The Garrett bashing is trite, tired, and lacking in truth

[DandyDon52]

Im not piling on Garrett, but if he is the same coach he was last year, than he is the same coach he was for three straight 8-8 seasons. Clearly he is not completely at fault for the teams stupidity and lack of execution, but, just like he got a ton of kudos last season, he deserves a share of the blame this season. This team has looked mentally unequipped and unprepared. Call it what you want, but that falls to the coach.

I agree.
not a bg JG fan, but I feel for him in a way, because he desperately wanted to keep Murray. He was the only one to talk to murray at the end,
and then that fell thru, and jerry got DMC and said here you go, just as good as murray lol.
Now callahan leaving may have been jasons fault.
But JG doesnt have the team he wanted, which was last years team.
Then the injuries start, and he wasnt prepared for all this and it shows.
Now the thing to watch is how he deals with it. So far not too good, but season is young.

 

[texbumthelife]

I agree.
not a bg JG fan, but I feel for him in a way, because he desperately wanted to keep Murray. He was the only one to talk to murray at the end,
and then that fell thru, and jerry got DMC and said here you go, just as good as murray lol.
Now callahan leaving may have been jasons fault.
But JG doesnt have the team he wanted, which was last years team.
Then the injuries start, and he wasnt prepared for all this and it shows.
Now the thing to watch is how he deals with it. So far not too good, but season is young.

I don't think there is any question, if Garrett went to Jerry and Stephen and said he wanted to keep Murray at all costs, that he was integral, Murray wouldn't be here. I am not saying Garrett didn't want Murray, but I think he trusted his offensive line and his scouting department to cover up the loss.

 

[ShiningStar]

I don't think there is any question, if Garrett went to Jerry and Stephen and said he wanted to keep Murray at all costs, that he was integral, Murray wouldn't be here. I am not saying Garrett didn't want Murray, but I think he trusted his offensive line and his scouting department to cover up the loss.

Im not saying its true or not, but if it true, than Garrett clearly has NO say or no understanding of anything of the outside of being a back QB.

1) I dont care we let Murray walk.

How we went about it was the problem. D Mac? Could have found better. Trading for C Michael, only because each other failed move put us there.

2) Was the line as good as advertised?

Clearly not, and Garrett should have been on top of that. Am I against the Pollack signing? no, im willing to give him time as Callahan needed time. It should have been made REAL clear, they were going to need other runners to run behind the line and know for fact, Romo and Murray made the line better than what they were. And this should end al debates about that.

 

[texbumthelife]

Im not saying its true or not, but if it true, than Garrett clearly has NO say or no understanding of anything of the outside of being a back QB.

1) I dont care we let Murray walk.

How we went about it was the problem. D Mac? Could have found better. Trading for C Michael, only because each other failed move put us there.

2) Was the line as good as advertised?

Clearly not, and Garrett should have been on top of that. Am I against the Pollack signing? no, im willing to give him time as Callahan needed time. It should have been made REAL clear, they were going to need other runners to run behind the line and know for fact, Romo and Murray made the line better than what they were. And this should end al debates about that.

My problem is Pollack doesn't have a history of success as an offensive line coach. I think they trusted their talent enough on the line to give him time to mature. I don't think it's all his fault but I definitely think losing Callahan has hurt us and Pollack hasn't adjusted well.

 

[erod]

Well, we're not really talking about performance numbers, per se, but rather the frequency we call play action because I agree with your earlier statement that Romo is a great PA QB. But what the number do tell me and my initial point to you was that we haven't used PA enough with Romo. But the guy is just as successful without PA as he is with PA. Romo is incredible and the fact that Garrett doesn't know how to use him or consistently win with him is an indictment on Garrett.

Also, I don't know where you are on the Weeden spectrum but I wonder if you've defended his 100 plus QB rating, you know, since numbers don't prove much of anything to you.



In 2014, they don't show the PA rates by down and the numbers remain fairly constant:

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2015/2014-play-action-offense

"A couple changes to this year's article: We aren't showing play-action rates by down, because they have essentially remained constant for five years, particularly on second and third down. On the big table below, we're also not fleshing out the details by listing both play-action DVOA that includes scrambles and play-action DVOA that doesn't include scrambles, because you have probably fallen asleep reading this sentence. This year's play-action DVOA listed below always includes both passes and scrambles. The only team with a DVOA difference greater than 4% was the New York Jets"

My point is this. I watch every down of Cowboys football, and playaction is a critical part of the offensive playcalling.

Also, Romo makes a lot of checks at the line of scrimmage. Playcalls are changed frequently. That article didn't account for that either.

 

[Dodger12]

My point is this. I watch every down of Cowboys football, and playaction is a critical part of the offensive playcalling.

Well welcome to a Cowboys message board....we all watch football...every down so I'm not sure what makes you so special except for the fact that I watch the game and it sounds like you watch for glimpses of Garrett on sidelines.

And I'm not sure how you claim play action is critical to our offense when A) we're near the bottom of list in PA attempts and B) we rarely ran the ball under Garrett's tenure as HC. If you're not going to run the ball, then PA probably isn't part of your philosophy.

Also, Romo makes a lot of checks at the line of scrimmage. Playcalls are changed frequently. That article didn't account for that either.

So are you saying that we may PA more but Romo checks out of it?

 

[PA Cowboy Fan]

I agree.
not a bg JG fan, but I feel for him in a way, because he desperately wanted to keep Murray. He was the only one to talk to murray at the end,
and then that fell thru, and jerry got DMC and said here you go, just as good as murray lol.
Now callahan leaving may have been jasons fault.
But JG doesnt have the team he wanted, which was last years team.
Then the injuries start, and he wasnt prepared for all this and it shows.
Now the thing to watch is how he deals with it. So far not too good, but season is young.

I was very critical of Garrett during those 8-8 years. I didn't like like how sloppy this team looked early in the season. But I just don't see how you can judge him now. This season just might be a wash.

 

[texbumthelife]

I was very critical of Garrett during those 8-8 years. I didn't like like how sloppy this team looked early in the season. But I just don't see how you can judge him now. This season just might be a wash.

This season definitely isn't a wash, but this team should have at least one more win. We should benefit from being in a horrible division this year. Just keep winning division games and we could be this years Carolina. With our talent, if everyone is back by then, anything can happen in the playoffs.

 

[erod]

Well welcome to a Cowboys message board....we all watch football...every down so I'm not sure what makes you so special except for the fact that I watch the game and it sounds like you watch for glimpses of Garrett on sidelines.

And I'm not sure how you claim play action is critical to our offense when A) we're near the bottom of list in PA attempts and B) we rarely ran the ball under Garrett's tenure as HC. If you're not going to run the ball, then PA probably isn't part of your philosophy.

So are you saying that we may PA more but Romo checks out of it?

1. If you run a play action and go 80 yards for a touchdown, that counts as one attempt. If you run it three times and punt, that counts as three attempts. Which is more desirable?

2. Demarco Murray set a Cowboys record for rushing attempts and yards last season. Once the blokes were in place up front to run, Garrett did.

3. Romo is almost Peyton like. He sets the offense constantly and checks into plays that will work. He's reached that elite level of understanding.

 

[Dodger12]

1. If you run a play action and go 80 yards for a touchdown, that counts as one attempt. If you run it three times and punt, that counts as three attempts. Which is more desirable?

In this scenario your percentages (of play action) would go up since you had one attempt with one play action.

2. Demarco Murray set a Cowboys record for rushing attempts and yards last season. Once the blokes were in place up front to run, Garrett did.

Oh, I see. So he didn't run because he didn't have the horses so he passed more, thus exposing his franchise QB to greater risk of injury with a weaker line, by your description. This stuff makes no sense. None.

 

[erod]

Oh, I see. So he didn't run because he didn't have the horses so he passed more, thus exposing his franchise QB to greater risk of injury with a weaker line, by your description. This stuff makes no sense. None.

And you think running completely out of futility to protect your QB, essentially forfeiting games, does makes sense?

OK.

 

[Dodger12]

And you think running completely out of futility to protect your QB, essentially forfeiting games, does makes sense?

OK.

So if a team doesn't have 1st round pick studs across the OL then running is futile and they shouldn't do it? Got it. Not every team has stud Pro-Bowl linemen but they still run. We didn't have to be first, but we shouldn't have last or close to it in terms of attempts.

 

[cowboyblue22]

Atlanta threw there line together and wow can they run the ball but they a nfl quality running back so that makes a difference

 

[Zman5]

My point is this. I watch every down of Cowboys football, and playaction is a critical part of the offensive playcalling.

Also, Romo makes a lot of checks at the line of scrimmage. Playcalls are changed frequently. That article didn't account for that either.

How dow you know Romo didn't check in to a PA play? If you think it is possible that he checked out of a PA play that was callled, it is entire possible also that Romo checked in to a PA play that wasn't called. It goes both ways.

 

[texbumthelife]

Atlanta threw there line together and wow can they run the ball but they a nfl quality running back so that makes a difference

They have two rookie running backs. They have a great scheme and a great QB who loves to throw downfield. You can't stack the box against them.

 

[ufcrules1]

They have two rookie running backs. They have a great scheme and a great QB who loves to throw downfield. You can't stack the box against them.

They have one rookie and one 2nd year player and both are better than anything we have.

 

[texbumthelife]

They have one rookie and one 2nd year player and both are better than anything we have.

I don't think it's possible at this point to credibly make those claims. I can guarantee you, with Romo and Dez in the game there are no more 8 man ronts and Randle and McFadden both looks worlds better. Atlanta has Matt Ryan and Julio Jones to keep safeties back and keep teams from stacking the box.

You can play the grass is greener all you want. You can even state your preference. The game are not played in a vacuum though and their circumstances are significantly different than ours, therefor it's impossible to draw any hard conclusions at this point.

 

[punchnjudy]

If I was hiring a head coach, aside from experience I would mainly be interested in how intelligent and driven they were. They all want to win, but the guys who are truly driven will go to any lengths to build/develop a successful team. That means pushing the front office for the right players, the right assistants, always pushing to get whatever help is needed, and being demanding of the players as well. It also means being intelligent enough to know what to push for.

People will sometimes say a coach with *sustained* success was lucky because he had this player or that player; I say people who impose their will tend to be very lucky in this world. On the surface, Parcells and Landry had little in common, but in reality they both had a strong desire to control their players, albeit in different ways. They both imposed their will. Actually, Landry was undoubtedly the more controlling and demanding the two; he just wasn't as boisterous. In fact, he may have been too restrictive in terms of how he controlled his players on the field. There's no doubt that Jimmy was very demanding, and few people doubt that he took over the football operations of this franchise, getting the players and coaches that he wanted.

I don't think of Garrett in the same vein as the elite coaches. I do think he's intelligent enough to recognize how a football team should be built and how an organization should be run, and I've gotten the impression that he's driven enough to impose his will here to a good extent (certainly moreso than the likes of Barry, Campo, or Gailey). Overall, I'm fine with him, but I would be very surprised if he ends up in Canton.

 

[ufcrules1]

I don't think it's possible at this point to credibly make those claims. I can guarantee you, with Romo and Dez in the game there are no more 8 man ronts and Randle and McFadden both looks worlds better. Atlanta has Matt Ryan and Julio Jones to keep safeties back and keep teams from stacking the box.

You can play the grass is greener all you want. You can even state your preference. The game are not played in a vacuum though and their circumstances are significantly different than ours, therefor it's impossible to draw any hard conclusions at this point.

Would you take Devonta Freeman over Randle or DMC right now? I would in a second.

 

[ShiningStar]

Shouldn't this be in the rant zone?????

not a rant, more of a low grumble.