The Dak Thread **merged**

[9darter]

I have been a proponent of a wait-and-see approach with Prescott because he's only in his third year as a starter. I felt we'd have a better pulse on who he is as a starting quarterback by the end of this season.

You could see his many flaws even in 2016, but people won't admit that or they didn't take a close enough look. Get the win and people abandon any level of criticism to convince themselves they are true and good fans. Which is pathetic.

Dak's game is as flawed as his scouting report says it is. On top of that it seems he's regressed mentally.

He deserves to start for the remainder of the season, that's my opinion. I don't think they have anything in White or Cooper. After that, you do whatever to draft your new QB.

 

[Brax]

Another armchair QB.

what does Troy know about throwing the ball? HA HA too funny I love your point it's right on

 

[erod]

I hope it means nothing! Dak has not earned an extension in my mind. If they’re hell bent on Dak, let him ride it out on his rookie deal.

They have him next year for cheap, too. Jerry is going to say that because, even if they draft a QB, they need to Dak to be Tyrod Taylor for a while.

I just wish they'd let Mike White play once this season gets away. That would at least be intriguing.

 

[PA Cowboy Fan]

I do not remember it that way, in fact was a pro bowler in 3rd year got better each year not worse.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/A/AikmTr00.htm

I never had any problem with Troy those first 3 years. The team was just awful and he grew better each year. I guess if the internet was around back then some would have called him a bust.

 

[gimmesix]

He has regressed over the past 2 plus seasons with the rest of the offense. Look at how bad that OL is. Look at how much Dez slipped. The WR unit as a whole is getting worse. Hurns was a good player in Jacksonville, now he is invisible. Zeke was bst as a rookie.

The DCs in the league know exactly what Dallas is doing on offense. Exactly. Tough to be a QB under this scenario.

I agree that some of the problems are not all about him. In fact, I think everyone agrees that the problems on offense extend beyond the QB.

However, I think some are also working too hard to explain away Dak's problems. At this point, we should be seeing signs that he's not going to be off target when he has time and his receivers are open, which happened several times Sunday.

If the line doesn't hold up and it causes him to throw high, low or wide, that should be recognized. If a receiver can't get open and he throws wide, high or low, it should be acknowledged. It's the time when he's given a clean pocket and has a receiver open that he has to make a play. Instead, he missed on those and then made a spectacular escape that seems to make many overlook those failures.

If Dak was completing every pass he should have, then I'd still be in wait-and-see mode. Instead, we fairly explained any time he was off on his throws as a rookie as him needing to work on his technique. We explained him being more off on his throws his second season as him being shellshocked from poor pass protection as well as blaming the receivers. Now, we're blaming the pass protection and receivers again. Is there some truth to that? Absolutely. But there's a lot of blame that belongs on No. 4's shoulders ... enough for me to conclude that he's not the starting QB we need unless the conditions are pretty much ideal.

 

[erod]

Troy Aikman squarely identities Dak Prescott's accuracy as a problem:

Even Troy is finally turning away from Dak.

Troy went all-in on Dak befor the 2017 season, so he towed the line on this. But now, it's just getting silly. Dak is indefensible.

Those aren't NFL throws. You can count his good throws on one hand every game. It should be, you can't count his BAD throws on one hand.

I watched Brees last night and just laughed at the disparity.

 

[gimmesix]

You could see his many flaws even in 2016, but people won't admit that or they didn't take a close enough look. Get the win and people abandon any level of criticism to convince themselves they are true and good fans. Which is pathetic.

Dak's game is as flawed as his scouting report says it is. On top of that it seems he's regressed mentally.

He deserves to start for the remainder of the season, that's my opinion. I don't think they have anything in White or Cooper. After that, you do whatever to draft your new QB.

He certainly had flaws. His technique would get sloppy when the conditions were not perfect. However, he was a rookie fourth-round QB, so it was possible those flaws could be fixed.

I think there was reason not to crown him franchise QB after that performance because of the flaws, but there was reasons to believe he could be the starter if he developed.

Troy Aikman was flawed as a rookie starting quarterback. Romo was flawed when he was inserted as a starter. Jared Goff looked like he might be a bust when he stepped in as the starter for the LA Rams.

Being a quality starter isn't about how you start your career, but how you develop. Prescott has taken steps back instead of forward.

 

[PA Cowboy Fan]

He certainly had flaws. His technique would get sloppy when the conditions were not perfect. However, he was a rookie fourth-round QB, so it was possible those flaws could be fixed.

I think there was reason not to crown him franchise QB after that performance because of the flaws, but there was reasons to believe he could be the starter if he developed.

Troy Aikman was flawed as a rookie starting quarterback. Romo was flawed when he was inserted as a starter. Jared Goff looked like he might be a bust when he stepped in as the starter for the LA Rams.

Being a quality starter isn't about how you start your career, but how you develop. Prescott has taken steps back instead of forward.

And that's what's troubling. He should be getting better.

 

[gimmesix]

I don't agree with playing White this early in the season, but I agree with your overall assessment of Dak. Sigh.

That's understandable, and I don't expect it to happen. I'd just rather see what we've got there before we use a pick on the position.

If Dak continues to have games like this one and the front office finally accepts the fact that he's not a franchise QB, then we're going to use a premium pick on the position, which means that White would be relegated to backup. The only way he'll get a shot to prove if he can be the starter is if we put him in there.

Now, maybe we do that later in the season, but I'd like to at least give him half a season to settle in and give us a good feel for whether he can be the solution. I'd expect it to be a lot like the preseason, where he started off shaky and then progressed. He needs to be given enough time to get past being a rookie.

 

[gimmesix]

Dak had one of the best rookies seasons of all time. He was plenty accurate, very accurate on the move, and ran for 6 TDs.

He was generally accurate til the Atlanta game. And has rarely been since. People say Dak got figured out, but I don't think teams figure out your accuracy into crap. They figure out your offense, which is on the OC.

We should have dumped Linehan, and gotten a new OC and a real QB coach this offseason. Evaluating Dak under a poor OC coaching regime reveals little about Dak, but that he can be screwed by poor coaching.

We made the wrong call on keeping Linehan, and until we rectify that, we're not moving ahead to either improve or accurately evaluate Dak. First things first. Get a decent play caller in here.

This makes me think about Quincy Carter. When Bill Parcells became Dallas' head coach, he inherited Carter and wanted to see what he had before moving on. Carter played about the same as he had under the previous regime and Parcells wasted a year of his short time here trying to figure if Carter's issues were not his fault. If he had known exactly what kind of player Carter was, then he could have moved forward more quickly with finding the right QB.

You can't blame Linehan for plays where the protection holds up and the receivers are open and Prescott misses them. If Dak hits those passes, the outcome of the Carolina and Houston games (in particulare) would have been different and those of us without an agenda against him would be saying he's going in the right direction.

 

[gimmesix]

I never had any problem with Troy those first 3 years. The team was just awful and he grew better each year. I guess if the internet was around back then some would have called him a bust.

There's no doubt. He would have been subject to the same kind of internet criticism that Romo unfairly received.

Some criticism of Prescott also has been unfair because you can't decide in a player's rookie season what he's going to turn into. Players do actually develop. Troy had a terrible rookie season on a terrible team. The next year he was a little better. The next year, he was a lot better becoming pretty much the player we would see throughout his time year.

Dak had an unbelievable rookie year (even with his technique issues), setting an unrealistic standard for his play. Some drop-off was a realistic expectation, but the drop-off was more than it should have been. This year, the decline has been steeper. He's missing open receivers and not reading the defense as well as he should be at this point in his career.

The conditions are certainly not the same as they were his rookie year, but the question is whether he's doing as well as he should with the things he can control, and he's not.

 

[Whyjerry]

I agree that some of the problems are not all about him. In fact, I think everyone agrees that the problems on offense extend beyond the QB.

However, I think some are also working too hard to explain away Dak's problems. At this point, we should be seeing signs that he's not going to be off target when he has time and his receivers are open, which happened several times Sunday.

If the line doesn't hold up and it causes him to throw high, low or wide, that should be recognized. If a receiver can't get open and he throws wide, high or low, it should be acknowledged. It's the time when he's given a clean pocket and has a receiver open that he has to make a play. Instead, he missed on those and then made a spectacular escape that seems to make many overlook those failures.

If Dak was completing every pass he should have, then I'd still be in wait-and-see mode. Instead, we fairly explained any time he was off on his throws as a rookie as him needing to work on his technique. We explained him being more off on his throws his second season as him being shellshocked from poor pass protection as well as blaming the receivers. Now, we're blaming the pass protection and receivers again. Is there some truth to that? Absolutely. But there's a lot of blame that belongs on No. 4's shoulders ... enough for me to conclude that he's not the starting QB we need unless the conditions are pretty much ideal.

The guy is beat up. Imagine how frustrating it is to be the QB of this mess. Just remember the rookie year. No one was complaining about Dak or accuracy then. That player still exists. The facade around him has fallen down though.

 

[Denim Chicken]

And that's what's troubling. He should be getting better.

His WR corps, O-Line, TE group, & coaching gets progressively worse and we wonder why he's not getting better.

 

[gimmesix]

The guy is beat up. Imagine how frustrating it is to be the QB of this mess. Just remember the rookie year. No one was complaining about Dak or accuracy then. That player still exists. The facade around him has fallen down though.

Few quarterbacks play in the type of conditions Prescott had in 2016. The line played about as well as a line can. The running game was the No. 1 concern of defenses. Defenses had not seen enough of the way we were using Beasley as an outlet receiver to put a stop to that.

Dak has some technique flaws then, but it was easy to overlook them. It's natural that he would regress some without the rest of the offense playing up to those 2016 standards, but he's got to be good on the plays where the rest of the offense does its job. Too often he has not been.

 

[PA Cowboy Fan]

His WR corps, O-Line, TE group, & coaching gets progressively worse and we wonder why he's not getting better.

His accuracy isn't though. I'm seeing a lot of high throws.

 

[Whyjerry]

Few quarterbacks play in the type of conditions Prescott had in 2016. The line played about as well as a line can. The running game was the No. 1 concern of defenses. Defenses had not seen enough of the way we were using Beasley as an outlet receiver to put a stop to that.

Dak has some technique flaws then, but it was easy to overlook them. It's natural that he would regress some without the rest of the offense playing up to those 2016 standards, but he's got to be good on the plays where the rest of the offense does its job. Too often he has not been.

Technique flaws are vision and feet. He misses opportunities, sometimes, because he is not always looking downfield. He rarely sets his feet to deliver a pass. Why? For almost a calendar year the guy has been pulverized. He is a stout guy so he can take a hit but it has taken its toll. Watch the last play of the Houston game. You will see something pretty rare. While Dak is scrambling to make the Hail Mary throw he turns his head completely around. I mean he looks at the opposite end zone. He does this because he is fearful of someone coming from behind to mash him. Houston was in max coverage yet he is so worried about the pass rush he took the time to look. The guy is gun shy. Rightly so.

 

[gimmesix]

Technique flaws are vision and feet. He misses opportunities, sometimes, because he is not always looking downfield. He rarely sets his feet to deliver a pass. Why? For almost a calendar year the guy has been pulverized. He is a stout guy so he can take a hit but it has taken its toll. Watch the last play of the Houston game. You will see something pretty rare. While Dak is scrambling to make the Hail Mary throw he turns his head completely around. I mean he looks at the opposite end zone. He does this because he is fearful of someone coming from behind to mash him. Houston was in max coverage yet he is so worried about the pass rush he took the time to look. The guy is gun shy. Rightly so.

Doesn't matter if he's gun shy. This is the NFL. You've got to bring it every week or you're out.

He's missing throws he has to make, and that's not good enough for the starting quarterback of this team.

Plenty of QBs are pulverized and still come back to complete the throws they should be completing. When the line breaks down and the receivers aren't open, then blame them. When Dak has time and an open receiver, then he deserves the blame, no matter how gun shy he is.

 

[Irvin88_4life]

I do not remember it that way, in fact he was a pro bowler in 3rd year got better each year not worse.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/A/AikmTr00.htm

His 3rd year he had 10 TDs and 11 picks...... Can you imagine if Dak had a season like that. Dak first 2 seasons have been much better than Aikmans and it's not even close.

 

[irishline]

His WR corps, O-Line, TE group, & coaching gets progressively worse and we wonder why he's not getting better.

Mostly agree with you on the O-Line (though I feel it is somewhat overblown because any line will eventually breakdown if a QB holds the ball for an average of 3.1 seconds). I completely agree about coaching. And mostly agree about the tight end situation (though people on this board downplayed Witten the last few years and said he was a shell of himself that could easily be replaced). That said I do not agree on the WR corps. I agree they are not a good unit, but let me ask you this:

Wide receiver group:
2018 - Hurns, Gallop, Butler, Williams, Beasley, Austin, Thompson
2016 - Bryant, Butler, Williams, Beasley, Whitehead

Much of this board said that Bryant has been trash since 2015. With that said is it really different? Or was Bryant that much better than we give him credit for? I heard over and over again that Hurns could easily replace what Byrant did. What did Whitehead do that Austin hasn't? Austin has already made more plays in 5 games than Whitehead did his whole career here.

So if players that accounted for 72% of WR receptions on 2016 are still on this team, and Bryant sucked, how are they "progressively worse" without some outside force effecting that? IMHO, Yes the OL, TE, and coaching is a part of it, but the QB (as a constant) has to also be a part of that equation. If he himself is regressing, this could also help make the WR's (and possibly other units) look progressively worse as well. Its a somewhat symbiotic relationship that can be tricky to define as they are all dependent upon each other to succeed or fail.

 

[Brax]

Just give Dak the entire season. We need to be sure before we move on.[/QUOT

His 3rd year he had 10 TDs and 11 picks...... Can you imagine if Dak had a season like that. Dak first 2 seasons have been much better than Aikmans and it's not even close.

12 games pro bowl and playoffs, not sure you understand Aikman got better every year Dak gets worse every year can you say RGIII , would everyone on this board who would take Dak over Aikman for the first 3 years please post it here, I can believe it will be many in fact may only be you. I can not believe you really believe it.