The Roy Myth Thread

[AdamJT13]

Imagine if Demarcus Ware turned into a 5-7 sack a season guy and the sacks he did get were from garbage time.

That is the equivalent to what Roy has done because he was a Demarcus Ware type player/presence for us in the secondary.

Imagine if Ware led all linebackers with 15 sacks one season, then had six sacks the next season.

 

[AbeBeta]

I'm a big fan of Roy but I have to admit Roy has not been the intimidating factor as he was. I'm not seeing the big hits right now. I don't know if the fines he has gotten has been a reason for this but the massive hits have not been happening for a couple of seasons now.

People are going to point to this and say that only unknowledgeable fans point to big hits.

But those hits are something you can't measure. They make guys afraid to come over the middle. They make skill players more cautious. They get the rest of the defense pumped. They get the fans pumped. All of this is HUGE. All of this has been absent.

 

[CATCH17]

Imagine if Ware led all linebackers with 15 sacks one season, then had six sacks the next season.

Would he still be making big plays in that 6 sack season or would he vanish?

Would offensive tackles and Quarterbacks still feel his presence or would they go after him more?

 

[Doomsday101]

People are going to point to this and say that only unknowledgeable fans point to big hits.

But those hits are something you can't measure. They make guys afraid to come over the middle. They make skill players more cautious. They get the rest of the defense pumped. They get the fans pumped. All of this is HUGE. All of this has been absent.

No doubt about it. I like Roy and all I want is for him to get back to his former self and that is an intimidating force in the secondary. I don't expect him to be the ball hawking FS but when a WR comes over the middle and makes a catch I expect Roy to punish him because it will force the alligator arms and WR being a bit more tentative about crossing this area

 

[Bach]

Call me a cynic, stash. It's just something I've observed, when a player goes from fan favorite to persona non grata to fans, it doesn't matter what he does on the field from that point forward. Guy could have the best season ever and he'll still be dogged out.

:laugh2:

That's not even close to being true.

 

[bbgun]

I don't know. It appears to me that he still has very good forward and lateral speed. I remember Hamlin's pick of Eli last year at the Meadowlands, and there was this streak of white running down the field ahead of him. It wasn't until the end of the play that I realized it was Roy. Of course, he had a costly personal foul earlier in the game which led to points, so the bad tends to cancel out the good.

 

[NinePointOh]

From what I saw early from him in his career he should be getting mentioned right now with some of the best safeties ever to play.

And darn, at the old age of 27, he's "just" a perennial Pro Bowler.

Being a pro bowler lost a lot of its credibility along time ago.

The point wasn't to extol the majesty of the Pro Bowl. It was to point out the fallacy of lamenting that a 27-year-old who, by any objective analysis, is and has typically been one of the best in the league at his position isn't already one of the greatest ever. Pro Bowl or no Pro Bowl, and despite having one year of production below his own standard, that's what Roy is.

 

[JohnnyHopkins]

Agreed. Which is why I think when a player polarizes the fans so much, it's not really worth it anymore to really discuss, because people have drawn a line in the sand and everyone thinks their position is "objective" and "realistic"

I would certainly be willing to change my mind if someone could provide me with something that would do so. I want to believe in Roy Williams again.

In my eyes, Roy used to be a player that caused teams to fear throwing across the middle, a difference maker that made running backs look for his number when they hit the line of scrimmage. What I see now is just an average to above average Safety that is still a good tackler, but not one that teams fear running into and a player that the opposition seems to look at as a liability in the defensive passing game.

 

[AdamJT13]

Of course, he had a costly personal foul earlier in the game which led to points

Don't try starting another myth. That penalty was on Bradie James (pushing Brandon Jacobs after the play was over). Roy wasn't flagged at all in that game.

 

[chinch]

it's amazing the Roy defense force is still operational.

makes you wonder if some of his handlers (ie. management, etc.) are involved posting here trying to sell him for next year when he'll be DUMPED from the boys.

never too early for spin.

 

[AdamJT13]

trying to sell him for next year when he'll be DUMPED from the boys.

Why won't they "DUMP" him this year?

 

[Rampage]

Why won't they "DUMP" him this year?

what money would we save if we dumped him this year or next year?
what cap hit would we take if we dumped him this year or next?
maybe jerry wants to see if Roy can become a top player again instead of an average one.

 

[chinch]

Why won't they "DUMP" him this year?

same reason you're carrying on pretending he plays like a deserving probowler. ROTF.

HUGE INVESTMENT, AFRAID TO LOOK FOOLISH, FEAR OF THE UNKNOWN.

plus the whole "new defense theory". coaches know he's a football dummy.. might take 2 years to learn what others learn in 2 months.

Jerruh already paid for this BAD GAMBLE (and bone-headed contract extension) so why not ride it out a little more. They paid alot of $$$$, will take a cap hit and they HOPE (ie. pray for miracle) he won't be beaten like a mule again and again.

that's why.

ps - and 'cause tuna disrespected the secondary positions generally speaking (lets get more LBers and bench-warming TEs)

 

[bbgun]

Don't try starting another myth. That penalty was on Bradie James (pushing Brandon Jacobs after the play was over). Roy wasn't flagged at all in that game.

Gee, I guess I'll have to settle for the fact that he gave up the TD to Shockey. Or have you found yet another convenient patsy? If you weren't such an incorrigible extremist, you'd have noticed that my post was largely complimentary, whereas you pay mere lip service to Roy's flaws. You don't want "fairness"; you want adulation. Not gonna happen, stat king. Go kiss that photo of Roy under your pillow and take a nap.

http://img293.*************/img293/8352/075609275wq3.jpg

 

[iceberg]

it's amazing the Roy defense force is still operational.

makes you wonder if some of his handlers (ie. management, etc.) are involved posting here trying to sell him for next year when he'll be DUMPED from the boys.

never too early for spin.

it's also amazing how the bash-roy force doesn't need facts to bash. i'm not saying all adam is saying is godspeak factual, but when bbboy runs around calling roy out for a foul and adam comes back and says roy was (edit) NOT (/edit) flagged, now what?

someone is lying to serve a purpose. who?

simply look - was he flagged in the game in question above? if yes, adam is wrong. if no, bbboy and the entire hate parade screaming that myth is gone.

since adam rarely interjects emotion in to what he posts, i'll go with what he says vs. the whinepatrol.

now bbgunner, feel free to find a link that shows roy was flagged that game or just say "oops" and we'll all move on.

 

[iceberg]

Gee, I guess I'll have to settle for the fact that he gave up the TD to Shockey. Or have you found yet another convenient patsy? If you weren't such an incorrigible extremist, you'd have noticed that my post was largely complimentary, whereas you pay mere lip service to Roy's flaws. You don't want "fairness"; you want adulation. Not gonna happen, stat king. Go kiss that photo of Roy under your pillow and take a nap.

so much for being able to say you were wrong about the penalty you were harping on about. fyi, adults when found they were propping up an argument with a lie would chill out for a bit on things. not you, however.

roy-bashers motto: when one myth is shot down, quickly run to another and never EVER let the bashing end!

 

[chinch]

it's also amazing how the bash-roy force doesn't need facts to bash. i'm not saying all adam is saying is godspeak factual, but when bbboy runs around calling roy out for a foul and adam comes back and says roy was flagged, now what?

someone is lying to serve a purpose. who?

Remember that homophobic note Roy left in the lockerroom for JJT? that sums up Roy in every way.

adam's credibility on Roy is as low as it gets, sorry. below zilch... lower than Roy himself, who is just flat out just a dummy. Adam shows no signs of being an idiot, just totally irrational if you type Roy Williams and something other than praise here on the board.

the roy defense field is now like a tired, badly worn comedy. extreme skins art-like bad. YMMV.

 

[bbgun]

so much for being able to say he was wrong.

roy-bashers motto: when one myth is shot down, quickly run to another and never EVER let the bashing end!

Correct. I originally credited him with a penalty he never made and overlooked the Shockey TD. Then I made amends. Did I get credit for noting his speed and hustle? Um, no. The original point stands: there's no dearth of bad plays to choose from which cancel out the good ones. When that happens, you're "average"--a very generous adjective considering he was suspended for an entire game. Anything else he does falls under "just doing what's expected of you." No pat on the head needed or warranted.

Btw, you really need to stop conflating "criticism" with "bashing." Very annoying.

 

[dallasfaniac]

Remember that homophobic note Roy left in the lockerroom for JJT? that sums up Roy in every way.

adam's credibility on Roy is as low as it gets, sorry. below zilch... lower than Roy himself, who is just flat out just a dummy. Adam shows no signs of being an idiot, just totally irrational if you type Roy Williams and something other than praise here on the board.

the roy defense field is now like a tired, badly worn comedy. extreme skins art-like bad. YMMV.

I don't see what's the big deal. Some have posted lies and Adam has answered them with the truth. He has admitted that Roy Williams had a down year just like everyone else. What got your panties in a bunch? The fact that people can't pass off lies as the truth?

 

[iceberg]

Remember that homophobic note Roy left in the lockerroom for JJT? that sums up Roy in every way.

adam's credibility on Roy is as low as it gets, sorry. below zilch... lower than Roy himself, who is just flat out just a dummy. Adam shows no signs of being an idiot, just totally irrational if you type Roy Williams and something other than praise here on the board.

the roy defense field is now like a tired, badly worn comedy. extreme skins art-like bad. YMMV.

i'd have to think at this point anyone who doesn't join in on the witch hunt is called a witch or witch lover. it's the ancient story of mob mentality where you're right because you're on the side with all the screamers. those who don't get into the hunt for a variety of reasons *won't* have a whole lot of credibility to those who exist only TO bash roy at this point.

the simple fact of the matter is this:

bbboy: DAMN THAT PENALTY ON ROY THAT COST US!!!
adam: he was never flagged in that game, that was bradie james.
bbboy: oh - DAMN THAT ROY FOR GIVING UP A TD!!!!

and you're upset with *adams* credibility? the reason i listen to him more is simply because he does not engage in the "witch hunt" and has taken the opposite approach - you list the "fact" i'll show you otherwise if not true.

just look at bboy. those 3 lines up there are pretty much what we just saw. have one fact taken away lob up any other, true or not. if not true reach back into the roy williams hate bag and pull out any other excuse to keep you warm.

do you call that "credible" vs. what adam is doing?

i've not cared for roy ever since that mail you mention. i had 4 jerseys and put 'em all away and got some ware and romo ones. however, my own personal feelings for roy in that regard won't spill over to the lunacy i see happening now.

roy is not playing as well as he used to. roy is 1 bad tackle away from being gone say a month. roy is in a bad spot, yes.

but the witch hunt has magnified it beyond reasonable porportions usually because those doing the hunting are also members of the IGS - i want change and i want it NOW damn it. if they don't get it they whine daily for it then when it comes they're not happy till something else comes along to whine about.

in the end i don't give a damn if he's on the team another day or not much longer. but that's self-serving cause i'd LOVE for the whinefest to be over. but i also know the day he leaves the whinefest just finds a new target.

so forgive me if i don't follow the mob with my pitchfork and burning torch.

bbgun lobbed out a "fact"
he was proven wrong
he just lobbed out a different..."fact".

pretty amazing to me people will follow so blindly in a direction so unproven by made up facts which only exist to give credibility to a side which doesn't have it on it's own to the level they need it.