Thoughts about the Defense

[slomoxn]

the giants had guys like Osi, JPP, Tuck, etc. Do we have ANYONE of that caliber as a pass rusher at all?

Well they didn't look so good without each other and that wave of backups to rest them when they needed last year. With the new scheme here these guys I hope and think can play if not as well at least close to the production the Giants line gave them. As it stands we'll see but even they weren't who they were from a few short years ago.

 

[jobberone]

But the players they dumped like Ratliff and Ware were once considered shining examples of excellence. Some as recently as a year ago.

This staff's biggest problem is self scouting. It shows up every year.

The coaching and scheming is based off of what you think you have. If you think wrong, then whose fault is that?

The coaches have limited input as to the acquisition of talent. Most of that is on the scouting structure up to the top. For the most part they have to work with the players given to them although they have some input.

 

[jobberone]

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that in Year 2 of a new scheme, we'll improve. It also doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that as long as we're not starting guys that were delivering pizza's in August, we'll improve.

And people questioning the defensive staff can shove it. Marinelli was singlehandedly responsible for carrying Chicago to the playoffs nearly every season when their offense just gave Rice the ball 30 times a game.

It's also convenient how the haters forget that we went from being terrible in producing TO's to being one of the tops in the NFL in one season, with a historically bad defense.

Eberflus was Ryan's secret man crush and Henderson developed both Joe Haden and TJ Ward.

Can't wait for the epic backtracking when this defense turns out to be surprisingly decent.

What backtracking??? Crickets maybe.

 

[Verdict]

I haven't watched any footage on McClain...... do you believe if healthy, in shape, motivated, having his head screwed on straight that he might be able to be in the ballpark of Luke Kuechly? Or, more importantly, do you think he could meet or exceed the play of Sean Lee?

 

[CCBoy]

The coaches have limited input as to the acquisition of talent. Most of that is on the scouting structure up to the top. For the most part they have to work with the players given to them although they have some input.

Things have really evolved from when Jimmy Johnson and Jerry Jones arrived in Dallas.

Jimmy had just come from the collegiate ranks and had direct knowledge of most players as well as an established and talking relationship of most coaches in the Country.

Today's NFL Head Coach just finds it impossible to carry on a similar type of direct knowledge on players throughout the country. His coaching staff is hindered as well, keeping up with player changes and each week's opponent.

Now, Jason Garrett can't go to Jerry during the collegiate season, and tell him he needs Jerry's jet to evaluate several players at a single team's game. Jason is also limited in that he is not in that exchange of conversations, and is unable to just get on the phone and talk with a college coach to get his own feel.

Back when, Jimmy evaluated the given talent of a player, but actually had a personal feel of that player's motivation and how he would fit into the mix at Dallas.

For that kind of intimate as well as functional information on both collegiate and NFL talent, it now requires a very good and collected group within a team's scout department. That is why the current blend of experience and professional standards of the Cowboys' Scout Department is so important.

Things have changed since both Jimmy and Jerry first arrived in Dallas...

 

[xwalker]

I haven't watched any footage on McClain...... do you believe if healthy, in shape, motivated, having his head screwed on straight that he might be able to be in the ballpark of Luke Kuechly? Or, more importantly, do you think he could meet or exceed the play of Sean Lee?

If everything went perfectly mentally and he was in peak physical condition, then he has the talent to be as a Pro Bowl type player as a MLB in the base defense.

Lee and Kuechly are top performers in both the base and the Nickel. I don't know if McClain will ever be a top Nickel LB.

 

[jobberone]

Things have really evolved from when Jimmy Johnson and Jerry Jones arrived in Dallas.

Jimmy had just come from the collegiate ranks and had direct knowledge of most players as well as an established and talking relationship of most coaches in the Country.

Today's NFL Head Coach just finds it impossible to carry on a similar type of direct knowledge on players throughout the country. His coaching staff is hindered as well, keeping up with player changes and each week's opponent.

Now, Jason Garrett can't go to Jerry during the collegiate season, and tell him he needs Jerry's jet to evaluate several players at a single team's game. Jason is also limited in that he is not in that exchange of conversations, and is unable to just get on the phone and talk with a college coach to get his own feel.

Back when, Jimmy evaluated the given talent of a player, but actually had a personal feel of that player's motivation and how he would fit into the mix at Dallas.

For that kind of intimate as well as functional information on both collegiate and NFL talent, it now requires a very good and collected group within a team's scout department. That is why the current blend of experience and professional standards of the Cowboys' Scout Department is so important.

Things have changed since both Jimmy and Jerry first arrived in Dallas...

Yes it has changed. It takes a lot of work to get it done now. I wonder how much better it really is compared to 20 years ago.

 

[jobberone]

And yes @Alexander it takes the entire organization to acquire talent. One of the reasons I hope Jerry continues to fade out in that regards. That's assuming he is fading out.

 

[jobberone]

I haven't watched any footage on McClain...... do you believe if healthy, in shape, motivated, having his head screwed on straight that he might be able to be in the ballpark of Luke Kuechly? Or, more importantly, do you think he could meet or exceed the play of Sean Lee?

I'd rather see him at the Sam where his coverage liability is limited. He may be able to play 3 downs. In the end I don't care as long as we have three guys out there who can play well enough along with some depth. If he works out at the Mike as a 2 down LBer then great, too. It's hard to find a player who can play all three downs including the Nickel.

 

[Verdict]

The problem with the thought process that "we sucked last year so we will suck this year on defense" is flawed. Hypothetically speaking you could trot 10 pro bowlers out on the field and a paraplegic in the 11th spot and the defense would get torched on almost every play and the defense would be viewed as it sucks. But if you had those same 10 pro bowlers and added a mediocre NFL player in that 11th spot then you might easily be a top 5 defense.

In short, the defense we will field this year will be an entirely different creature than the one we fielded last year. The success of the offense, and the game plan we put in on offense and defense will affect the success of the defense and the defensive stats this year. Could we suck again? Yes, we could. Could we have great success this year? Of course. Time will tell how good we will be on defense this year ..... but the blanket statements made that we will suck on defense this year because we did last year don't make a lot of sense to me.

 

[gimmesix]

Here's my take

RDE
Lawrence - Probably won't be better than Ware was last year but could surprise.
Mincey - Should be better than any backup we put in there last year at this spot and possibly better than Lawrence at first due to experience ... but not sure that's saying much
Wildcard: Wilson - Probably won't make the team

LDE
Selvie - Should be about the same as his career year last year at best.
Crawford - Seems to have the chance to be the best of the bunch (other than Melton) if he isn't slow coming off injury and might outperform Melton
Wildcard: Rayford - Hasn't really stuck anywhere he's been, including the arena football levels

3-tech DT
Melton - Not sure an immediate return to Pro Bowl form should be expected, so fans will probably be a little disappointed in his numbers
Crawford - Probably will move inside next to Melton on passing downs, which could negate some of his effectiveness
Okoye - An undisclosed illness probably means we shouldn't count on him; probably a better chance that Ben Bass makes the team

1-tech DT
McClain - A player who seems to be receiving some hype that his career hasn't deserved to this point.
Bishop - Film on him is interesting, but he really just did what a potential NFL player should do on that college level
Coleman - Could be a surprise

WLB
Carter - Having been in the system for over a year could allow him to get back to playing fast and loose

MLB
McClain - Might not even show up in any kind of football shape
Durant - Didn't really show that he's anything more than an adequate backup

SLB
Holloman - Has a bit of a nose for the ball and could end up as the MLB starter by default
Wilber - Showed some ability to play this spot and could be a decent starter

CB 1
Carr - Needs to be given as many man opportunities as possible, but not matched up one-on-one with Calvin Johnson

CB 2
Scandrick - Was the best corner last year, but has to show he can stay on that level

CB 3
Claiborne - Good to hear he's looked good in OTAs because the ability is there for him to be a starter

Safety 1
Church - Understands the game well enough to be where he needs to be and comes up strong in run support

Safety 2
Wilcox - Too out of control last year. Has the speed and size to succeed, but only if he learns to be assignment sound
Matt Johnson - Probably will not be healthy and will lose this spot to Jeff Heath
Hamilton - Seems to be getting some praise, but wary to climb on board based off last year's preseason performance

 

[Fritsch_the_cat]

I try not to think about the defense. It gives me nightmares.

 

[jobberone]

I try not to think about the defense. It gives me nightmares.

Cheers to poster with one of the better sigs around. Love Fritsch, too. Kool Kat.

 

[mmohican29]

90+% of the problems are from not enough talent a lot of which last year was injury. If you get enough NFL talent on the field then you can begin to start evaluating the coaching on defense.

This.

The OP's point is valid. How much contribution did we get from DWare last year? I really and truly can't remember anything he did of note after the KC game. When Hatcher went down vs NO, and then Lee- it was a wrap.

You can't band aid a shotgun blast to the chest with the jags we had last year... on the other hand, when it looked like we had no talent left on the D in week 17- we played well.

Compensating for Hatcher's "over-performance" is the interesting part of the equation for me. It was unexpected. My feeling is we're deeper by a little bit now on the DLine with NFL quality lineman vs off the street players. Losing Lee is an absolute killer, but we've been there before several times and the team seems to win 8 or lose 8 ballgames despite great fluctuation of talent in the starting line up. It's who we are.

Or maybe it's who we were?

We're younger, faster and have guys with something to prove on D, and an Offense that might be top 5 in pro football.

If we get a DROY effort from a Demarcus Lawrence, if a Ty Crawford is ready to go next level, if Mo Claborne finds his game- there's no reason why we as fans should be cowering from our schedule. The team under Garrett has underachieved but it DOES compete.

Let's not wave the surrender flag just yet. I think the Cowboys D might come out swinging for a change.

 

[MWH1967]

So you're saying IF 12 players that each have an over 50% chance of being good (let's say...60% each?) are good...and they stay healthier than last season (so...let's say average or above average healthiness compared to the league...or a 50% probability)...then the defense will be "very good."

SO:

.6*.6*.6*.6*.6*.6*.6*.6*.6*.6*.6*.6*.5=

0.00108

Or...a 0.1% chance that the Cowboys will be "very good."

WHOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Realistically, the most probably scenario is that this is one of the worst defenses in the league. Very likely top 5 worst. In many ways, this defense could easily be worse than last year.

The hope will be that the offense can boost it...but obviously the Cowboys are a realistic contender to make the playoffs based on offense...they are not realistic contenders for more than that though.

dude, put down the "Red Bull" and back away....~No you stop it~

 

[TheDude]

And yes @Alexander it takes the entire organization to acquire talent. One of the reasons I hope Jerry continues to fade out in that regards. That's assuming he is fading out.

We're all fading out...some faster than others

 

[xwalker]

I'd rather see him at the Sam where his coverage liability is limited. He may be able to play 3 downs. In the end I don't care as long as we have three guys out there who can play well enough along with some depth. If he works out at the Mike as a 2 down LBer then great, too. It's hard to find a player who can play all three downs including the Nickel.

A LBs chance of playing in the Nickel (3 downs) is not dependent on whether he plays MLB or SLB in the base.

 

[jobberone]

A LBs chance of playing in the Nickel (3 downs) is not dependent on whether he plays MLB or SLB in the base.

I wasn't trying to imply that but I do feel the Sam has less coverage duties although obviously they all do some. I do think this defense requires a more mobile Mike than some 4-3 defenses do. However, all LBers have to run these days; and cover.

 

[Risen Star]

It's a ragtag group overall. Very pedestrian in the trenches. The front seven really lacks difference makers. Impact players. Guys you have to scheme around.

And let me dodge a few tomatoes here and say I don't like the coaching. Not a big In Rod We Trust guy. I don't like the scheme, the rushmen nonsense and I suspect will be making changes in the near future.

If you want some positive to sooth your sensitivities, the DL isn't in worse shape than the OL was in 3 years ago. Hopefully in a few years we'll see a similarly successful rebuild but it sure isn't happening in 2014.

 

[jobberone]

This.

The OP's point is valid. How much contribution did we get from DWare last year? I really and truly can't remember anything he did of note after the KC game. When Hatcher went down vs NO, and then Lee- it was a wrap.

You can't band aid a shotgun blast to the chest with the jags we had last year... on the other hand, when it looked like we had no talent left on the D in week 17- we played well.

Compensating for Hatcher's "over-performance" is the interesting part of the equation for me. It was unexpected. My feeling is we're deeper by a little bit now on the DLine with NFL quality lineman vs off the street players. Losing Lee is an absolute killer, but we've been there before several times and the team seems to win 8 or lose 8 ballgames despite great fluctuation of talent in the starting line up. It's who we are.

Or maybe it's who we were?

We're younger, faster and have guys with something to prove on D, and an Offense that might be top 5 in pro football.

If we get a DROY effort from a Demarcus Lawrence, if a Ty Crawford is ready to go next level, if Mo Claborne finds his game- there's no reason why we as fans should be cowering from our schedule. The team under Garrett has underachieved but it DOES compete.

Let's not wave the surrender flag just yet. I think the Cowboys D might come out swinging for a change.

Nice post. You need talent, execution, game plan, good defensive play calling, turnovers, luck and whatelsedidIforget.