Trenches: Some proof on why we lose in the playoffs

[Chasing6]

How many games did Emmitt miss during his and Aikman's primes? 4? Kinda hard to gauge that hypothetical.

Not really. Could not win before him or after him and not when he held out or when he was hurt.

 

[Chasing6]

Being honest Emmitt missed so few games over his career it's hard to make a real judgment. There was the 0-2 start in 1993 when Emmitt held out. He missed one game in 1994 which was a loss; but that was a meaningless regular season finale in which Aikman only played less than a half.

Emmitt did not miss a start again due to injury until November 1999; and ironically Troy also missed those two games.

Troy could not win before Emmitt, after Emmitt, or when he did not play.

 

[Established1971]

That most of you might not want to read that, it might not like it or agree with it , maybe its too long.

but I'm just was reading Facebook talking about who would you replace Prescott with but you can't use Patrick Mahomes and all these people were wanting Prescott to be replaced because he can't win in the playoffs and that he should have because they had all this defense and run game and all these great players around him and he can never win..

so it triggered me to go yeah since when did our run game and our defense and the coaching staff ever come together in the same game in any of these losses and it was Prescott alone that was responsible and that goes for Tony Romo as well they were not responsible??!!

they were not the top three reasons we lost these games, they are on the list eventually but that's only because we're expecting perfection because the rest of our team is so flawed...

too many run-on sentences

 

[Nexx]

can we ever have a moment where we say HOLY S, nothing went right on defense and the running game was putrid but Dak carried us to a playoff victory... NO because the guy has not, cannot and will never carry the team in the playoffs.

 

[Hawkeye0202]

Dak needs to play better. He also needs to get tougher. The game doesn’t get easy when the playoffs come.

In so many words, Cam Newton said the same thing........

 

[Hawkeye0202]

Good news is they have the top end talent to field a really strong team. The other good news is that they draft relatively well compared to the rest of the league. The bad news is we continue to see that you can't draft well enough to consistently sit out free agency. The other bad news is that right now doesnt make sense to move on from any of these guys as the draft has passed and free agency is mostly over.

The mismanagement of the cap is destroying what has really been a solid job by the front office for a long time now in most areas.

They get an A+ in drafting and a D in free agency ( only this high for signing their players) This IMO is why we are always "hanging around the rim". Stephen Jones needs to understand drafts alone won't get you a Super Bowl but to close the gap invest more resources in free agency and move the D closer to a B.

 

[plasticman]

Why do we lose in the playoffs?

It's not complicated, it doesn't need a whole lot of analysis, reflection, evaluation, whatever.

All that anybody needs to do is determine how long something has been going on and look for the common thread.

Now, how long has this been going on?

Was Dak the starting quarterback from the beginning of this streak of early playoff eliminations?

No? Then it isn't Dak.

Has anybody in the organization been at their football related position from the very beginning to now? Is it the responsibility of this person to assist in building the team into legitimate championship contenders?

Yes? Well then, you've found your problem

.....one from which all other perceived problems were mere symptoms.

 

[VaqueroTD]

I vote for D: all of the above, the entire freaking team is too soft to win in the playoffs. Not since Parcells has someone brought the same toughness that Jimmy instilled.

 

[Chasing6]

can we ever have a moment where we say HOLY S, nothing went right on defense and the running game was putrid but Dak carried us to a playoff victory... NO because the guy has not, cannot and will never carry the team in the playoffs.

Give me an example when Aikman did that.

 

[blueblood70]

The thing is, the market dictates what Dak gets paid. Along with agents and the player's association.

Teams in need of a franchise QB pay them no matter what the postseason results are. I don't think Jared Goff, Trevor Lawrence, or even Justin Herbert deserve the money they got. Look at the money Kirk Cousins has collected over his career for simply being "good".

We want more in the playoffs from Dak, of course. But the thing is, no matter if the Cowboys or another team pay him top dollar, it won't be long until the next QB gets even more.

This is the natural cycle. The cap goes up every year and the contracts go up with them. This is why the Cowboys are being criticized for being stupid with Dak twice. They wait and wait and wait and the price only goes up. They could have gotten him a lot cheaper in 2021. And they could have signed him to an extension months ago and then watched other teams pay even more for Goff and Lawrence.

I agree with everything you said except for this narrative, it's false do you really believe that Prescott and his agents who are on top of this would have allowed him to sign a deal of the same smaller amount without it being a shorter contract with a lot of extra stuff thrown in to be in the new contract talks quicker..

Look,​

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these guys aren't stupid TUA just turned down 50 million you're saying get ahead of this Miami's trying but these players know exactly what's coming, they will not sign a five year deal at less when they know other guys are coming up, literally just happened with CD lamb, Justin Jefferson and jamar chase ,​

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they didn't care about what brown got either brown got they didn't care about what Smith got because you know why they're better than them and they know it they're going to get bigger money they were waiting to their counterparts, they felt would get a similar contract ,they all waited around the shoe dropped, and now CD lamb cost more has nothing to do with the Dallas Cowboys waiting they will not allow themselves to be duped... Ohh you're blaming the front office when there's two other moving parts it's called an agent and a player and they're smarter than you think...​

Lamar Jackson is one of the only people in the league I know that did this without an agent and yet he bet on himself, Like Dak, he wouldn't take less and played on his final year, team blinked first,

he probably could have got more money or more guarantees or a better structured contract but most of these players get on the franchise tag or on their fifth year option because they're waiting for more money,

this has nothing to do with the Cowboys FO, these players have agents that are smart they're lawyers they do this for a living sports, agents look ahead five years, and they see what contracts are coming up and they have these discussions... So everything you said, I agree with until you mention that because,

I get tired of hearing that they will not fool most players who have good agents they will have some kind of conversation that says OK if you want me to take a little less now it's going to have to be for three years with the 4th year being voided not four years with two void years to help the team you literally don't understand these players understand the market that's why they have agents they literally are not signing something for less to help the team out when they know what they actually are going to get a couple years down the road...

So yes Prescott may have signed for a few million less maybe 5 but he would have wanted a shorter contract or after three years he would have held out again, he would have demanded more money,

I mean they keep up in Patrick mahomes contract to keep him steady I know it's not a big news story but it is happening a lot of these players realize when they sign how much they can sign for next time or whoever is going to sign again,

I know it sounds like rambling but it's the truth you all are out of control with blaming the front office on things that we just saw happen CeeDee was not signing a new deal three months ago or March 14th or whenever the new league because he was waiting for Justin Jefferson or jamar chase now he's got his base foundation for debates and negotiations..

The front office does not do this on purpose and the one thing you all clamor about on here is Jerry Jones not much of A football guy but he's definitely a business guy he knows contracts he knows money and he's got several probably 12 if I'm guessing layers of lawyers and CPA's that are definitely in tune with the cap and everything that's going on now and five years from now and they're not going to strong arm players into signing smaller contracts...


that's just not happening now this is not the 90s let's get away from all that this is different and these players know it..

I mean think about things that have changed just in the last three years, players now positional players have seen what contracts that quarterbacks are getting they no longer want to just be the highest paid player at their position, they no longer want top five money, they no longer want to just be millionaires, they want to be the highest paid positional player in the league outside of quarterback that is changed you are not going to make players take money early to help the team unless they choose to do so, but I'm telling you that is not the way this has been going the last five years things have been changing and changing fast and the Dallas Cowboys front office is not to blame they know how to structure contracts and they know a lot about money players and agents have become smarter and no longer without leverage..

 

[blueblood70]

I vote for D: all of the above, the entire freaking team is too soft to win in the playoffs. Not since Parcells has someone brought the same toughness that Jimmy instilled.

Can we stop living in the past and and I agree with you there's top five things that go wrong in the playoffs it just does it's not one person or one phase of the game it's literally the team at every layer finds a way to not bring their a game when it's mostly needed..

However the union and the league has taken the toughness out they're not allowed to hit they're not allowed to put pads on they're not allowed to practice a certain amount of times a week I mean they're not even allowed to workout too much or they get fined I mean literally stop acting like bill Parcells or Jimmy Johnson would make it right now because that's why they're not even in the league they're not even GM's I mean there's a reason they didn't continue coaching or being GM's at some point the game changes so much it leaves guys like them behind and I realize there are a few coaches that have that aura around the league that teams are just tougher.. They aren't this the players are maybe a tad better but you're not can I have a defense ever like that again you cannot play like that angry and taking someone's head off they did that with the rules they literally are turning this into flag football and you're blaming the Cowboys for being soft...​

So,

I like to bust that narrative now this has something to do with the players their effort their attitude, but you can't even cut players like Micah Parsons for I don't know not giving full effort and pouting when he's not getting penalties that he should be getting and he's not building his stats... I mean I know that looks like hey he should be held accountable dude this is not high school this is not old school dad football, literally you cannot just simply bench guys like him, you can't hold him accountable ,and by the way bill Parcells and Jimmy Johnson let lots of players on their team get away with murder, almost, I mean it was pretty close.. I mean we had the White House issues with Michael Irvin and some of the bigger names that they ever get caught or find what they ever made accountable for anything they did hell no big man on campus Lawrence Taylor knowingly got high during games he probably was doing lines in the bathroom at halftime, did anybody ever do anything about that, no nobody did this happens all over the league it happens in high school anybody saw in north Dallas 40 this was going on during Landry's time as well... so let's uh calm down on this heavy-handed we need a physical coach nonsense..

Like bill Parcells and Jimmy Johnson normally when they made an example out of somebody, they did it to some low hanging fruit, lit them up at practice cut them off the team straight away or someone fell asleep, I guarantee if that Prescott falls asleep, it's not any different than Brock Purdy falling asleep, or Tom Brady in a meeting... they're not being disciplined... I promise you BMOC you remember it, still happens... The best players will always get special treatment and they cost too much and they're hard to replace so you're not going to find accountability making examples out of these players because it's not even possible.

Which by the way, you don't know what goes on behind closed doors and meetings,

I promise you Mike McCarthy has preached in his own way the importance of cutting down on mistakes and turnovers and knowing your assignments until he was red in the face but you can't go out and play the game for them, but you also can't just cut players with the salary cap and all the money you owe them that can go against your dead cap money this is not the old NFL this is a new union it's a new day and age where you have edge rushers making $32 million a year or more you got receivers demanding $35 million a year while quarterbacks are making 60 this league has changed you can't make examples out of these guys all you can do it's treat them like adults like professionals and they have these meetings closed door they have clothes locker room I know we're used to the all this open stuff nowadays with the videos and stuff but they don't allow you to see the other stuff no way you can tell me Mike McCarthy gets ran over behind the scenes I guarantee you he's more like that dad who doesn't scream and yell who tries to get his point across in a different way but he can only do so much the rest of it's up to the players themselves.

 

[Qcard]

We are losing in the trenches, just a thought I’d share…starts on Offense, because Dak/Tony gets blamed a lot,​

Zeke and our run game in the playoffs,

• 2016 -22-125 5.7, lost over no defense against rogers not on dak.
• 2018 -Seattle game 26-137 won the game. The next week 2018 rams game 47 yards, averaging 2.4 yards per carry yup LOSS but really was on the defense but dak alone once again.
• 2021-31 yards on 12 carries 2.6 yup a loss.
• 2022 -23 carries 53 yards 2.4 YPC, that’s 2 games, ouch. I mean at least we did beat Tampa Bay on Prescott’s arm with no run game…
• 2023-TP wow HOF 15-56 at 3.7 he was cooking but down big they were hollow stats folks.

And trust me it was just as bad for the quarterback with the offensive line not opening holes, no run game, and this is what you want where is Tony Dorsett and Emmitt Smith and the offensive lines from those championship teams??​

I mean for a defense I'd have to go by memory, but I just know the defense gave up

2016- the last play of the game with less than two minutes and 2016 is why we lost to Aaron Rodgers and the Green Bay Packers while the offense played great.

2018- the Rams game in 2018 there was no run game as I said above but there also was no defense 278 yards on the ground.

2021- this one's tougher to remember but if memory serves me right first half of that game the defense gave up nearly 10 yards per carry to deebo Samuels they owned the time of possession and then on offense they had to deal with once again no run game and you had to add on the fact that the offensive line had 11 penalties yeah quarterback is supposed to play well in that game short should have won that game by himself put him on his back and won the game.

2022- in my opinion this was one of the ones that's tough to blame the defense they played pretty well but at times they gave up yards on the ground but they did not make the key plays the championship defense should yeah Trayvon diggs didn't break up that play against kittles he did not intercept that ball would have been some game changing plays in a close game.. But we do know it was very easy for their defense to stop our run game and once again make our offense one-dimensional and it's very difficult to play quarterback in this kind of environment. IMHO

2023- this is the absolute **** show total annihilation from beginning to end by the team, 100% all on the team. please do not blame the flow of the game which started out down 7 nothing because the defense sucked but it was more people keep citing those two interceptions by Prescott is somehow setting the tone forgetting that the defense didn't stop the Green Bay Packers at all the whole entire game. Let's be clear that first interception Brandon cooks was interfered with not once but twice there was nowhere to throw the ball so Prescott said hey go make a play there was no call by the referees but the reason that ball got picked off is because our receiver got yanked once and then solder pulled back while they were going to the ground so he can sneak up in there and just grab that ball. 2nd interception it was clear that Prescott was trying to make a play he threw the ball where the play was supposed to go and CD lamb broke off his route and started up field they were he was trying for a off script play and it didn't turn out well.

So yes, while Prescott did play great play bad at times deserves some criticism there's obvious proof here, in the trenches, this Cowboys team is set up for failure against the better teams in the league.. they do not bring what it takes as a team to win.

Where is the defense, run game, and coaching?? This happened to Tony Romo as well, so let’s stay on facts and not flawed memory's. LOL​

let me finish on this,

because we all want the championships, and we keep citing how great Troy and Roger were as championship quarterbacks and deserve the Hall of Fame flowers that they get...

come on people, give me a break they never had to carry a team in that mess I described above, they did not have to feel like they had to come into a game and play perfectly or take all the heat for a loss.

They had Tony Dorsett, Emmitt Smith, Jimmy Johnson, Landry and some of the best play in the trenches you can get out of a team and that is why they won championships, had nothing to do with just having a great quarterback.

This is Old School Forum style Fact Loaded Post ...

 

[phildadon86]

Joe Flacco won a Super Bowl with his defense giving up 35 points in the Divisional round and 31 points in the Super Bowl.

Patrick Mahomes won with his defense giving up 36 points and the lead with 13 seconds left in the Divisional round.

Tom Brady came back from 28-3 in the Super Bowl.

Andrew Luck led the Colts back from a 28 point deficit in a Wild Card game.

Trevor Lawrence (that guy that just got paid that y'all think Dak is better than) just last year came back from being down 27-0.

I mean, that's just a few examples of QBs picking up the slack and putting the team on their backs when everything isn't going perfect. It must be nice to have a QB not bound to the "You're only allowed to play well if everyone else plays well" curse that Dak is bound with.

This is a terrible example. Just for the record.

Lawrence threw 4 picks in that game. Then Herbert (the guy everyone loves) completely gave the game back to the Jags.

So basically. Daks at fault when he throws picks and doesnt win, but Herbert isnt and Lawrence is amazing?

Make it make sense.

 

[blueblood70]

This is Old School Forum style Fact Loaded Post ...

this aint twitX ,no limits ,no holes barred, coffee induced rants LOL its not for everyone.

 

[Qcard]

This is a terrible example. Just for the record.

Lawrence threw 4 picks in that game. Then Herbert (the guy everyone loves) completely gave the game back to the Jags.

So basically. Daks at fault when he throws picks and doesnt win, but Herbert isnt and Lawrence is amazing?

Make it make sense.

Ooops....But Kellen Moore made Herbert great NoT again!???

The hypocrisy and low bar of comfort when it comes to Herbert and Lawrence is weird.....

Dak had a better First 4 years than Trevor Lawrence but Dak Haters almost lost their religion when Prescott got the extension in 2020.....

This is NOT about Football

 

[phildadon86]

Ooops....But Kellen Moore made Herbert great NoT again!???

The hypocrisy and low bar of comfort when it comes to Herbert and Lawrence is weird.....

Dak had a better First 4 years than Trevor Lawrence but Dak Haters almost lost their religion when Prescott got the extension in 2020.....

This is NOT about Football

I am not even saying Prescott is better or not.

Just using Lawrence as an example in that list is a joke. He threw 4 picks in the first half (pretty sure thats a record for the playoffs) and the worst HC and OC in history handed the Jags the game back by making Herbert throw a million times with a 27 point lead.

But yeah. Lets credit Lawrence.

 

[kskboys]

They get an A+ in drafting and a D in free agency ( only this high for signing their players) This IMO is why we are always "hanging around the rim". Stephen Jones needs to understand drafts alone won't get you a Super Bowl but to close the gap invest more resources in free agency and move the D closer to a B.

A+ way too high due to extreme misses in the 2nd round. B grade.

 

[MountaineerCowboy]

This is a terrible example. Just for the record.

Lawrence threw 4 picks in that game. Then Herbert (the guy everyone loves) completely gave the game back to the Jags.

So basically. Daks at fault when he throws picks and doesnt win, but Herbert isnt and Lawrence is amazing?

Make it make sense.

Dak fans hate when QBs pull their teams out of holes (self inflicted or not) to win games.

They’re just so used to losing those games they can’t comprehend winning them.

 

[kskboys]

Ooops....But Kellen Moore made Herbert great NoT again!???

The hypocrisy and low bar of comfort when it comes to Herbert and Lawrence is weird.....

Dak had a better First 4 years than Trevor Lawrence but Dak Haters almost lost their religion when Prescott got the extension in 2020.....

This is NOT about Football

Yes it is. Maybe not to you. Who knows what little agenda you're spewing, but to 99% of the fans on this board it is purely about football.

 

[kskboys]

This is a terrible example. Just for the record.

Lawrence threw 4 picks in that game. Then Herbert (the guy everyone loves) completely gave the game back to the Jags.

So basically. Daks at fault when he throws picks and doesnt win, but Herbert isnt and Lawrence is amazing?

Make it make sense.

Easy. Extreme focus on Dak and the Cowboys, and lack of knowledge about what goes on w/ other teams.

If a team gets a big lead but then blows it by going pass happy, that is on the coaching. There's a reason why Moore was fired.