Update: Cowboys extend K Bailey through 2020 ***7-yr 23mil***

[Idgit]

Has this been mentioned at all? How come we didn't tender him @ $2 million (with a 2nd round tender) and if another team signs him, we had the right to match and if we didn't, then would be receiving a 2nd pick in the process....

I love Bailey, but this would have seemed to make more sense. Am I missing something?

That would have been a reasonable way to go. I don't really care how you cut it, quality guys get paid market rate when they come up. The only question is, do you want to keep them, or not. For Bailey to sign a new deal that only makes him the 5th highest paid kicker in the league (depending how that number was calculated), we're getting a deal from the player. He's probably--as Jason says--the best player on the team at doing what he does.

As far as I'm concerned, now that he's worked so hard on his kickoffs, extending him was an absolute no-brainer, and we got it done with a reasonable contract. I know 8-8 means that everything has to be wrong with the team, all at once, in the minds of some, but the reality is that not everything we do right now is an obvious mistake. This is one of those things where people are definitely complaining about nothing at all in my book.

 

[Rockport]

Yea, they should and when they have a kicker who is not damn good for low ball money then what? Not a whole lot of money ball type kickers to be found out on the street in case you would need an in season replacement for being a cheapskate. No sir, I applaud this deal by the front office of Jerry Jones for getting this kid locked in for 6 years and didn't break the bank at the same time.

He did break the bank. This, and other contracts like it, are the reason the Cowboys must rely on the draft to upgrade. And we all know the history of Jerry's drafts. Mostly bad.

 

[zack]

That would have been a reasonable way to go. I don't really care how you cut it, quality guys get paid market rate when they come up. The only question is, do you want to keep them, or not. For Bailey to sign a new deal that only makes him the 5th highest paid kicker in the league (depending how that number was calculated), we're getting a deal from the player. He's probably--as Jason says--the best player on the team at doing what he does.

As far as I'm concerned, now that he's worked so hard on his kickoffs, extending him was an absolute no-brainer, and we got it done with a reasonable contract. I know 8-8 means that everything has to be wrong with the team, all at once, in the minds of some, but the reality is that not everything we do right now is an obvious mistake. This is one of those things where people are definitely complaining about nothing at all in my book.

No complaining here. I want him here. We went cheap on kickers for years and we got burned because of it. I just wondered if anyone had posted that negotiation strategy.....

 

[Miller]

go back your basement

If he was so good why was there never any kind of bidding war for him? He went without a job for a season several times in his career.

Who the heck are you? Grow up. People like you are what makes this board worse. "Go back to your basement?" Try acting like an adult in a normal discussion.

I laid out the facts above. Many not even having to do with the Cowboys. Can you dispute the facts and the success with other teams? That is more than a coincidence. And by the way, he doesn't have a bidding war because he runs his kicking and punting schools part of the time and gets hired by teams to be their asst special teams coach the other half. The man must be really lucky that all of those guys had their best years under him. If you have any real facts to the contrary besides name calling you can try and present them. By the way, Hoffman is the same guy that found Mat McBriar and after Hoffman left Parcells played kicker carousel which lost us games. The point of the conversation was how we do it now and then. And back then we didn't lose many games because of our cheap kickers. Now we are paying up.

I like Bailey, I just don't think its a position to blow money on when you can find guys and coach them up.

 

[CanadianCowboysFan]

Who the heck are you? Grow up. People like you are what makes this board worse. "Go back to your basement?" Try acting like an adult in a normal discussion.

I laid out the facts above. Many not even having to do with the Cowboys. Can you dispute the facts and the success with other teams? That is more than a coincidence. And by the way, he doesn't have a bidding war because he runs his kicking and punting schools part of the time and gets hired by teams to be their asst special teams coach the other half. The man must be really lucky that all of those guys had their best years under him. If you have any real facts to the contrary besides name calling you can try and present them. By the way, Hoffman is the same guy that found Mat McBriar and after Hoffman left Parcells played kicker carousel which lost us games. The point of the conversation was how we do it now and then. And back then we didn't lose many games because of our cheap kickers. Now we are paying up.

I like Bailey, I just don't think its a position to blow money on when you can find guys and coach them up.

don't worry about bumfrd,whenever he has no response, he just name calls

 

[TwoCentPlain]

I think it is good we have Bailey locked up long term. The big question right now is what is the cap hit for 2014? I'm guessing it is less than $2M for 2014. The next big question is how much money is guaranteed? Until everyone sees those numbers, complaining is really jumping the gun. Did someone post those numbers and I missed them?

 

[Idgit]

No complaining here. I want him here. We went cheap on kickers for years and we got burned because of it. I just wondered if anyone had posted that negotiation strategy.....

Yeah, they do that I think when the two parties are far enough apart initially that it makes sense to let the market weigh in. Like with Spencer last year, right? I bet in this case there was enough common ground that it made sense just to get the deal done. I'm so glad they did, because Bailey's about as money as it gets.

This is like when we extended McBriar and everybody complained for a while until it was obvious that it was the right thing to do and a reasonable contract.

 

[JPM]

Love this deal, happy he'll be a Cowboy going forward.

 

[Nightman]

I think it is good we have Bailey locked up long term. The big question right now is what is the cap hit for 2014? I'm guessing it is less than $2M for 2014. The next big question is how much money is guaranteed? Until everyone sees those numbers, complaining is really jumping the gun. Did someone post those numbers and I missed them?

I think it will be around 1.4m for 2014. That is less than the 2nd round tender of 2m they would've used. So they lock him up and get him cheaper for the next 2 years. Very good deal.

 

[AbeBeta]

This is such a crock. The guy coached Jeff Feagles while at the University of Miami. With the Cowboys all those different kickers had an 82.3 percentage and set 15 club records including every single season record. When he went to Miami and worked with Jay Feely the guy had his best year as a pro making 91% o his kicks. When he went to Kansas City he got them to draft Ryan Succop as Mr. Irrelevant and the guy tied a NFL rookie record making 86.2% of his kicks. He also set a Chiefs record and passed Jan Stenaroud with most kicks made. He is now with the Titans and still does kicking clinics. So he just lucked into all of this productivity? Please child..The way we did it back then was the way NE does it now with most of their players including their SB hero Venateiri. You can always get someone cheaper and as good.

Focus on the hits.

Ignore the misses.

How about Succop's second year when he was a middling 77%? Or Richie Cunningham hitting a whopping 55%? Or Lin Elliot dropping 69%?

Hoffman's best kickers were in Dallas -- often guys who never needed to kick in a clutch situation because we were dominating teams.

 

[TheCount]

You do realize kickers fall off, right? To extend a kicker this long is silly. Who was the Saints kicker that was a local who signed that 4 year contract with the Saints after their Super Bowl and they ended up cutting him because he sucked so bad? Remember Vanderjagt?

Kicker should be the last thing you are focused on. Kicker won't mean jack when this defense is still the worst in all of football. How about investing resources there?

I agree they should have tendered him, but with 7.5m guaranteed, Bailey's contract will not be the deciding factor on whether the defense turns around or not. The tender alone would have cost us just over 2m.

 

[Miller]

Focus on the hits.

Ignore the misses.

How about Succop's second year when he was a middling 77%? Or Richie Cunningham hitting a whopping 55%? Or Lin Elliot dropping 69%?

Hoffman's best kickers were in Dallas -- often guys who never needed to kick in a clutch situation because we were dominating teams.

I didn't ignore the misses. I sad he took guys who weren't great and worked with them so we didn't spend the cash. For the most part he did well. He did this elsewhere too. Janikowski also had his highest kicking percentage of his career the one year Hoffman was there. Y'all were looking at him like it was all a made up fraud, despite the records and success in other places. You and another poster said it was all in people's head because of an article. The reality is that it worked a majority of the time and even looked better after Parcells didn't retain him. When you are being asked to work with nothing, not every guy will be a hit. But he did I for the most part and we were successful. Many teams have done the same instead of spending the cash.

 

[AbeBeta]

I didn't ignore the misses. I sad he took guys who weren't great and worked with them so we didn't spend the cash. For the most part he did well. He did this elsewhere too. Janikowski also had his highest kicking percentage of his career the one year Hoffman was there. Y'all were looking at him like it was all a made up fraud, despite the records and success in other places. You and another poster said it was all in people's head because of an article. The reality is that it worked a majority of the time and even looked better after Parcells didn't retain him. When you are being asked to work with nothing, not every guy will be a hit. But he did I for the most part and we were successful. Many teams have done the same instead of spending the cash.

Your big miss here is that just about EVERY special teams coach in the league does that. The idea of "working with nothing" shows a remarkable lack of context. In the last five years a grand total of 12 kickers have been taken. None higher than the fourth round. Few are still with their drafting teams. Few teams spend much of anything on a kicker. That doesn't make Hoffman special.

Really, the only thing that makes Hoffman special is that people here know his name.

 

[Miller]

Your big miss here is that just about EVERY special teams coach in the league does that. The idea of "working with nothing" shows a remarkable lack of context. In the last five years a grand total of 12 kickers have been taken. None higher than the fourth round. Few are still with their drafting teams. Few teams spend much of anything on a kicker. That doesn't make Hoffman special.

Really, the only thing that makes Hoffman special is that people here know his name.

Except many of these guys have had their best years under him even when he was strapped by coaches. You're making up stats because I busted your argument from stats from other teams. You pointed out 3 misses out of more than a dozen guys. Crazy how that works. Whatever fits your agenda though. It's not like I pulled those team records out of thin air. If it's so simple where are the other coaches with that background. You said it was a myth.

Barnwell on the signing...more in article too

http://grantland.com/features/the-nfl-honor-roll/

Worst Contract of the Year
In a stunning late upset, it’s thecapped-out Cowboys giving kicker Dan Bailey a seven-year contract!!! OK, maybe this isn’t a real award, but I had to find a space to talk about it. This, even for Jerry Jones, is a stunningly dumb move. The Cowboys just handed Bailey a deal that guarantees him $7.5 million and averages $3.2 million per year. They have absolutely no cap flexibility and need to save every penny they can, which would leave kicker — the most fungible position in football and a place where you can find competent guys as undrafted free agents every single year like, not coincidentally, Dan Bailey — as an obvious place to try to save money.

 

[AbeBeta]

Except many of these guys have had their best years under him even when he was strapped by coaches. You're making up stats because I busted your argument from stats from other teams. You pointed out 3 misses out of more than a dozen guys. Crazy how that works. Whatever fits your agenda though. It's not like I pulled those team records out of thin air. If it's so simple where are the other coaches with that background. You said it was a myth.

Barnwell on the signing...more in article too

http://grantland.com/features/the-nfl-honor-roll/

Worst Contract of the Year
In a stunning late upset, it’s thecapped-out Cowboys giving kicker Dan Bailey a seven-year contract!!! OK, maybe this isn’t a real award, but I had to find a space to talk about it. This, even for Jerry Jones, is a stunningly dumb move. The Cowboys just handed Bailey a deal that guarantees him $7.5 million and averages $3.2 million per year. They have absolutely no cap flexibility and need to save every penny they can, which would leave kicker — the most fungible position in football and a place where you can find competent guys as undrafted free agents every single year like, not coincidentally, Dan Bailey — as an obvious place to try to save money.

Moronic. Without seeing the structure of the deal the author has zero basis to even reference cap issues

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Moronic. Without seeing the structure of the deal the author has zero basis to even reference cap issues

That and the notion that kickers that hit over 95% grow on trees. The bottom guys hit in the 70's and that is replacement level. Bailey had about 30 attempts last year and that is a 6 FG or 18 point difference. Then you consider he kicks very well in high pressure situations and then the contract makes sense.

Kickers get hammered as weaklings or the like but because every kick he makes has points on the line, his contribution to the team is significant.

To give more perspective, that 18 points is 4% of the total points we scored last season. IOW if you replace Bailey with a guy off the street, you lose 4% of your offensive output.

 

[Tawney88]

That would have been a reasonable way to go. I don't really care how you cut it, quality guys get paid market rate when they come up. The only question is, do you want to keep them, or not. For Bailey to sign a new deal that only makes him the 5th highest paid kicker in the league (depending how that number was calculated), we're getting a deal from the player. He's probably--as Jason says--the best player on the team at doing what he does.

As far as I'm concerned, now that he's worked so hard on his kickoffs, extending him was an absolute no-brainer, and we got it done with a reasonable contract. I know 8-8 means that everything has to be wrong with the team, all at once, in the minds of some, but the reality is that not everything we do right now is an obvious mistake. This is one of those things where people are definitely complaining about nothing at all in my book.

Of course you'd say that. (If you are going to make a gross generalization in regards to my post, I will as well fir yours) There are right ways to do things and there are wrong ways to do things. There are ways to do things that help build up your franchise and there are ways to do things that handcuff you. Our franchise seems to do the later I both situations all the time.


You tender the guy and go from there. We are 21 million over the cap and have a historically bad defense because we lack vision. Just another example.

 

[Idgit]

Of course you'd say that. (If you are going to make a gross generalization in regards to my post, I will as well fir yours) There are right ways to do things and there are wrong ways to do things. There are ways to do things that help build up your franchise and there are ways to do things that handcuff you. Our franchise seems to do the later I both situations all the time.


You tender the guy and go from there. We are 21 million over the cap and have a historically bad defense because we lack vision. Just another example.

We don't tend to do the wrong things all the time. That's just your disappointment talking. The reality is, it's a mixed bag. And not securing the kicker and letting him go into unrestricted FA next season would have been a foolish mistake.

 

[AbeBeta]

Of course you'd say that. (If you are going to make a gross generalization in regards to my post, I will as well fir yours) There are right ways to do things and there are wrong ways to do things. There are ways to do things that help build up your franchise and there are ways to do things that handcuff you. Our franchise seems to do the later I both situations all the time.


You tender the guy and go from there. We are 21 million over the cap and have a historically bad defense because we lack vision. Just another example.

Tendering actually screws the cap more. This point will be made clear when the #s are available. It is obvious to those who pay attention that the first year cap hit will be low

 

[Nightman]

Of course you'd say that. (If you are going to make a gross generalization in regards to my post, I will as well fir yours) There are right ways to do things and there are wrong ways to do things. There are ways to do things that help build up your franchise and there are ways to do things that handcuff you. Our franchise seems to do the later I both situations all the time.


You tender the guy and go from there. We are 21 million over the cap and have a historically bad defense because we lack vision. Just another example.

If they tendered him his cap hit would be 2.1m, if no one else bid on him, more if they did. By doing this deal his hit will be around 1.7 this year and 2.3m next year. If he maintains his accuracy they have locked up a top for kicker for money outside the Top 10 for several years. If he falls off for some reason they can get rid of him after 2015 and find that next 90% kicker for nothing off the scrap pile.