Too many important loose ends right now

[KJJ]

Still doesn't make him elite.

In your opinion.

 

[erod]

I've seen every game Murray has played in college and the pros.

Is he elite? No. Is he slightly above average? No, he's better than that.

He's a good NFL back and a perfect teammate. He is a good fit for this offensive line, almost perfect. But his inability to break away makes him far from an $8 million dollar back. Instead of his 8-yard runs, Dallas will get 6. But instead of his 15-yard runs, Dallas will get 50.

And sadly for him, he'll languish in Philly unless they drastically change their offense. He's a 7-yard-deep tailback, not a read-option shotgun guy.

 

[big dog cowboy]

In your opinion.

Reading thru this thread packed full of Cowboy fans it seems I have a lot of company.

 

[KJJ]

In 2012

Alfred Morris: 1,613 yards and 13 TD's

Is Alfred Morris elite, or did he just put up elite production?

Morris's 1613 yards as a rookie was a fluke his numbers have declined every season since and he's never missed a game due to injury. One big reason he got all those rushing yards in 2012 was due to defenses having to worry about the duel threat RG3 brought. He put up 815 rushing yards himself that season which helped open things up for Morris. The worse RG3 has become the worse Morris has gotten it's gone hand in hand with those two. The read option played a big part in Morris's success his rookie year with defenses having to set their sights on RG3 who could bust one for 70 yards but now that his speed isn't the same and he's regressed as a QB Morris hasn't been as productive....coincidence? Morris wasn't even his teams MVP that season RG3 was he was the one who received rookie of the tear honors not Morris. Morris has never been near the receiving threat out of the backfield that Murray has been. He's never caught more than 17 passes while Murray has put up 110 catches the past 2 seasons for 766 yards which is almost identical to what Emmitt was producing as a receiver during the Cowboys championship seasons. Morris is not even close to the complete back Murray is.

Murray didn't start off with a bang his rookie year due to having a duel threat QB that defenses were keying on then begin to decline every year. He developed into the player he became in 2014. He only got 7 starts in 2011 and still produced 897 yards despite missing 3 games due to injury. He put up 601 yards in a 4 game stretch in a pass first offense that saw Romo put up almost 5000 yards. He set a franchise record 253 yards rushing behind a transitioning OL which is pretty impressive for a organization that's had 2 HOF RB's. Murray's 5.5 yards per carry that season was more than Morris's 4.8 yards per carry his rookie year. Had Murray started the 2011 season and not missed 3 games due to injury he would have had over 1300 yards. In 2012 Murray was hampered with some nagging injuries that limited his effectiveness then suffered an injury that cost him 6 games. Even with the injuries and 6 lost games he still put up 663 rushing yards and 35 catches.

In 2013 he produced 1121 rushing yards and again he was hampered with some nagging injuries and missed 2 games. He averaged 5.2 a carry that season while Morris has never averaged 5 yards a carry. We all saw last season what Murray could do if he could stay healthy and not miss games. He put up all those yards with a QB who was less mobile than he's ever been due coming off back surgery. Murray wasn't aided by a QB who put up over 800 yards rushing he carried the Cowboys offense. Washington never leaned on Morris in 2012 like the Cowboys leaned on Murray last season. If Morris becomes a FA we'll see if anyone offers him a 5 year $42M contract with $21M guaranteed. No one pays that kind of money for an RB in a pass happy league where RB's are being devalued if a back isn't elite and that wasn't even Murray's best offer.

 

[KJJ]

Reading thru this thread packed full of Cowboy fans it seems I have a lot of company.

This is a FAN board and most have been crapping on Murray ever since his fumble vs Green Bay and his signing with the hated Eagles. Do you honestly think a FAN base that booed Troy Aikman nearing the end of his career and pissed on Emmitt once he left is going to admit Murray is an elite back??? LOL Ever since the season ended many have been blaming his fumble on the loss to the Packers. Most have been tearing his game down claiming he has no vision or speed and that he left yards and TD's on the field in a year where he set a franchise rushing record out distancing his competition by over 500 yards. Ladainian Tomlinson called Murray an elite back and I trust his judgment more than I do a bunch of armchair FANS who are hating on him because they think he cost the team a playoff game and because he left the Cowboys for Philly. If you think several FANS backing your opinion makes you right you're kidding yourself.

 

[KJJ]

A Philly writer thinks Murray is an elite back and an article from USA today referred to him as an elite back. There's debate about it but there's many who think he is an elite back and I'm one who thinks he is. Naturally on a Cowboy FAN board he's going to look far less elite now that he's in Philly. Had he stayed with the Cowboys he would look a lot better to those who are dumping on him.

The effect of the Murray signing is twofold. The Eagles get an elite back while simultaneously weakening a divisional opponent that won 12 games and the NFC East title a year ago.


http://www.phillyvoice.com/report-eagles-sign-demarco-murray/


http://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...ee-agency-contracts-adrian-peterson/70239658/

 

[KJJ]

I understand you don't believe that. I do not share that opinion. He's better, IMO, then many are giving him credit for but at the end of the day, neither opinion can be substantiated and how good or bad he will be remains to be seen. We will know soon enough.

I gave a lot of valid reasons as to why I don't believe anyone offered McFadden more money and wouldn't have had he waited. Murray is a lot better than many here are giving him credit for but naturally because he's playing with the hated Eagles now it's caused some to reduce him to just an average player claiming the Cowboys will be a better with the backs they have. Just look how some have pumped up McFadden to all of a sudden be Superman. LOL They're all down playing his injuries and 3.3 rushing average the past 3 seasons and posting video's of his runs at Arkansas to try and work themselves up over him. LMAO! They're sifting for anything positive on him while finding all kinds of things wrong with Murray's 1800 yard season. One FAN claimed McFadden could have put up 2200 behind the Cowboys OL last season. You have some talking up Ryan Williams who hasn't seen a regular season game in 3 years like he's going to be the second coming of AP. There can't be a stranger FAN base than this one.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I gave a lot of valid reasons as to why I don't believe anyone offered McFadden more money and wouldn't have had he waited. Murray is a lot better than many here are giving him credit for but naturally because he's playing with the hated Eagles now it's caused some to reduce him to just an average player claiming the Cowboys will be a better with the backs they have. Just look how some have pumped up McFadden to all of a sudden be Superman. LOL They're all down playing his injuries and 3.3 rushing average the past 3 seasons and posting video's of his runs at Arkansas to try and work themselves up over him. LMAO! They're sifting for anything positive on him while finding all kinds of things wrong with Murray's 1800 yard season. One FAN claimed McFadden could have put up 2200 behind the Cowboys OL last season. You have some talking up Ryan Williams who hasn't seen a regular season game in 3 years like he's going to be the second coming of AP. There can't be a stranger FAN base than this one.

LOL.... I like Ryan Williams so that's probably me to some extent. I get that there are questions but I do think that McFadden is better then what he is sometimes characterized on this board. I agree that Murray is also better and similar characterization happen with him but that's always the case when a player leaves. I don't believe that Murray was an elite back but he's pretty good. My concerns, around Murray were based on the work load he carried last year and the future production, based on historic data. Can Murray duplicate his production? Anything is possible but I would not bet on that happening. I understand the decisions made by the team. We'll see what happens.

 

[KJJ]

Yah, having a big time receiver is a good thing. But the passing game can be effective without one. Seattle doesnt have one and they do just fine. You can argue that Brady doesnt have one. A good TE helps if you dont. Great QB's make great receivers in my opinion. If Dez is going to command 16 to 18 million per year, then I would trade him. You dont need a top 5 receiver in the NFL to have a great offense.

Seattle doesn't throw the ball like most teams in the league but they have a very powerful RB who scares the hell out of defenses. If you have a great back it can open up the passing game despite not having an elite receiver. A back like Lynch opens up a lot of play action pass opportunities. Great QB's can make receivers but Wilson isn't a "great" QB at least not yet. Without Lynch in the backfield he would struggle which is why Seattle did everything possible to resign Lynch. Brady can make it work with any receiver because he's one of the greatest QB's ever. The Cowboys offense would not be near as good without Dez defenses have to focus on him and Romo would struggle without a great #1 receiver. Dez doesn't have to be open to make plays he wins jump ball battles. He's far to valuable a player for the Cowboys to lose.

 

[KJJ]

LOL.... I like Ryan Williams so that's probably me to some extent. I get that there are questions but I do think that McFadden is better then what he is sometimes characterized on this board. I agree that Murray is also better and similar characterization happen with him but that's always the case when a player leaves. I don't believe that Murray was an elite back but he's pretty good. My concerns, around Murray were based on the work load he carried last year and the future production, based on historic data. Can Murray duplicate his production? Anything is possible but I would not bet on that happening. I understand the decisions made by the team. We'll see what happens.

You weren't the one who predicted a 2000 yard season for Williams. LOL I don't think McFadden is a terrible back but injuries and his lack of production over the last 4 seasons can't be ignored but you have a few here who are choosing to do that. Some here still have visions of the back McFadden was coming out of Arkansas 7 yeas ago and that's not being realistic but most FANS usually aren't realistic. Someone posting video highlights of the runs he made at Arkansas and getting all excited about the prospects for what he might do behind the Cowboys OL based on the player he was at the college level at 21 years old was pretty funny but that's typical of some FANS.

I don't believe Murray would have come close to 1800 yards in 2015 with the Cowboys but I do believe he could have produced 1300 plus which is more than I believe any of the backs the Cowboys currently have will produce. I feel for the Cowboys to be a great team they need a back they can lean on all their championship teams had a great lead back. I understand the decisions that were made but I also understand we're gambling on the OL and an injury prone back who hasn't produced in 5 years and 2 other backs that are unproven and lack experience.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

You weren't the one who predicted a 2000 yard season for Williams. LOL I don't think McFadden is a terrible back but injuries and his lack of production over the last 4 seasons can't be ignored but you have a few here who are choosing to do that. Some here still have visions of the back McFadden was coming out of Arkansas 7 yeas ago and that's not being realistic but most FANS usually aren't realistic. Someone posting video highlights of the runs he made at Arkansas and getting all excited about the prospects for what he might do behind the Cowboys OL based on the player he was at the college level was pretty funny but that's typical of some FANS.

I don't believe Murray would have come close to 1800 yards in 2015 with the Cowboys but I do believe he could have produced 1300 plus which is more than I believe any of the backs the Cowboys currently have will produce. I feel for the Cowboys to be a great team they need a back they can lean on all their championship teams had a great lead back. I understand the decisions that were made also but I also understand we're gambling on the OL and an injury prone back who hasn't produced in 5 years and 2 other backs that are unproven and lack experience.

Fair enough. Hopefully, the team is right and we still see good production out of the running game. I think there will be options out there as we see teams make moves to get down to the 53. If McFadden doesn't have it, we can cut him and have little ill effects from the move. Hopefully, we will know this by the time we get down to the 53 ourselves.

 

[KJJ]

Murray isn t elite in my opinion. He had an elite season, but that is just one in 4. The rest of the seasons were injury riddled. And when there werent big holes, he didnt do much. Granted, Garrett let him rot on the bench the first 3 years while he rolled out his pass happy offense, but Murray still got hurt. I completely agree that he leaves too much meat on the bone out there. Without the best run blocking line in the NFL, murray wouldnt be close to elite. I am really looking forward to this season and taking a look at the results both with Murray and the Cowboys run game. It will tell a lot about the theories of Oline vs the RB.

That's your opinion some have that opinion but a number of experts have referred to him as an elite back. He had one elite season only because he had injury issues and missed games. Murray showed elite qualities long before the OL was built.

 

[GimmeTheBall!]

This is the No Fun Forum Stop being witty, etc. Tards get rewarded, not smats...

I half felt the back hand of the too-serious police here.

 

[KJJ]

Fair enough. Hopefully, the team is right and we still see good production out of the running game. I think there will be options out there as we see teams make moves to get down to the 53. If McFadden doesn't have it, we can cut him and have little ill effects from the move. Hopefully, we will know this by the time we get down to the 53 ourselves.

I think they'll be "production" from the group we have it's picking up the tough yards that keep the chains moving I'm concerned about. It's not having the efficiency we saw last season that helped take pressure off Romo and helped keep the defense rested that I'm concerned about. Can these backs make something out of nothing? All the questions will be answered in the coming months.

 

[KJJ]

Developed? No, he just finally got the opportunity from a real OC and that opportunity came behind the best run blocking Oline in football.

Any good RB with 400 carries could have easily gotten 1600 yards last year behind our line. Murray is a very good back, but his is injury prone and does not have elite vision or elite speed.

These are Cowboy fans you are arguing with here bub. If Murray was really a cant miss back, they would have resigned him.

We saw Murray's potential as a rookie at least I did. I posted in 2013 if he could ever stay healthy he would have a1500 plus yard season. No one knows what other backs could do behind the Cowboys OL but we'll soon find out. Murray had vision he made several outstanding runs due to his vision. He didn't have elite speed but neither did Emmitt and Murray is faster than Emmitt was. Everyone started knocking Murray's speed late in the season when his legs were worn out due to all the carries.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I half felt the back hand of the too-serious police here.

The back hand, the toe, the you name it. Hell hath no fury like a poster who comes out and stands up for the player who has just left for another NFL team...........

LOL.......

 

[DallasEast]

That's your opinion some have that opinion but a number of experts have referred to him as an elite back. He had one elite season only because he had injury issues and missed games. Murray showed elite qualities long before the OL was built.

Experts? Name a few.

EDIT: Dang it. I forgot. I'm on the ignore list. I'll never know what professional qualifications are associated with the expert(s).

(Softly plays the ending theme of The Incredible Hulk while returning to work)

 

[GimmeTheBall!]

The back hand, the toe, the you name it. Hell hath no fury like a poster who comes out and stands up for the player who has just left for another NFL team...........

LOL.......

SOMEONE who's name I will not reveal is feeling guilty.

J'accuse!

LOL

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

SOMEONE who's name I will not reveal is feeling guilty.

J'accuse!

LOL

So........ You're a prosecutor now........

When did you find the time to go to Law School (In France)?

 

[CowboyRoy]

Seattle doesn't throw the ball like most teams in the league but they have a very powerful RB who scares the hell out of defenses. If you have a great back it can open up the passing game despite not having an elite receiver. A back like Lynch opens up a lot of play action pass opportunities. Great QB's can make receivers but Wilson isn't a "great" QB at least not yet. Without Lynch in the backfield he would struggle which is why Seattle did everything possible to resign Lynch. Brady can make it work with any receiver because he's one of the greatest QB's ever. The Cowboys offense would not be near as good without Dez defenses have to focus on him and Romo would struggle without a great #1 receiver. Dez doesn't have to be open to make plays he wins jump ball battles. He's far to valuable a player for the Cowboys to lose.

Yah, I think your missing the point here. Of course the Cowboys offense wouldnt be quite as good without Dez. But it would be plenty good enough. And its not like they would replace him with no one. The point is that if you take your money and put into the QB, the run game, and the defense, you dont need a top 5 receiver. Paying a receiver 16 million per year will inhibit your ability to do that. I would rather spend the money on the defense and have a top 5 defense then a top 5 receiver.