Why taking a knee is respectful

[JoeKing]

I know you cannot tell someone's tone on a message board, so I just want to make it clear I am not putting down your point. I just seriously, for discussions sake, want to ask how exactly are people being treated unequally by the system?

I'd like a discussion about it. I'm pretty level headed, but I would like to know how people are really being oppressed still, and who is really responsible for their oppression?

My daughter lives in a mobile home park void of black folks but she sees them at the park office applying for residency all the time. My dad lives on a golf course in Lake Jackson Texas that will not allow black residence. I fired a white guy from my business about 6 months ago when he and another gentlemen that just so happen to be black were both up for the same job. I decided to called them into my office one at a time to ask them why they are better qualified for the job. The white guy was first and the first thing out of his mouth was, "c'mon boss, your not really going to consider that..... (n-word). Need I go on?

 

[Trouty]

This is the only one left in the Drama zone I can post on sadly, sure it will come to an end soon. Ill be over in the Off-Topic Zone playing the Word Association game by lunch

Wait, how many threads are you booted from? Lol

 

[EST_1986]

Wait, how many threads are you booted from? Lol

in the Drama zone, the Landry debacle, Goodbye Cowboys and the Tillman threads lol.

Im Anne Frank in this one so far.

 

[jjtrcka22]

My daughter lives in a mobile home park void of black folks but she sees them at the park office applying for residency all the time. My dad lives on a golf course in Lake Jackson Texas that will not allow black residence. I fired a white guy from my business about 6 months ago when he and another gentlemen that just so happen to be black were both up for the same job. I decided to called them into my office one at a time to ask them why they are better qualified for the job. The white guy was first and the first thing out of his mouth was, "c'mon boss, your not really going to consider that..... (n-word). Need I go on?

Sorry it's taken me a while to get back to you. And I am relying on 4g (1st world problems, I know) right now.

Instances like that are obviously wrong. But that is not a problem with the system. It's a problem with that individual. I guess what you are talking about is changing the attitudes of individuals who have these kinds of hateful feelings in their hearts. I guess I can respect wanting to bring awareness that these kinds of things happen. Thanks for sharing that.

I will add that you will never fully get rid of discriminatory people. People will prejudge others based on skin color, weight, looks, and anything else that allows them to quickly slap a label on someone.

And I guess a lot of my issue is the hypocrisy. Free speech seems to only be promoted when someone is speaking about issues that fit certain agendas. The cowboys not getting to where the sticker honoring the murdered cops really irks me.

And I'm writing this on my phone. I'll try to get back on the computer later. My thoughts might not be coming out well organized.

 

[jjtrcka22]

I'm game. Rand talked about it multiple times during the presidential debates: http://fortune.com/2016/01/29/rand-paul-race-criminal-justice-republican-debate/

I didn't click the link, but I read your quote. Sorry on my phone and internet is intermittent out here. Just because the drug use is "about normal" doesn't tell the whole story. It is possible that more crimes in general are actually committed by that segment. And if not, there needs to be a way to prove that they are being set up, or that other races are just being let off and not imprisoned.

I guess it could be more of a socioeconomic issue and people without as much money cannot hire as good of lawyers (Or hire one at all).

I guess something could be done to improve court appointed attorney's. Offer more money for those positions, for one.

There is still the issue of committing the crime itself.

And I'll try to get on my pc later. Writing this on my phone is frustrating (fat fingers). It's nice to civily discuss this with others.

 

[65fastback2plus2]

I didn't click the link, but I read your quote. Sorry on my phone and internet is intermittent out here. Just because the drug use is "about normal" doesn't tell the whole story. It is possible that more crimes in general are actually committed by that segment. And if not, there needs to be a way to prove that they are being set up, or that other races are just being let off and not imprisoned.

I guess it could be more of a socioeconomic issue and people without as much money cannot hire as good of lawyers (Or hire one at all).

I guess something could be done to improve court appointed attorney's. Offer more money for those positions, for one.

There is still the issue of committing the crime itself.

And I'll try to get on my pc later. Writing this on my phone is frustrating (fat fingers). It's nice to civily discuss this with others.

Thanks for your response.

What really needs to happen is crime moves back to harming another's personal property or person. Instead, we have crimes for everything under the sun. Literally everything is a crime one way or another.

I mean, you can get arrested for feeding the homeless: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/man-90-arrested-week-feeding-homeless-article-1.2002790

Check out this list of actual things people have been charged with felonies for:

1) Receiving a shipment in the wrong packaging
2) Getting lost in the woods
3) Taking a fake sick day
4) Tell friends and family not to use services at a company you formerly worked for
5) Creating a website for a religious charity

https://mic.com/articles/86797/8-ways-we-regularly-commit-felonies-without-realizing-it#.9vyj0mFvr

It would fix itself instantly if we went back to actual crimes, and not made up crimes for the purposes of manipulation and extortion.

 

[JoeKing]

Sorry it's taken me a while to get back to you. And I am relying on 4g (1st world problems, I know) right now.

Instances like that are obviously wrong. But that is not a problem with the system. It's a problem with that individual. I guess what you are talking about is changing the attitudes of individuals who have these kinds of hateful feelings in their hearts. I guess I can respect wanting to bring awareness that these kinds of things happen. Thanks for sharing that.

I will add that you will never fully get rid of discriminatory people. People will prejudge others based on skin color, weight, looks, and anything else that allows them to quickly slap a label on someone.

And I guess a lot of my issue is the hypocrisy. Free speech seems to only be promoted when someone is speaking about issues that fit certain agendas. The cowboys not getting to where the sticker honoring the murdered cops really irks me.

And I'm writing this on my phone. I'll try to get back on the computer later. My thoughts might not be coming out well organized.

I guess I'm not as pessimistic as you about irradiating bigotry. I'm 51 years old and have witnessed great strides forward in society in my lifetime. But I'm cautious to never be complacent about how I perceive society.

My business requires me to travel on occasion and I relish these opportunities to compare how a change in environment effects the social norms around me. NY and California have completely different vibes and they are both completely foreign to this Texan.

When I was a very young boy my grandparents sat me and my cousins down and explained to us why it is important to always be on our best behavior around the police. They said always be respectful and honest and understand they are doing a job that can quickly get dangerous for them and so they do not respond to things the way civilians do. Above all else, my grandparents told us the police are not bad guys even though they carry guns. They are the ones that keep the bad guys away. That lecture stayed with me and today I'm thinking those things are not being told to the youth of today. I see young black boys afraid of police and wonder, "why that is?". Are they told to be that way or has their experience with police taught them to respond that way? Young boys of course grow up to be men and if they do so while afraid of police then there is no surprise why we have this great divide between police and the black community. I believe it is up to all of us including the police to close that divide and ease fears. If the police are not trusted then how can they do their job effectively. And if the police don't make it their business to be familiar with the communities they are assigned to protect then how can they be trusted?

 

[Denim Chicken]

.

Kaepernick also wore socks depicting cops as pigs, and he publicly supported Fidel Castro (ask Cuban refugees about him). You can protest your cause (although I'd prefer you not do it during our anthem), but Kaepernick was being very disrespectful. Even if you say taking a knee is not, he showed his true colors in other ways.

...and our defense industry has overthrown democratically elected governments causing widespread executions and torture. We've killed countless civilians and destabilized entire regions. We've experimented on African Americas. We've set up interment camps for Japanese Americans. We've used munitions in Iraq that are still causing birth defects. We're dropping white phosphorus on Syria. We're fighting proxy war in the Middle East using countries as chess pieces while civilians suffer. You think we're better than Castro?

 

[roughneck266]

Thanks for your response.

What really needs to happen is crime moves back to harming another's personal property or person. Instead, we have crimes for everything under the sun. Literally everything is a crime one way or another.

I mean, you can get arrested for feeding the homeless: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/man-90-arrested-week-feeding-homeless-article-1.2002790

Check out this list of actual things people have been charged with felonies for:

1) Receiving a shipment in the wrong packaging
2) Getting lost in the woods
3) Taking a fake sick day
4) Tell friends and family not to use services at a company you formerly worked for
5) Creating a website for a religious charity

https://mic.com/articles/86797/8-ways-we-regularly-commit-felonies-without-realizing-it#.9vyj0mFvr

It would fix itself instantly if we went back to actual crimes, and not made up crimes for the purposes of manipulation and extortion.

I have to agree with you here. Seems the laws were made to exclude the common person from being able to even understand them. If it doesn't hurt anyone but the person who did it, then I dont think it's anybodies business.

 

[JoeKing]

I have studied American Foreign policy and can tell you that it does not respect the Military for all to propaganda they put forth.
They treat solders as pawns in a game to secure power and profits. Nothing could be more disrespectful.

The POTUS provaccation of NOrth Korea is a perfect example.


...and our defense industry has overthrown democratically elected governments causing widespread executions and torture. We've killed countless civilians and destabilized entire regions. You think we're better than Castro?

I guess you are not familiar with the story of a young man by the name of Otto Warmbeir and how he was kidnapped by the authorities while visiting North Korea. He was sentenced to serve 15 years hard labor . 17 months later he was returned to his parents in the United States. He had been tortured and was barely alive. His parents described their reunion this way.... His plane landed and a medical staff was allowed to see him first and then his parents and sister were allowed to board. As they entered the plane, Otto's father describes hearing an almost inhuman scream coming from the plane. It scared the sister and she ran off the plane. Otto's parents continued on until they saw the source of the screams. It was Otto but it was hard for them to recognize their own son. His head was shaved and he had been brutally beaten until he suffered severe brain damage. His mother said his teeth appeared to have been rearranged with a pair of pliers. Otto was never cognitive enough to recognized any of his family members and a week later he died of his injuries that he received at the hands of his North Korean captors.

This is but one example of how North Korea threats Americans. There are many others. The President shows great restraint in, as you call it, "provoking" North Korea. That dictatorship deserves no courtesy.

 

[65fastback2plus2]

I have to agree with you here. Seems the laws were made to exclude the common person from being able to even understand them. If it doesn't hurt anyone but the person who did it, then I dont think it's anybodies business.

Bingo. And this is the mindset we need to get back to. Not the shrugging "well they shouldnt have been smoking XYZ"...come on, their property and body, no ones business. Just one of thousands of examples.

 

[Denim Chicken]

I guess you are not familiar with the story of a young man by the name of Otto Warmbeir and how he was kidnapped by the authorities while visiting North Korea. He was sentenced to serve 15 years hard labor . 17 months later he was returned to his parents in the United States. He had been tortured and was barely alive. His parents described their reunion this way.... His plane landed and a medical staff was allowed to see him first and then his parents and sister were allowed to board. As they entered the plane, Otto's father describes hearing an almost inhuman scream coming from the plane. It scared the sister and she ran off the plane. Otto's parents continued on until they saw the source of the screams. It was Otto but it was hard for them to recognize their own son. His head was shaved and he had been brutally beaten until he suffered severe brain damage. His mother said his teeth appeared to have been rearranged with a pair of pliers. Otto was never cognitive enough to recognized any of his family members and a week later he died of his injuries that he received at the hands of his North Korean captors.

This is but one example of how North Korea threats Americans. There are many others. The President shows great restraint in, as you call it, "provoking" North Korea. That dictatorship deserves no courtesy.

Do you realize the implications of armed conflict with NK? It would destabilize Asia, possibly drawing Russian and Chinese intervention. Hundreds of thousands would die.

 

[65fastback2plus2]

I guess you are not familiar with the story of a young man by the name of Otto Warmbeir and how he was kidnapped by the authorities while visiting North Korea. He was sentenced to serve 15 years hard labor . 17 months later he was returned to his parents in the United States. He had been tortured and was barely alive. His parents described their reunion this way.... His plane landed and a medical staff was allowed to see him first and then his parents and sister were allowed to board. As they entered the plane, Otto's father describes hearing an almost inhuman scream coming from the plane. It scared the sister and she ran off the plane. Otto's parents continued on until they saw the source of the screams. It was Otto but it was hard for them to recognize their own son. His head was shaved and he had been brutally beaten until he suffered severe brain damage. His mother said his teeth appeared to have been rearranged with a pair of pliers. Otto was never cognitive enough to recognized any of his family members and a week later he died of his injuries that he received at the hands of his North Korean captors.

This is but one example of how North Korea threats Americans. There are many others. The President shows great restraint in, as you call it, "provoking" North Korea. That dictatorship deserves no courtesy.

Ironically, when a cop does that here, most say "Should have followed the laws and complied"....happens in NK and its an outrage.

People need to learn to be consistent in their stances.

 

[JoeKing]

Do you realize the implications of armed conflict with NK? It would destabilize Asia, possibly drawing Russian and Chinese intervention. Hundreds of thousands would die.

So you would rather just allow that regime to continue to develop their nuclear aspirations until when? Until they kill us all? That's okay with you? But please let's not destabilize Asia.

There are no "good solutions" in this matter. We can not afford to continue to pretend North Korea isn't on a path to nuke all of us. We must end this regime... the sooner the better.

 

[Denim Chicken]

So you would rather just allow that regime to continue to develop their nuclear aspirations until when? Until they kill us all? That's okay with you? But please let's not destabilize Asia.

There are no "good solutions" in this matter. We can not afford to continue to pretend North Korea isn't on a path to nuke all of us. We must end this regime... the sooner the better.

You feel the same about Iran?

 

[JoeKing]

Ironically, when a cop does that here, most say "Should have followed the laws and complied"....happens in NK and its an outrage.

People need to learn to be consistent in their stances.

Making it up again. Police never did this here. Show me an example that went unpunished.

 

[JoeKing]

You feel the same about Iran?

You ask a lot of questions but provide few answers. How about you stop dodging my questions first.

 

[Denim Chicken]

You ask a lot of questions but provide few answers. How about you stop dodging my questions first.

I believe in Military action as a last resort and only in defense. I aslo believe in working soultions through diplomatic channels rather than sabor rattling on Twitter.

 

[jjtrcka22]

.


...and our defense industry has overthrown democratically elected governments causing widespread executions and torture. We've killed countless civilians and destabilized entire regions. We've experimented on African Americas. We've set up interment camps for Japanese Americans. We've used munitions in Iraq that are still causing birth defects. We're dropping white phosphorus on Syria. We're fighting proxy war in the Middle East using countries as chess pieces while civilians suffer. You think we're better than Castro?

I am talking about one person who should at the very least not be admired. I am not referring to an entire country and their history of perceived wrong doings. It sounds like you are talking about multiple different moving parts and how they have adversely affected the world. While i am sure there is some truth to what you are preaching, there are very many sides to what you are talking about.

And yes. Over the years I am sure the U.S. had some wrong doings. And i do like to think that we were at least trying to help those who were being oppressed by true dictators(even though I am sure money had to do with a lot of it) even though we may not have executed perfectly. I guess we could have done nothing.

All I was trying to get at is that Kaep should have left supporting Castro and depicting cops as pigs out of it if he really wanted people to respect his point.

 

[65fastback2plus2]

Making it up again. Police never did this here. Show me an example that went unpunished.

We will start light.

How about running, tackling and slamming an innocent autistic 14 year old to the ground?

https://www.rawstory.com/2017/09/ar...ected-drug-use-but-police-defend-his-actions/