Why not grab Baker Mayfield? Dak may not be the answer

[basel90]

You don't base a contract based on current year record which is still in progress. That shows you to be an instigator or amateur or both.

Prior years and past performance plus market plus what's available in market.

Secondly you argue wins and losses are on QB so that comes across clearly. In the meantime @MountaineerCowboy is adamant that it's not. So two different goal posts. In the process you completely absolved the defense which at the time (given your argument is focused at the time results) was the absolute worst defense in history of NFL by a mile. So with that line of argument you are putting the entire result of any game and by extension of the season on offense and given your line of argument on the QB. This clearly spells out your agenda.

I disagree with your list. It's your opinion. You put baker ahead of Ryan. Nobody in the NFL and I mean nobody in the NFL would ever do that. This again clearly shows you are trying to push your agenda based on your original post.

I wouldn't put tannehill or grapolo above Dak. Both have much better support than Dak. Those defenses are great. Both running games are fantastic. Not ready to crown Murray anything. He hasn't done anything or shown anything. Much like your complaints about Dak, he was hot and then he collapsed

But I get you. I get your agenda.

you are entitled to your opinion and i disagree with you , there is no agenda or anything,
Ryan was better a few years ago he has aged and there are issues with his confidence now . don't use name calling or distractions and accusations to get away from the main issue.
have you watched Garopolo or murray in major games. They are more accurate, especially Garoppolo . even Aikman said that . Does he have an agenda ?

Murray is simiply more versatile and has the wheels , which dak lacks now , hence the MM comment on the need to get him to move. Will see. This coming season will show a lot.

 

[basel90]

So your goal posts is a moving target. Which tells me your goal is to just win the argument at hand. Here you say that wins and losses aren't on the QB. In your other response you said Dak was 2-3...

So you clearly are trying to be on both sides of the fence at the same time. Perhaps you live in aultiverae that allows for that.

no , Dak has not won a Playoff game in 4 years. Elite QBs with decent supporting cast around them ( Like the cowboys). don't go on such droughts. Heck, look at joe Burrow ? he took a less talented roster to the super bowl and almost won. Many elite QBs do this if you have forgotten . Look at Joe Burrow as an example more carefully . A case where a QB doesn't use excuses and just makes things happen on the field.
The parade of excuses with Dak have to end. Dez is Gone, Garret is gone , Defense vastly improved. He has great receivers etc etc. he has to do his part now.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

What's this got to do with me?

Nothing. Just complementing you.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

you are entitled to your opinion and i disagree with you , there is no agenda or anything,
Ryan was better a few years ago he has aged and there are issues with his confidence now . don't use name calling or distractions and accusations to get away from the main issue.
have you watched Garopolo or murray in major games. They are more accurate, especially Garoppolo . even Aikman said that . Does he have an agenda ?

Murray is simiply more versatile and has the wheels , which dak lacks now , hence the MM comment on the need to get him to move. Will see. This coming season will show a lot.

Opinions are ok. But they are what they are. And many are wrong.

I have seen grapolo and Murray have bad games. I have seen them lean on the rest of the team. They both need and lean on the rest of the team to get to wins more than you realize. I.e. when you pass 8 times in a game and win by running the ball you are 100% leaning on the rest of the twam. Yet people such as yourself make sure you call out Dak and credit rest of the team and blame him for not carrying the team and act as if Dak has never stepped up to win games...that much is evident

Ryan today is still 1000 times better than baker. Like I said you are probably the only person in the world that would rank baker ahead of Ryan. Nobody in any NFL office would do that. Evident that indy was willing to trade for Ryan and didn't give a second thought to baker and baker still sitting home waiting for somebody to say I want you.

I do not like RBs that play QB Alan Jackson and somewhat Murray. They often don't find success in playoffs and are easily neutralized by better defenses as you get deeper in playoffs. We have seen that with Jackson. Murray hasn't accomplished much yet and as a #1 over all pick has underwhelmed. He has had a nice team around him too.

So on the one hand you tout records to knock Dak and yet you ignore those very records with these other QBs. Like I said you are trying to live on both sides of the fence. And seemingly your goal is to win the argument at hand

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

no , Dak has not won a Playoff game in 4 years. Elite QBs with decent supporting cast around them ( Like the cowboys). don't go on such droughts. Heck, look at joe Burrow ? he took a less talented roster to the super bowl and almost won. Many elite QBs do this if you have forgotten . Look at Joe Burrow as an example more carefully . A case where a QB doesn't use excuses and just makes things happen on the field.
The parade of excuses with Dak have to end. Dez is Gone, Garret is gone , Defense vastly improved. He has great receivers etc etc. he has to do his part now.

Heck look at Joe burrow. #1 over all pick. Who next year will probably break the bank. But with that said I like burrow. He is on the verge of being elite knocking at the door. I will not knock and attack Dak for not being elite.

And here you go again...one post you blame Dak for not winning games. Another post you said wins and losses are on the team. so which is it? Is it or is it not.

And Dak had a decent team in 18. Went 1-1 in playoffs. Disappointed in team performance against rams. 19 team was meh. 20 he was injured.

21 preseason I predicted we probably will miss the playoffs. If things fall in place we make it. However many d season I rebaselined my expectations and was disappointed in our playoff performance. Defense. Offense. Coaching. Preparation....it was bad. I am not excusing Dak for his performance. But I am also not excusing anybody else. he wasn't the sole reason we lost. He definitely contributed to it.

 

[phildadon86]

your earlier comment about Dak playing great against tampa ?? for one , the cowbosy lost, second , he missed crucial throws if you watch the 4th Qtr. On the good start , it is too subjective , and you cannot arguably ignore the whole body of work . I don't give a lick or care if you ignore or not , this is a discussion forum and if you don't like discussions that don't agree with your golden boy , it is your business.

yeah the cowboys lost. Was it Dak's fault? Be careful. This will tell the whole board who you are.

Was the Tampa loss Daks fault?

 

[ondaedg]

you are entitled to your opinion and i disagree with you , there is no agenda or anything,
Ryan was better a few years ago he has aged and there are issues with his confidence now . don't use name calling or distractions and accusations to get away from the main issue.
have you watched Garopolo or murray in major games. They are more accurate, especially Garoppolo . even Aikman said that . Does he have an agenda ?

Murray is simiply more versatile and has the wheels , which dak lacks now , hence the MM comment on the need to get him to move. Will see. This coming season will show a lot.

Garropolo is more accurate in major games? Do you seriously just invent stuff to support your crazy narratives?

he averaged 137yds/g in the playoffs with 4td/6ints for his career.

 

[basel90]

Opinions are ok. But they are what they are. And many are wrong.

I have seen grapolo and Murray have bad games. I have seen them lean on the rest of the team. They both need and lean on the rest of the team to get to wins more than you realize. I.e. when you pass 8 times in a game and win by running the ball you are 100% leaning on the rest of the twam. Yet people such as yourself make sure you call out Dak and credit rest of the team and blame him for not carrying the team and act as if Dak has never stepped up to win games...that much is evident

Ryan today is still 1000 times better than baker. Like I said you are probably the only person in the world that would rank baker ahead of Ryan. Nobody in any NFL office would do that. Evident that indy was willing to trade for Ryan and didn't give a second thought to baker and baker still sitting home waiting for somebody to say I want you.

I do not like RBs that play QB Alan Jackson and somewhat Murray. They often don't find success in playoffs and are easily neutralized by better defenses as you get deeper in playoffs. We have seen that with Jackson. Murray hasn't accomplished much yet and as a #1 over all pick has underwhelmed. He has had a nice team around him too.

So on the one hand you tout records to knock Dak and yet you ignore those very records with these other QBs. Like I said you are trying to live on both sides of the fence. And seemingly your goal is to win the argument at hand

i disagree with your hype of dak , as simple as that . You have classified him as elite and needs to get paid accordingly. Your asessment of ryan and murray and garopolo is not accurate . don't use terms like 1000 times etc . Ryan is 37 ?? and has had issues. In his prime he is better but not now.

 

[basel90]

Heck look at Joe burrow. #1 over all pick. Who next year will probably break the bank. But with that said I like burrow. He is on the verge of being elite knocking at the door. I will not knock and attack Dak for not being elite.

And here you go again...one post you blame Dak for not winning games. Another post you said wins and losses are on the team. so which is it? Is it or is it not.

And Dak had a decent team in 18. Went 1-1 in playoffs. Disappointed in team performance against rams. 19 team was meh. 20 he was injured.

21 preseason I predicted we probably will miss the playoffs. If things fall in place we make it. However many d season I rebaselined my expectations and was disappointed in our playoff performance. Defense. Offense. Coaching. Preparation....it was bad. I am not excusing Dak for his performance. But I am also not excusing anybody else. he wasn't the sole reason we lost. He definitely contributed to it.

The same rotating point i am making, he is not a difference maker. Period.

 

[basel90]

yeah the cowboys lost. Was it Dak's fault? Be careful. This will tell the whole board who you are.

Was the Tampa loss Daks fault?

Teams lose games , not individuals. But an elite QB can be the difference in such games . This is my argument. At 42 mil a year , dak was not the difference in important games , especially being surrounded with a good enough team to win such games. Plus the defense has vastly improved. Thus the argument : is Dak good enough to make the difference ?

 

[phildadon86]

Teams lose games , not individuals. But an elite QB can be the difference in such games . This is my argument. At 42 mil a year , dak was not the difference in important games , especially being surrounded with a good enough team to win such games. Plus the defense has vastly improved. Thus the argument : is Dak good enough to make the difference ?

Our kicker missed 2 XPs and a chip shot field goal. Dak did everything he could in that game. And it took the refs letting an obvious OPI go uncalled for "Dak" not to lead the Cowboys to beating the champs. In his first game back from breaking his ankle in half. Keep up the good fight.

 

[basel90]

Our kicker missed 2 XPs and a chip shot field goal. Dak did everything he could in that game. And it took the refs letting an obvious OPI go uncalled for "Dak" not to lead the Cowboys to beating the champs. In his first game back from breaking his ankle in half. Keep up the good fight.

It was his best game of the season ironically . No one expected the team to win that one.

 

[mattjames2010]

Because he sucks?

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

i disagree with your hype of dak , as simple as that . You have classified him as elite and needs to get paid accordingly. Your asessment of ryan and murray and garopolo is not accurate . don't use terms like 1000 times etc . Ryan is 37 ?? and has had issues. In his prime he is better but not now.

I didn't hype Dak. I simply asked a question from you based on your own standards of measure since you have clearly bern inconsistent in that from post to post.

Show me one post that I classified dak as elite. As a matter of fact I have gone out of my way to say I don't think he is elite. But I get it. Based on your view if I don't bash him in everything all the time I must think he is elite....or similar logic to that.

Ryan is 37. Rodgers is 39. Brady is 40 something. Baker is 20 something. Baker is still a much worse QB than Ryan. And given Indy thinks they may r close and Wentz was a disaster, then they are going with a guy who they think will give them the best chance to make a run and win it. And it clearly isn't baker.

Btw, it's funny that when all other arguments fail, inevitably the Dak bashers go to salary. The one go to move. It's pretty funny

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

The same rotating point i am making, he is not a difference maker. Period.

I am not arguing that. He is inconsistent...

 

[GINeric]

no , Dak has not won a Playoff game in 4 years. Elite QBs with decent supporting cast around them ( Like the cowboys). don't go on such droughts. Heck, look at joe Burrow ? he took a less talented roster to the super bowl and almost won. Many elite QBs do this if you have forgotten . Look at Joe Burrow as an example more carefully . A case where a QB doesn't use excuses and just makes things happen on the field.
The parade of excuses with Dak have to end. Dez is Gone, Garret is gone , Defense vastly improved. He has great receivers etc etc. he has to do his part now.

Quarterbacks don't win playoff games, teams do. But since we're speaking of playoff success, Brees, Manning and Dak all have only ONE playoff win in their 5, 6 years in the NFL, Matt Stafford had ZERO playoff wins in that same amount of time.

Those guys were 1st round picks, Dak was a 4th round pick. So according to your measuring system, what should I take from this??

 

[basel90]

Quarterbacks don't win playoff games, teams do. But since we're speaking of playoff success, Brees, Manning and Dak all have only ONE playoff win in their 5, 6 years in the NFL, Matt Stafford had ZERO playoff wins in that same amount of time.

Those guys were 1st round picks, Dak was a 4th round pick. So according to your measuring system, what should I take from this??

Good points, and actually suprising to know Brees and Manning had such droughts .
if dak ends up anywhere similar to these HOF & Super Bowl winning QBs. But at this stage you cannot put Dak in any catergory with these QBs for accomplishments.
For matt , being with the lions probably gives him some valid excuse and he came out and helped win the super bowl rather quickly when he changed teams.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Good points, and actually suprising to know Brees and Manning had such droughts .
if dak ends up anywhere similar to these HOF & Super Bowl winning QBs. But at this stage you cannot put Dak in any catergory with these QBs for accomplishments.
For matt , being with the lions probably gives him some valid excuse and he came out and helped win the super bowl rather quickly when he changed teams.

First I am surprised you are surprised. These are readily available information. So you are not well informed.

You are writing the ending in the middle of the book. Yes, manning was consensus #1 pick. And destined to be great. Yet he struggled his first few years. Nobody knew brees was going to be this good. In fact SD drafted Rivers to replace Brees as they had given up and Miami passed and he ended up in NO.

Lastly, plenty of teams reach the Superbowl and win it with middle of the pack QBs. Dilfer, Grossman, Wentz/foles, Eli, flacco, grapolo, etc. And plenty of great QBs never reach it, ala rivers, Marino reached it once and didn't whiff it again, fouts, and plenty of others. You need the right team to win.

 

[Whyjerry]

Baker is a locker room cancer. No way.

 

[GINeric]

Good points, and actually suprising to know Brees and Manning had such droughts .
if dak ends up anywhere similar to these HOF & Super Bowl winning QBs. But at this stage you cannot put Dak in any catergory with these QBs for accomplishments.
For matt , being with the lions probably gives him some valid excuse and he came out and helped win the super bowl rather quickly when he changed teams.

Of course at this point we can't compare him to those quarterbacks, they were seasoned veterans. Have you ever seen a 4th round pick quarterback with only 6 years experience like Dak get compared to the well seasoned veteran quarterbacks with total 10 to 15 years body of work??? I can't think of no 4th rounder in history other than Dak who's 5 or 6 years was compared to 15 year veterans. Thats crazy.

As far as Matt Stafford "quickly" winning a Superbowl.... half the quarterbacks in the NFL including Dak, would have won a superbowl with that Rams defense, throwing to OBJ and Kupp, and McVay calling the plays.