Vince McMahon's list of the top 5 wrestlers of all time...

[BoysFan4ever]

Why do so many wrestlers die so young? I see it all the time in the news.

Is it that demanding physically?

 

[Cowboy Brian]

I just started reading "The Greatest Professional Wrestlers of All Time" by Larry Matysik.

Anyway it starts out by listing the "Top 50 Superstars" that Vince McMahon put out a couple years ago...

Here are the top 5 of that list:
1. Shawn Michaels
2. The Undertaker
3. Stone Cold Steve Austin
4. Bret Hart
5. Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson

It's a stunning list that you couldn't help look at and either laugh or cry.

It's a respectable list from his perspective. My list is

#1 - Shawn Michaels
#2 - Ric Flair
#3 - Kurt Angle
#4 - Stone Cold Steve Austin
#5 - Undertaker/Bret Hart/The Rock

 

[MichaelWinicki]

It's a respectable list from his perspective. My list is

#1 - Shawn Michaels
#2 - Ric Flair
#3 - Kurt Angle
#4 - Stone Cold Steve Austin
#5 - Undertaker/Bret Hart/The Rock

I could live with that if it's from say 1995 on.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Why do so many wrestlers die so young? I see it all the time in the news.

Is it that demanding physically?

The physical stuff is part of it.

One year Ric Flair wrestled like 380 times in one year. Yes, there were times when he wrestled twice in one day... Once in an afternoon show and then fly/drive to an evening show.

One time he wrestled Ricky Morton 15 days in a row, with most of the matches going 1 hour.

Think of the wear and tear on the body even though it they weren't delivering full impact hits or kicks.
All that wear and tear probably doesn't lead to a long life. And with all that pain came the pain-killers. Or anything else to deaden the pain which was on the menu for many of them.

Which of course led to drug addiction for many. Not to mention affecting the body in negative ways.

The loneliness of being on the road that much must be brutal... These guys have money in their pockets and a few hours of boredom... Recreational drugs and alcohol are the result, which aren't going to contribute to a long life either.

Keep in mind there is no or was no "Prowrestler Union". Each guy (or gal) is their own product. There was no support system in place. The promoters were more of their adversary than the guy across them in the ring.

It's a very hard life.

 

[jimmy40]

My #1, but I haven't watched wrestling since I was about 12.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

My #1, but I haven't watched wrestling since I was about 12.

Wahoo was terrific. He was never a World Champion which keeps me from having him in the top 10 but certainly in my top 50.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Even just having a list of pre-1990's World Champions... Guys that held the title for an extended period of time and not just a couple months (or less):

Ric Flair
Harley Race
Dusty Rhodes
Dory Funk Jr.
Terry Funk
Jack Brisco
Nick Bockwinkle
Vern Gagne
Lou Thesz
Buddy Rogers
Bruno Sammartino
Superstar Billy Graham
Bob Backlund
Hulk Hogan
Pedro Morales

That's 15 guys right there. Now I'm not saying that being a long-term World Champ puts you at the top of the list but it should get you in the top 50.

Add in some of the Champs from 1990 onward and that's going to fatten the list up even more.

 

[BoysFan4ever]

The physical stuff is part of it.

One year Ric Flair wrestled like 380 times in one year. Yes, there were times when he wrestled twice in one day... Once in an afternoon show and then fly/drive to an evening show.

One time he wrestled Ricky Morton 15 days in a row, with most of the matches going 1 hour.

Think of the wear and tear on the body even though it they weren't delivering full impact hits or kicks.
All that wear and tear probably doesn't lead to a long life. And with all that pain came the pain-killers or anything else to deaden the pain was on the menu for many of them.

Which of course led to drug addiction for many. Not to mention affecting the body in negative ways.

The loneliness of being on the road that much must be brutal... These guys have money in their pockets and a few hours of boredom... Recreational drugs and alcohol are the result, which aren't going to contribute to a long life either.

Keep in mind there is no or was no "Prowrestler Union". Each guy (or gal) is their own product. There was no support system in place. The promoters were more of their adversary than the guy across them in the ring.

It's a very hard life.

I was flipping through a paper the other day & saw where some wrestler died. I can see where it would be a very hard life. In my mind it must be like being a stunt person.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I was flipping through a paper the other day & saw where some wrestler died. I can see where it would be a very hard life. In my mind it must be like being a stunt person.

Good analogy, being a wrestler is even harder because it's almost an everyday thing. Just a tremendous grind.

 

[BoysFan4ever]

I hope they make a lot of money from the owner or promotion or whatever they call it.

 

[mmohican29]

I have to think Triple H needs to be on the list. Has anyone held the WWE Title Belt more times? Also: from a technical standpoint, I think Bret Hart is the greatest wrestler of all time.

 

[lane]

no list is complete without tully blanchard and arn anderson

greg "the hammer" valentine and dean malenko were awesome too.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

I don't see how Hogan can be left off a top 5 list. For starters, he was the main event for so long in the WWF and helped establish them as the dominant wrestling organization. Then he was instrumental in putting WCW ahead of the WWF. Yes the nWo was more Bicshoff's, Nash's and Hall's idea, but it just didn't work without Hogan. Arguably the greatest face and greatest heel of all time.

 

[RastaRocket]

Good analogy, being a wrestler is even harder because it's almost an everyday thing. Just a tremendous grind.

How can you knock a guy for not being world champion when wrestling is staged?

 

[DanteEXT]

The physical stuff is part of it.

One year Ric Flair wrestled like 380 times in one year. Yes, there were times when he wrestled twice in one day... Once in an afternoon show and then fly/drive to an evening show.

One time he wrestled Ricky Morton 15 days in a row, with most of the matches going 1 hour.

Think of the wear and tear on the body even though it they weren't delivering full impact hits or kicks.
All that wear and tear probably doesn't lead to a long life. And with all that pain came the pain-killers. Or anything else to deaden the pain which was on the menu for many of them.

Which of course led to drug addiction for many. Not to mention affecting the body in negative ways.

The loneliness of being on the road that much must be brutal... These guys have money in their pockets and a few hours of boredom... Recreational drugs and alcohol are the result, which aren't going to contribute to a long life either.

Keep in mind there is no or was no "Prowrestler Union". Each guy (or gal) is their own product. There was no support system in place. The promoters were more of their adversary than the guy across them in the ring.

It's a very hard life.

At the 80's Superstars taping show I attended several wrestlers performed multiple times. Granted none were hour long matches. WWE got 3-4 weeks worth of episodes out of it. Yes the ring is padded somewhat and it gives a little plus they have gym mats on the floor, I'd have to agree that the cumulative effect over 20-30 years would take it's toll on your body.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

How can you knock a guy for not being world champion when wrestling is staged?

Easy. Determining who was going to be world champ, at least in the NWA was done through a group of several prominent individuals. It wasn't something that was taken lightly. The person selected had to not only represent the organization in a high manner, he had to be an excellent worker who could take bumps. And keep in mind maybe the two most important criteria of a world champion– make his opponent look like a credible threat and finally... draw money.

I remember Harley Race once saying his greatest ability was being able to take anyone and make them look like a dangerous opponent.

That being said I think anyone that was a world champ for any extended period of time has to be included in at least the top 50.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I don't see how Hogan can be left off a top 5 list. For starters, he was the main event for so long in the WWF and helped establish them as the dominant wrestling organization. Then he was instrumental in putting WCW ahead of the WWF. Yes the nWo was more Bicshoff's, Nash's and Hall's idea, but it just didn't work without Hogan. Arguably the greatest face and greatest heel of all time.

Yep. I'm not a Hogan fan, but you have to give him his due... He's definitely in my top 10.

 

[casmith07]

No kidding.

If someone put together a list of the top 300 wrestlers of all-time– Mysterio wouldn't be there.

Bullcrap! He should be. He is singlehandedly the best Luchadore that's ever lived. No respect for Los Luchadores!?

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Bullcrap! He should be. He is singlehandedly the best Luchadore that's ever lived. No respect for Los Luchadores!?

The problem is the length of career spent working for a major US promotion. If I did include talent from outside the US, who spent much of their careers wrestling for non-US promotions I would rank Mil Mascaras much higher than Mysterio.

And then you have several Japanese wrestlers who would rank higher. In addition Carlos Colon would rank higher.

 

[burmafrd]

The problem is the length of career spent working for a major US promotion. If I did include talent from outside the US, who spent much of their careers wrestling for non-US promotions I would rank Mil Mascaras much higher than Mysterio.

And then you have several Japanese wrestlers who would rank higher. In addition Carlos Colon would rank higher.

The Crusher
Mad Dog Vachon
I can remember those days