What specifically is wrong with Roy Williams?

[mr.jameswoods]

I'm only interested in hearing from people who believe Roy Williams isn't the answer. I'm looking for specific reasons and not "He is not very good" I'm not trying to start a flame or ask a rhetorical question.

I'm suprised people are interested in getting rid of him. Yes, I think he is overrated and his coverage skills stink but I don't think that's enough to warrant getting rid of him. He is a great tackler (minus recent incident) and occassionally makes plays in coverage. I've always thought of Williams as a solid SS. I've always known about his weaknesess but I never thought they were bad enough to warrant cutting him and risking replacing him with soeone else.

I want to hear from your side. Why do you think he is a liability to us. Again, I only want to hear from the Williams critics. This is not meant to be a thread for fighting so if you are a huge Roy Williams fan, resist the urge to argue on his behalf in this thread. I just want to hear the reasons for cutting him. Maybe, there is something I'm not seeing

 

[stealth]

will this ever end?

 

[theogt]

will this ever end?

It's the last real debate left until the draft.

 

[mr.jameswoods]

will this ever end?

I read the other thread but people just made generalized statements without going into specifics. Hey, I find this topic interesting. I never considered getting rid of Roy Williams. What are people seeing that I'm missing. That's all

 

[Rampage]

hey look! another roy thread

 

[Chuck 54]

Roy Williams is serviceable...Roy Williams is usually a beast against the run.

I do not think he's the answer...when his contract gets to a palatable point, I believe he'll be gone.

Can we win a SB with him at SS? Sure we can...he's better than most safeties.

Why do I think he is not the best answer? I think you're better off in the NFL with two safeties who can cover the pass better, even if it means neither is as good as Roy against the run. A good defense is stout up front with the front 7. We are getting better and better there, meaning the need for a ramrod at safety becomes less important.

The NFL is a passing league and will continue to become more and more a passing league, if that's possible. I'd love to have a great FS like Reid and a guy like Hamlin at SS. I even like Palamalou....he is just as bad as Roy in pass coverage, but he is so quick to the ball, he makes up for it against most QB's.

Roy is a great player with flaws...he is not a crappy safety. Does he deserve the probowl this year? maybe not...but he's close enough to the top to get another call. I think his days in Hawaii are slipping away, but he's certainly not holding us back from winning games like he was when he was misused.

I'd be happy to upgrade this team at OLG, FB, RB, WR, backup QB, CB, ILB, and SS. All of those players are good enough to win a SB, but that doesn't mean I don't think we could upgrade those positions.

 

[theogt]

Why do I think he is not the best answer? I think you're better off in the NFL with two safeties who can cover the pass better, even if it means neither is as good as Roy against the run. A good defense is stout up front with the front 7. We are getting better and better there, meaning the need for a ramrod at safety becomes less important.

The NFL is a passing league and will continue to become more and more a passing league, if that's possible. I'd love to have a great FS like Reid and a guy like Hamlin at SS. I even like Palamalou....he is just as bad as Roy in pass coverage, but he is so quick to the ball, he makes up for it against most QB's.

I agree with all this, but I'd point out that what Wade does on our dime defense works around this. It gets 2 FS of the field and a "dime backer" in short coverage who can also play the run very well. In that regard I don't mind having a run stopping safety. It's actually preferable if you have a 2nd FS that come off the bench and play well like Watkins.

 

[MapleLeaf]

...fitting into round holes Roy Williams is ideal when moving forward to the ball - either pass or run.

Unfortunately not every play in game allows Roy to principally play going forward.

More and more he is becoming a specialist. So in order to take advantage of the best Roy has to offer you need to substitute him in and out of packages.

That's alot of money being paid to what is turning into a package player.

Yeah there's alot worse in the league, but I agree with Wayne in seeing this league transform into a defend the pass first and plug the gap on the run second.

Roy's not a bad player, he's just terribly expensive for what he's good at.

 

[theogt]

That's alot of money being paid to what is turning into a package player.

He plays in all but 2 of our 7 or so defensive packages. There are only 4 players on defense that play in all 7 packages, and 2 of those 4 get substituted out pretty regularly, leaving only 2 players that play just about every snap. The 2 packages in which Roy does not play make up probably less than 5% of all of our defensive snaps on the season.

 

[2much2soon]

I've always thought of Williams as a solid SS.

Solid? Seriously?
The guy was on track to being an all-time great at his position after his first two seasons in the league.
Now he has slipped to the point where he can't even make the pro bowl on what was once a considerable reputation, anymore.
I think he should be gone for one big reason; he doesn't play up to his capability.
Having a guy like that, a high-paid high-profile veteran, can't be good for the younger players on the team.

 

[WoLF2001]

Jesus freaking christ ppl...

PLZ lock this damn thread..

 

[bbgun]

His breath.

 

[MapleLeaf]

He plays in all but 2 of our 7 or so defensive packages. There are only 4 players on defense that play in all 7 packages, and 2 of those 4 get substituted out pretty regularly, leaving only 2 players that play just about every snap. The 2 packages in which Roy does not play make up probably less than 5% of all of our defensive snaps on the season.

...that he is still a good defensive player, but his talents are not being used in all the situations he's being played in.

This league is all about managing your weaknesses. You minimize yours and isolate on theirs. That's a certain amount of the coaching in the NFL.

If I was to talk about Roy Williams I would say:

Eager to go downhill to fill the gap on running plays.

Better than average recognition skills.

Fills well in short to intermediate zones.

Poor when transitioning from back pedal to forward run.

Average tracking ball in the air.

Prone at times to poor form tackling.

Not an ideal cover two safety.

 

[vta]

Jesus freaking christ ppl...

PLZ lock this damn thread..

How many friggin' one line 'Romo is God, how did we get so locky' threads can someone stomach?

This little 'who can post what on a site that's not even mine' clique is lame. If you don't like the topic, don't click on it.

 

[big dog cowboy]

will this ever end?

Yes.

You don't see any QC/C Hutch threads any more do you?

Just give it a few years.

 

[theogt]

...that he is still a good defensive player, but his talents are not being used in all the situations he's being played in.

This league is all about managing your weaknesses. You minimize yours and isolate on theirs. That's a certain amount of the coaching in the NFL.

If I was to talk about Roy Williams I would say:

Eager to go downhill to fill the gap on running plays.

Better than average recognition skills.

Fills well in short to intermediate zones.

Poor when transitioning from back pedal to forward run.

Average tracking ball in the air.

Prone at times to poor form tackling.

Not an ideal cover two safety.

I'd agree with everything but the tackling. I think he's a fine tackler for a guy his size. According to Wade he's already at 100+ this year, and that's with a damn good front seven.

 

[AbeBeta]

I've posted this before but here goes again.

My issues.

1. Thin skinned. Roy complains when he gets blamed for poor play and says "you don't know the play call." Shut up and let your play do the talking.

2. Poor leader. He needed to step up and be the defensive leader after Woodson went down. He never did. It was clear the other defensive players expected this from him as none of them wanted to step on his toes and take the leadership role from him. That created a leadership vacuum that persists.

3. Poor play? My only issue with his play is that he doesn't hit like he used to. He is OK in coverage. He's a strong safety so he should be expected to get burned by TEs.

 

[Chuck 54]

I agree with all this, but I'd point out that what Wade does on our dime defense works around this. It gets 2 FS of the field and a "dime backer" in short coverage who can also play the run very well. In that regard I don't mind having a run stopping safety. It's actually preferable if you have a 2nd FS that come off the bench and play well like Watkins.

I agree, but I also think he makes wayyyyyyyyy too much money to not be a top all around safety...that's why I'd replace him with a better coverage guy.

 

[lane]

it was a couple years ago..........he came on a blitz against a team i can't remember at the moment.

roy went head first..the qb ducked at the nick of time and roy collided with one of our defensive ends thighs.

he immediately grabbed the back of his neck and has never hit the same since. serious wake up call.

it's pure luck he never paralyzed himself earlier in his career the way he lead with his head and neck.

roy just needs to learn the art of wrapping up and he will be fine.

 

[Cochese]

Whats wrong with Roy, in my opinion, is that he is not the same player we all watched with delight in his rookie year. Where are the impact plays? Big hitter Roy hasnt forced a fumble or gotten a sack since 05!