US Men's National Team

[StylisticS]

Exactly, and the MLS needs to be revamped to be similar to Europe and not Americanized.

Exactly. Goes back to USSF and SUM though. Until the federation realizes that you cannot approach this sport like other American sports, they will continue to fail on the field.

 

[atlantacowboy]

Football/Soccer doesn't need athletes. It needs skilled and technical players. This is something the rest of the world has and the US does not. Well the US does have them, they just decide not to play them or they are injured. Trapp and Zardes should be dismissed from the senior team. The US could likely lose Dest and your problems at LB will once again come to ahead. Berhalter's choices of players and his formations leaves little to be desired. In fact, he is a mediocre coach to begin with. They are lucky CONCACAF made it easier for them to qualifications otherwise they would not in the World Cup again in 2022.

The entire system from development here in the US to the coaching needs to be revamped. It all goes back to the federation and soccer united marketing.

We need skilled athletes. lol Soccers players are great athletes and probably the most fit of any major sport.

 

[Rockport]

Football/Soccer doesn't need athletes. It needs skilled and technical players. This is something the rest of the world has and the US does not. Well the US does have them, they just decide not to play them or they are injured. Trapp and Zardes should be dismissed from the senior team. The US could likely lose Dest and your problems at LB will once again come to ahead. Berhalter's choices of players and his formations leaves little to be desired. In fact, he is a mediocre coach to begin with. They are lucky CONCACAF made it easier for them to qualifications otherwise they would not in the World Cup again in 2022.

The entire system from development here in the US to the coaching needs to be revamped. It all goes back to the federation and soccer united marketing.

They don’t need athletes? Ooookkkkk

 

[joseephuss]

It isn't an either/or situation. They need better skilled players and they need better athletes. If you have to choose between the two, then yes of course you pick the better skilled guys. The US team lacks both at this point.

 

[StylisticS]

They don’t need athletes? Ooookkkkk

My point is this game does not rely on athletes like football or basketball. It relies on skills and technical ability way more. You can be athletic all you want. If your touch is crap, you won’t amount to anything in the sport. Sorry.

 

[Rockport]

My point is this game does not rely on athletes like football or basketball. It relies on skills and technical ability way more. You can be athletic all you want. If your touch is crap, you won’t amount to anything in the sport. Sorry.

Hmm I think every sport needs skilled athletes don’t they? Anyway nothing to argue about.

 

[StylisticS]

We need skilled athletes. lol Soccers players are great athletes and probably the most fit of any major sport.

I'm not talking about them just running around the field. If that constitutes athletic, than I guess we do need that. But when people talk about athletic ability as it compares to American sport players, you need to run the fastest, jump the highest, and perform like they perform in our football and in basketball. You rarely need to show that in soccer in large bursts at least.

I mean there is no forward that I have seen that has the technical ability and skill as Lacazette on this goal.



Or this from Firminho.

 

[StylisticS]

Hmm I think every sport needs skilled athletes don’t they? Anyway nothing to argue about.

You're missing the point so it's whatever.

 

[atlantacowboy]

I'm not talking about them just running around the field. If that constitutes athletic, than I guess we do need that. But when people talk about athletic ability as it compares to American sport players, you need to run the fastest, jump the highest, and perform like they perform in our football and in basketball. You rarely need to show that in soccer in large bursts at least.

I mean there is no forward that I have seen that has the technical ability and skill as Lacazette on this goal.



Or this from Firminho.

You need a lot of athletic ability to acquire the technical ability and skill of which you speak. The problem in the US is that the best athletes here do not play soccer. In spain or france, that is not the case.

 

[StylisticS]

You need a lot of athletic ability to acquire the technical ability and skill of which you speak. The problem in the US is that the best athletes here do not play soccer. In spain or france, that is not the case.

I have to disagree with you on here when comparing it to American sports. I am not saying they are not athletic. I am saying your skill and technical ability is more important than your athleticism. The only position where athleticism is key in soccer comparing it to American sports is the goalkeeper since you use both your hands and feet when he is in the box. I also think it’s false to say the only reason the US does not succeed in soccer is because the best athletes play other sports.

 

[atlantacowboy]

I have to disagree with you on here when comparing it to American sports. I am not saying they are not athletic. I am saying your skill and technical ability is more important than your athleticism. The only position where athleticism is key in soccer comparing it to American sports is the goalkeeper since you use both your hands and feet when he is in the box. I also think it’s false to say the only reason the US does not succeed in soccer is because the best athletes play other sports.

To say that a pro soccer player is less of an athlete than a basketball or football player is just pure ignorance and using a very selective definition.

 

[StylisticS]

To say that a pro soccer player is less of an athlete than a basketball or football player is just pure ignorance and using a very selective definition.

I did not say that.

 

[jterrell]

Athletes really aren't the problem.
It has been a historic lack of development.
Now you have had high-priced skills training that is elite but it available to the very few and meant to make money first and foremost.
The MLS academies have done very very well but the US is in a very young stage right now and the academiss first crops are just now springing so to speak.

That's why the bad loss wasn't really so bad.
The starting line up was all kids who should factor in or simply be upgraded over the next 4-10 years.
They were no longer trotting out 30+ year old dudes as they did under Arena trying to qualify.
18 year old LB as opposed to bringing in a 35 year old?? Yes, please.

My first sport was soccer, I played for Santos FC as a club team.
I played a lot on Sundays at the park with all grown Hispanic dudes who spoke zero English.
I couldn't ask them to pass me the ball because the request was made in Spanish slang --"mojado" lololol.

These young US kids playing overseas will be very, very good.
It is a speed of game we can not really replicate in the US.
And speed of game and skills development at that pace is the key.

But the US is heqaded inthe right direction and with the right youth plan.
This isn't unlike England 3-4 years ago. They finally let the kids play and develop and now are very, very good.

 

[jterrell]

One note. Many US middle schools do not have soccer teams at all.
That is truly stupid and should be corrected.

The reason is the entire "PE staff" coaches football during the same "season".
So there is often no "free play" option at 6th to 8th grade.
With CTE being an issue drawing down investment in football to offer soccer is the only responsioble action.
--I quit soccer and basketball for full-time football in 10th grade but my middle school DID have soccer and I played there in one of the most athlete dense areas of the country. --Dallas Oak Cliff.

All that said girls face the same issues (and have basketball, volleyball, softball and track to peel off great atheltes) but are the best in the world, lol.

 

[joseephuss]

One note. Many US middle schools do not have soccer teams at all.
That is truly stupid and should be corrected.

The reason is the entire "PE staff" coaches football during the same "season".
So there is often no "free play" option at 6th to 8th grade.
With CTE being an issue drawing down investment in football to offer soccer is the only responsioble action.
--I quit soccer and basketball for full-time football in 10th grade but my middle school DID have soccer and I played there in one of the most athlete dense areas of the country. --Dallas Oak Cliff.

All that said girls face the same issues (and have basketball, volleyball, softball and track to peel off great atheltes) but are the best in the world, lol.

In Texas, high school football is played in the Fall and soccer games begin in January. I would think if a middle school had a team, they too would play in the Spring.

 

[Flamma]

You need a lot of athletic ability to acquire the technical ability and skill of which you speak. The problem in the US is that the best athletes here do not play soccer. In spain or france, that is not the case.

It's not a case of better athletes playing other sports, as if to say lesser athletes choose soccer. That's not the case. It's that most of the US. athletes in general choose to play sports besides soccer leaving a much smaller pool to work with. But that's not the only problem. Others in here have pointed that out already.

 

[jterrell]

In Texas, high school football is played in the Fall and soccer games begin in January. I would think if a middle school had a team, they too would play in the Spring.

In HS it overlaps but is possible to do both if you are very good at it.

Most good HS players refuse HS soccer and instead play a much higher level of club soccer which costs thousands per season.
Maybe 15-20 Texas HS have outstanding level of play regularly.
Most are trash.

Middle school is condensed so most don't offer it.

Boys football>basketball> track>baseball
soccer is really same as basketball season. --football players who double with basketball also join late.
for girls it is volleyball>basketball>track>softball

But soccer is still a first semester sport from a team building and practice perspective. Unless you've been there first semester you aren;t starting unless you are truly a stud.
And even if you are you've likely practiced or done zero skills work.

In other parts of the world kids JUST play soccer. The skill development is year round and constant.
And we are already seeing so many young kids come out of the MLS programs now.
There’s simply more time, money and support being poured into academies by most MLS teams than a few years ago. Whether that’s in the form of reserve teams in USL, fielding more teams at younger ages, or hiring more full-time coaches or support staff, much is going on behind the scenes that bears fruit on the field.

Dallas FC does a great job of working with school districts to get their athletic period away from campus so they can either train early or late school day stretching what they can fit into a day.

End of the day it is about development. You don't develop elite stamina, foot-eye coordination and ball control in any quick fashion.
Put most directly, more kids in other countries have far more time developing as a soccer player than the ones in the US do.

I played football, basketball, soccer, track and field as a freshman.
I stopped Soccer after my sophomore season because I wanted to focus on football which had more girls at the games....
I was our best goalkeeper and amongst the better field players but it was like soccer was a little cult that missed out on the rest of the school acitvities.
--I was also a class officer, debate team nerd and many other things ... pretty much obsessed with doing it all like many high schoolers.
Realistically I probably was best among all MYsports at soccer.
5'11", 195, 4.65 40. I had played growing up with elite level kids on travel teams.
I had unlimited gas tank -- I ran cross country kid who never even practiced cross country just showed up to meets and would finish first from our school tho far from first at the meet lol .
I could simply run all day.
Football wise I was fine but lacked elite hips or ankles. I was really good as a down hill tackler or anything that relied on power like blocking or blowing up blocks.
Asked to sink then flip my hips though I was pretty awful so I had to play strong safety in a CB body.
I was veer trained in high school (all out run play) then run n shoot blew up in my first year or so in college and I was lost in the sauce lol.

 

[Pessimist_cowboy]

We don’t have enough scouting at the youth level in this country. Many of our talented young players are actually scouted by European clubs lol. pulisic , Dest, Adams , McKennie we’re all picked out by European clubs. I hate to say this but coaches in America don’t know how to see talent. Another problem is most well organized soccer is only offered to middle class or above in this country. There’s tons of talented kids that aren’t discovered because there’s no system in place like other countries. In Spain, Brazil , Germany or Argentina they’ll discover talent at age 6-8 and develop them throughout their entire childhood.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

We don’t have enough scouting at the youth level in this country. Many of our talented young players are actually scouted by European clubs lol. pulisic , Dest, Adams , McKennie we’re all picked out by European clubs. I hate to say this but coaches in America don’t know how to see talent. Another problem is most well organized soccer is only offered to middle class or above in this country. There’s tons of talented kids that aren’t discovered because there’s no system in place like other countries. In Spain, Brazil , Germany or Argentina they’ll discover talent at age 6-8 and develop them throughout their entire childhood.

Exactly right.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

So I'm not ranting at Soccer, because if you like it, you like it. Doesn't matter to me.

But I am gonna rant about the unrealistic expectations of some Soccer fans. There's a very simple reason the US Men's team sucks compared to the US Women's team and it has everything to do with talent allocation. In this country, if you are a premier male athlete, then you are likely going to play in the NFL, MLB, NBA where you could make $35 million *if* you are the top paid guy. Hockey is a bit niche in that you have to know how to ice skate, but you can make about $15 million, maybe a bit more, but I don't know how many hockey players played soccer growing up. The highest paid MLS player who actually grew up in America is Michael Bradley and he makes $6 million.

For comparisons sake, there is no NFL or MLB for the top female athletes. Women's soccer is more or less competing with the WNBA and I *think* they pay better. So in essence if you're a woman and a great athlete, you're likely to continue playing Soccer a lot longer. And unfortunately for people who want to see US Men's Soccer become competitive, it's an endless cycle, MLS players won't get paid more until more talent goes into that sport and more talent won't go into that sport until the money is there. Yes kids see Lebron James and Steph Curry on TV and want to be them, but once kids get older and the adults with money (AAU clubs, University boosters, MLB scouts) can identify who has a future, they will steer them towards playing one sport and that just won't be Soccer and there isn't anything that coaching or youth investment can do to change the fact that the money just isn't there.