The Curious Case of Brandon Carr

[speedkilz88]

Again, unless we are over the cap or need the money to sign a difference maker in free agency, who cares that he's overpaid. Lots of guys are overpaid. We have backup players who are overpaid. Saving money on Carr's contract means absolutely nothing unless we want to do something with that money. Even if he were our 4th CB going into game one, it still comes down to what do you actually gain with the savings. If we like our team and don't need the money, again.....who cares that he's overpaid? It's our fault, not his.

I'm pretty sure the FO cares and can use the money because they are fairly close to the cap limit.

 

[Bluefin]

The leg injury or the injury to his self esteem and confidence? It may never heal properly.

And it wasn't just the left patella tendon repair, either.

Scans showed that Morris Claiborne's right patella tendon was also weakening and he underwent some sort of procedure in December to strengthen it.

 

[ghst187]

What about option three? Give him a longer term contract while lowering his cap hit? We would be wrong to cut him, we don't have that kind of depth at db.

 

[Bluefin]

I'm pretty sure the FO cares and can use the money because they are fairly close to the cap limit.

We might as well not even consider the salary cap in this case.

Is there any chance the team wants to pay Brandon Carr $8M this season (and $9.1M next yr) based on services rendered?

Carr is going to take a pay cut or end up playing for peanuts elsewhere.

I and others have mentioned this in past threads.

Carr stands to make a lot more taking a pay cut to remain a Dallas Cowboy the next two seasons than he will get hitting the open market at this late stage of free agency.

 

[Arkyvarminter]

The thing that bothers me is that Byron Jones is talked about like he's played in the NFL for years. Claiborne was considered the best DB in his draft and how did that work out?

 

[esloan]

I don't think we can cut him outright. Who would be the starters? O-Scan and Mo? O-Scan and a rookie? We need the depth.

BTW, how is my new sig pic?

 

[AzorAhai]

The thing that bothers me is that Byron Jones is talked about like he's played in the NFL for years. Claiborne was considered the best DB in his draft and how did that work out?

Exactly. If Jones really struggles, which I don't think he will, but if he does you have Scandrick as your only starting caliber CB. What if Scandrick goes down? Byron Jones would be it. The quality of depth behind Scandrick and Jones is not good enough to outright cut Carr.

 

[gimmesix]

They can wait until they see how other players are doing in training camp before forcing the issue with the pay cut.

I think they almost have to. Don't know if Byron Jones is ready to become a starter as a rookie. Don't know if Claiborne is going to be healthy. If anything is going to happen, I think those questions have to be answered first.

 

[gmoney112]

We might as well not even consider the salary cap in this case.

Is there any chance the team wants to pay Brandon Carr $8M this season (and $9.1M next yr) based on services rendered?

Carr is going to take a pay cut or end up playing for peanuts elsewhere.

I and others have mentioned this in past threads.

Carr stands to make a lot more taking a pay cut to remain a Dallas Cowboy the next two seasons than he will get hitting the open market at this late stage of free agency.

Disagreed. We can roll with Carr this season and cut him next.

Doesn't matter what we "want" to do, I don't think it's a secret that Carr is the 2nd best CB on this team this season.

I don't think a FO that thinks they could be on the cusp of winning a Super Bowl or 3 in the next few years before Romo hangs them up is going to take the risk of cutting one of the only guys at the CB position that has proven he can actually play in the NFL, regardless of his salary.

Just my opinion, but if I'm the FO, I'm sitting here thinking... "We had a real shot at getting to the Super Bowl last season, we just addressed our single biggest weakness this offseason with the pass rush, and got a solid first round prospect at CB to develop, as well as getting another OL that fortunately, will greatly help alleviate the departure of our biggest loss in Murray."

I think cutting Carr would be taking a step back instead of a step forward at the position. If we'd had a pass rush, we would have beaten GB and who knows what would have happened. Yeah Carr's getting overpaid, but we're not over the cap, and I'm trying to minimize losses and avoid risk at every position on defense as I can given the success of our squad last year and the improvements this season.

I'd tell Carr that it'd greatly help his chances of staying on the team past 2015 if he took a paycut so we could afford to sign players around him. But even if he didn't, I'd still keep him this season, regardless of his cap hit. Given the trajectory of the cap and our space for the next 2 seasons already, my fallback plan is a June 1st cut next year after Byron has a year to get acclimated.

But that's just my opinion.

 

[Bluefin]

But that's just my opinion.

That's cool.

Maybe things will go that way.

I don't think the team will pay Brandon Carr $8M this season.

They didn't want to keep DeMarcus Ware, even at a reduced price, last year and DE was a bigger albatross then than CB is now.

I believe Carr will be asked to reduce his salary and that he'll agree.

We should find out within the next month.

 

[dwreck27]

In all honesty I don't remember revis being all that great when he was with the bucs....

I'm in the boat that carr needs a restructure based on aligning his current on field performance with his pay

Only problem of course why would he take less pay when they wouldn't want to part ways with him

 

[big dog cowboy]

I know we all agree Carr's contract sucks for the Cowboys. Drafting Jones had more to do with Claiborne not Carr IMO. Once the draft passed and we didn't take a 2nd CB that told me the Cowboys were going to be keeping Carr this year. That is why I feel we could go CB early again next year in the draft to find Carr's replacement.

 

[AzorAhai]

I know we all agree Carr's contract sucks for the Cowboys. Drafting Jones had more to do with Claiborne not Carr IMO. Once the draft passed and we didn't take a 2nd CB that told me the Cowboys were going to be keeping Carr this year. That is why I feel we could go CB early again next year in the draft to find Carr's replacement.

I said the same thing at the conclusion of the draft. I figured they would come away with 2 and when they didn't I immediately figured Carr would be staying. CB will also be on the short list for 1st-3rd Rd picks next year if I had to guess. Carr is almost sure to be cut next offseason. He'd only have a 2.5m dead money hit and saves over 9m on the cap. I fully expect him to be here one more season and then be replaced.

 

[LatinMind]

The Cowboys have not been secretive in their desire to get Brandon Carr to take a pay cut. Currently Carr’s contract has two years left with cap hits of 12.7 and 13.8 million. Based on 2015 cap hit alone Carr is the third most expensive cornerback in the NFL. Obviously Carr doesn’t belong in a group with guys like Darrelle Revis, Patrick Peterson, Richard Sherman or Joe Haden based on talent but that’s where he sits in terms of cap hit.

Before the draft the Cowboys had very little leverage in talks with Carr. Orlando Scandrick was the only solid cornerback on the roster. Morris Claiborne is once again coming into training camp hurt and while Tyler Patmon showed some good things in limited playing time as a rookie, he can’t be counted on to fill a starting spot.

Now that the Cowboys have selected Byron Jones many fans believe the Cowboys have the leverage necessary to play hard ball with Carr. While the Jones addition certainly makes it easier to live without Carr it certainly doesn’t make Carr expendable. Even if Claiborne comes into camp healthier than expected he still needs to prove he can be effective. A top three of Jones, Carr and Scandrick with Claiborne and Patmon as depth off the bench would be a great position to be in.

Then there’s the other issue with cutting Carr: he’s actually a solid starter quality cornerback. I know that it is hard to fathom but take a look at the player not the salary. The problem with Carr isn’t always his play but the fact that he is paid so much. A cornerback making over 10 million shouldn’t be solid, he should be a playmaker. Since joining the Cowboys three years ago Carr has just six interceptions, with zero in 2015.

But just because he isn’t the flashy playmaker that his price tag suggests doesn’t mean he isn’t valuable to the Cowboys. One positive trend of Carr’s performance is his late season play. It has long been said that strong defensive line play can cover up for bad secondary play. Likewise, some believe that a strong secondary gives the D-line more time to get to the quarterback. The two really go hand in hand and if one area is extremely weak, like the Cowboys pass rush last season, the other area is exposed.

Starting from the Cowboys week 9 game against the Arizona Cardinals I went back and watched every pass thrown against the team. I used this game as the starting point due to the fact that it was DeMarcus Lawrence’s first game back from injury. While Lawrence didn’t notch his first sack until the playoffs, he dramatically improved the Cowboys pass rush. Below are my notes on Carr.

Continue reading at
http://valleyranchoutsiders.com/the-curious-case-of-brandon-carr/

Decent writeup of the situation with Carr and his play last year. Worth the read.

The thing people forget is, Dallas gave him the contract. Its not his fault they gave him that contract. Second thing people forget is he was one of the best RCBs in the NFL while in KC. He was never a guy who would cover the teams primary WR. Third Dallas brough him in to play in ryans man press scheme. And he played really good in that scheme his first yr. Then Dallas went to a zone scheme which didnt play to his strengths. Kiffins failure came because he was unwilling to adjust his scheme to play to the players strengths but trying to make the player fit his system. Marinelli started witth the zone, but realised he had to adjust and go more man. And we saw this secondary cause alot of coverage sacks at the end of the yr. The Cowboys avg'd 3 sacks a game and 3 turnovers a game in the last 6 games(2 playoff games). Carr played very good in them last 6 games too. If you go back and look at the final 6 games, teams were beating Dallas in the slot not the outside because the outside was shut down the majority of the time. Scandrick playing LCB, Carr RCB and Jones manning the slot is going to be a huge improvement this yr. Add in claiborne playing in dime, this def all around is going to be something to look at this yr.

 

[TheCount]

Very interesting that now some people seem to think it's the norm to just get a guy to take a pay cut if you don't like how well he's paying.

 

[Frozen700]

I dont think carr is dumb enough to think the cowboys would be better off without him than they are with him. I wouldnt take a paycut if i were him.

We wouldn't be better off?

Who is Carr? Dude is slow as dirt, and get's abused by top tier WR's. I like him, don't get me wrong, but he's not all that.

At 1 point he was becoming very close to MO type level, and that is very bad.

If he does not take a pay cut, for being an average corner, then I would cut my ties.

 

[Craig]

Yes. The cowboys would be worse off without him. Is that even up for debate? There is a difference between overpaid and bad.

 

[Nightman]

Yes. The cowboys would be worse off without him. Is that even up for debate? There is a difference between overpaid and bad.

No one seemed to care when it was Murray being let go over money and he is 10x the player Carr is.

 

[AzorAhai]

The thing people forget is, Dallas gave him the contract. Its not his fault they gave him that contract. Second thing people forget is he was one of the best RCBs in the NFL while in KC. He was never a guy who would cover the teams primary WR. Third Dallas brough him in to play in ryans man press scheme. And he played really good in that scheme his first yr. Then Dallas went to a zone scheme which didnt play to his strengths. Kiffins failure came because he was unwilling to adjust his scheme to play to the players strengths but trying to make the player fit his system. Marinelli started witth the zone, but realised he had to adjust and go more man. And we saw this secondary cause alot of coverage sacks at the end of the yr. The Cowboys avg'd 3 sacks a game and 3 turnovers a game in the last 6 games(2 playoff games). Carr played very good in them last 6 games too. If you go back and look at the final 6 games, teams were beating Dallas in the slot not the outside because the outside was shut down the majority of the time. Scandrick playing LCB, Carr RCB and Jones manning the slot is going to be a huge improvement this yr. Add in claiborne playing in dime, this def all around is going to be something to look at this yr.

Very good post. Moore was the one getting abused. Playing a man press scheme will play to Carrs strength. Jones is good off press too. I think the secondary will be much improved this year, particularly if Wilcox can improve his coverage.

 

[NextGenBoys]

Word seems to be that we will be playing more man next year, and if the OTTO LB rumors are true, it makes sense.

It also makes sense that we signed Byron Jones to roam CF if that is the case as well.

We may be witnessing what a Marinelli defense is. The Tampa 2 coverage schemes might not be hardly used at all in this upcoming season. Which would bode extremely well for Carr and his performance, and the overall performance of the defense.