before first step with no dislodge by DB, then this was the refs making the wrong call.

Dead*Spin went over the rule and no, the CJ rule does not apply.

I'll explain this for the millionth time.

The CJ rule is discussing a player that has not completed the process of the catch. It's the CJ rule because CJ was in the end zone and cannot make a football move in the end zone (you're not going anywhere when you're in the end zone, so no move needs to be made).

Here's the rule as to what is a 'completed pass', straight from the Rule Book:

A forward pass is complete (by the offense) or intercepted (by the defense) if a player, who is inbounds:

(a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and

(b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands; and

(c) maintains control of the ball long enough, after (a) and (b) have been fulfilled, to enable him to perform any act common to the game (i.e., maintaining control long enough to pitch it, pass it, advance with it, or avoid or ward off an opponent, etc.).

Once the pass has been completed, the CJ rule no longer applies because the CJ rule is about the player *still* going thru the process of the catch.

It is clear as day that Dez performed an act common to the game as he absolutely made a move that is common with trying to advance the ball.

The rule isn't dumb. It's the dummies that are paid to understand the rule that still don't get that they are:

1. Applying the wrong rule

2. Are trying to tell us that Dez didn't try to advance the ball.






YR

 

[MarionBarberThe4th]

Juggled ball means maintain the control to the ground. Intent has no bearing. It's the same as going out of bounds after two feet hit. If you are falling, no matter that you got two feet down, you still must maintain control to the ground.

I think you're over complicating it. Dez was a runner. The catch was over with. Who catches a pass WHILE Diving?

 

[TwoDeep3]

Dead*Spin went over the rule and no, the CJ rule does not apply.

I'll explain this for the millionth time.

The CJ rule is discussing a player that has not completed the process of the catch. It's the CJ rule because CJ was in the end zone and cannot make a football move in the end zone (you're not going anywhere when you're in the end zone, so no move needs to be made).

Here's the rule as to what is a 'completed pass', straight from the Rule Book:




Once the pass has been completed, the CJ rule no longer applies because the CJ rule is about the player *still* going thru the process of the catch.

It is clear as day that Dez performed an act common to the game as he absolutely made a move that is common with trying to advance the ball.

The rule isn't dumb. It's the dummies that are paid to understand the rule that still don't get that they are:

1. Applying the wrong rule

2. Are trying to tell us that Dez didn't try to advance the ball.






YR

When the ball was dislodged by the DB, the rule that covers the out of bounds catch while falling applies in this case. If that is not labeled the CJ rule, then sol be it. But once Dez juggled the ball, since he was falling, he had to maintain his possession.

 

[TwoDeep3]

I think you're over complicating it. Dez was a runner. The catch was over with. Who catches a pass WHILE Diving?

HIs intent doesn't override his going to the ground and losing control.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

When the ball was dislodged by the DB, the rule that covers the out of bounds catch while falling applies in this case. If that is not labeled the CJ rule, then sol be it. But once Dez juggled the ball, since he was falling, he had to maintain his possession.

Which he did. He regained possession and then made an act common to football which is defined by him attempting to advance the ball (which is precisely what the rule book says). Once that is done, it is considered a catch (again, by the rule book). The ball can no longer be considered incomplete.




YR

 

[Jenky]

When the ball was dislodged by the DB, the rule that covers the out of bounds catch while falling applies in this case. If that is not labeled the CJ rule, then sol be it. But once Dez juggled the ball, since he was falling, he had to maintain his possession.

You're not making any sense. The DB never dislodged the ball and Dez never juggled it.

On the 3rd step, Dez's left foot digs and pushes his body towards the endzone. That's a lunge. If you want to argue that the ball came lose on the lunge, fine. The ground can't cause a fumble, which HE did regain anyways.

Also there's no INDISPUTABLE evidence that the ball hits the ground.

http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2015...t-was-overturned-is-the-play-in-cowboys-26-21

The head ref cited the Calvin Johnson rule and that he saw no football move, which is FALSE. The act of going forward with the ball is a football move.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

HIs intent doesn't override his going to the ground and losing control.

Intent has nothing to do with it.

Did he make a move to advance the ball?

By extending his body and his arm along with making a lunging motion...I would say that he did. We see this similar type of move done hundreds of times each year.

And by the rule book (8.1.3), the catch has been considered completed.




YR

 

[ConstantReboot]

The Calvin Johnson Rule does apply.


Dez caught ball.
Before first step, ball dislodged by DB
First foot falls as Dez recaptures the ball
Dez second step is now his first step with the ball
Third step is now true second step, and since the ball was juggled because of DB, this means he has to maintain control all the way to the ground.

The intentions of Dez to score mean nothing. He should have controlled the ball to the ground and allowed the offense to take it from there. No fault of Dez.

But - if he had caught it clean before first step with no dislodge by DB, then this was the refs making the wrong call.

He caught the ball clean. Then he attempted to reach for the goal line and thats where things started to get hazy. But once he caught it he took a least 3 steps which indicate possession.

The intention for Dez to score means a lot. First and foremost it means that he had control of the ball and thus should be ruled a catch. As you can see there was an intention for him to score and thus that means that it was a catch and he had control of the ball. Otherwise, why would it be ruled NOT a catch and he had intentions to score?

 

[TwoDeep3]

Which he did. He regained possession and then made an act common to football which is defined by him attempting to advance the ball (which is precisely what the rule book says). Once that is done, it is considered a catch (again, by the rule book). The ball can no longer be considered incomplete.




YR

You and I assume his attempt is considered a football move. But clearly once he lost control, he had to establish it again and control it to the ground. The deciding factor for the ref had to be that the DB's leg hit Dez and could have been construed as knocking him to the ground. That would be the only explanation I have foir why they made this decision. But if that is the case, then intent on the party of the receiver would not come into play.

I am not happy about the results, nor the ruling. But the rules were applied in a fair way. And the visual information supports the call.

 

[Alohawg1]

Dead*Spin went over the rule and no, the CJ rule does not apply.

I'll explain this for the millionth time.

The CJ rule is discussing a player that has not completed the process of the catch. It's the CJ rule because CJ was in the end zone and cannot make a football move in the end zone (you're not going anywhere when you're in the end zone, so no move needs to be made).

Here's the rule as to what is a 'completed pass', straight from the Rule Book:




Once the pass has been completed, the CJ rule no longer applies because the CJ rule is about the player *still* going thru the process of the catch.

It is clear as day that Dez performed an act common to the game as he absolutely made a move that is common with trying to advance the ball.

The rule isn't dumb. It's the dummies that are paid to understand the rule that still don't get that they are:

1. Applying the wrong rule

2. Are trying to tell us that Dez didn't try to advance the ball.






YR

Pride and willful ignorance is the only reason anyone of average intelligence cannot see this, imo.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

You and I assume his attempt is considered a football move.

There is no assumption.

The rule (8.1.3) states it clearly.

'An Act Common To the Game' *includes* an act that is advancing the ball.

Dez was advancing the ball, right?

Then that is a 'football move.'

But clearly once he lost control, he had to establish it again and control it to the ground.

Not exactly.

Dez did re-establish control as evidenced by him moving the ball to his left hand in the tucked position. He then extended his entire body along with his left arm while he was still cradling the ball.

That was an act common to the game.

Why?

Because it was an act that did advance the ball forward.

But the rules were applied in a fair way. And the visual information supports the call.

Except they weren't and it didn't.

You will need to explain to us how Dez did not make an act that advanced the football.

If the league can logically explain to me how Dez did not make that act despite him fully extending and lunging his body along with extending his arm, I'm all ears.

Instead, they want to talk about the CJ rule and skip over rule 8.1.3. which takes precedent over the CJ Rule.




YR

 

[DogFace]

My question is how many steps would it made him falling and the ball possibly coming into contact with not matter? He had 3 steps. Obviously if he takes 10 it doesn't matter. So how many steps would it have taken?
The other part that I don't understand is the part where the ball can be trapped sometimes, like the Cobb catch, and others it is deemed not under control.

There are so many different reasons why this was a catch.

I'll never get over this.