Why we shouldn't devalue what got us there

CATCH17

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1 more thing..

I believe Murray and McFadden were viewed as very similar players headed into last season.

1 played in the most optimal place to play for someone at his position and the other guy was stuck in as bad of a situation as you can have in the NFL.
 

Alexander

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Because they have a damn good OL. It has made Brady look better and many RBs has had success. ..........trenches is how you won ball games, build trenches up and you will see a championship. Both OL and DL

They had a well coached OL. About as well coached as you can get.
 

Alexander

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But also talent. They invested in OL and made it a priory. Samething with DL

They have had a few undrafted FA types to plug in. Yes, they did invest in Solder with a first and Vollmer with a second.

That is nothing like what we have poured into our OL. We almost cheated with three first round choices.
 

Alexander

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The other part people seem to forget, once Romo is gone, we will have a new QB.

What is a rookie or even mediocre QB's friend? Oh yes, that run game.
 

DFWJC

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We'll draft a RB

But the back is not what gave us the run game...though head a great year...it was the dominant Oline combined with a passing game that made possible to,pad the box.

But yes, we need more than we currently have, IMO.
 

gmoney112

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Murray was a really good player. But that was back before he logged all the carries last season. There was no option of having 2014 Demarco Murray back; the Eagles aren't going to get that guy, either.

But the RB is not what got us to 12-4, anyway. The defensive improvement and the improved passing offense were more important, though they're all obviously related. I don't care who we have in the RB position group, I expect we're still going to run the ball about the same percentage of the plays, and I don't think the YPC is going to dip all that significantly. Though I do think we're going to have to keep an eye on the pass protection from that RB position.

But that's the thing. The guy that can come in and contribute could easily be a 2nd or 3rd or 4th round pick. If we draft well, it doesn't have to be a first or even a second rounder. Much more important to add defenders with those early picks where there aren't going to be players of anywhere near comparable quality available in the 3rd or 4th rounds.

Agreed. Murray will never have a season like that again, just because of the vast amount of carries he took. I always thought he was underrated, he just needed enough carries, but letting him leave was the right option.

I do believe the running game helped the defense and passing game quite a bit more than some of the "stat" guys that fail to recognize. Our offensive line and rushing attack directly influenced our passing game immensely, especially play action. It also allowed our very mediocre defense (except for TO's. A tribute to Marinelli's coaching. The guy can teach turnovers. The turnaround is pretty amazing actually.) to get more rest. With how Marinelli wants you to play, the morest you can get the better. Granted, our passing game did improve with the development of Beez and TW, but I think we'd be fooling ourselves if the threat of DeMarco getting 6YPC behind a nasty OL didn't play a significant role in that regard.

I just think relying on a mid round pick, or the guys we currently have, is relying on hope. Can we get a RBC approach and still put up yards? Can we replace Murray with what we have? I don't think anyone knows the answer to that. Murray was a lot tougher than people want to give him credit for, he got some tough yards out there for us when we needed it.

Our OL is built for domination, as is. I think not building to your strengths on offense is a disservice. On defense, where your biggest weakness will get exploited, you take a different approach where you strive to at least be "average" at every position. On offense, you strive to create mismatches wherever you can, and score points. This is by building to your strengths.

Building to your strengths scores points. That's the overall objective when you break down the offense's objective. Just score points. How can you score more points? I think some are failing to see that our running game CAN actually be better than last year. I think everyone saw that if DeMarco had a little more speed and get-up in his saddle, there were some serious game changing opportunities.

I also think, with our OL, as I do believe the strength of our OL is the basis for my logic that a RB that's very talented could lead to an increase in Points Scored over the decrease in Points Allowed(and also, accordingly the change in points scored from relying on less talent at RB) from a 2nd round defensive player, in this years draft.

That's the end result for me. Will the talent allow a larger differential in Points Scored and Points Allowed, over the alternative? What exactly is the opportunity cost?

That being said, I can't say for sure who I'd want and who could play this role for us this season, I haven't really watched "film". But, I keep hearing this draft is incredibly deep and I'm imagining there will be a guy in the 2nd that can fit the bill. If the talent difference isn't that much different from a 2nd rounder and a 3rd rounder, then I guess my whole point is moot.
 

Meat-O-Rama

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While I do agree that we should not have resigned DeMarco to the size of the contract the Eagles did I do not think that his replacement should be overlooked. For us to go into the season with a running back in McFadden who basically slid down to 3rd on the depth chart at one point last season is crazy. I also wouldn't want to count on Randle who has done some idiotic things and who can't be counted on. After those two is nothing more than a 3rd down gimmick tailback in Dunbar and Ryan Williams, a guy who has missed 5 times the games he has been available for.
We all witnessed our great run last year that included a tough road win at Seattle. Anyone who watched the way Murray ran in that game should know that the passion of our team ran through him. The running back position should not be devalued just because we have one of the best lines in the league. It should be our biggest need to find the best back to take advantage of our biggest strength.
This will be the most important draft of the Stephen Jones era, even bigger than the passing on Johnny Football last year. This is the draft that will either propel us further into the playoffs or push us further away from the 12-4 season we had last year. We didn't win and lose games last year based on our corner back position but we did based on our running game.

What round did we draft DeMarco in?
 

jday

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So murray is worth 5 wins a year over his replacement?

To be fair, I can't for certain say Murray alone was worth 5 games last year. But I can say with a high degree of confidence that the running game alone was worth well over 5 games...in fact, the majority if not all of the games the Cowboys won last year was in large part due to the running game.

The question is can you plug in a RB drafted in the latter rounds and expect similar results? Sure you can! It happens all the time. On the other hand, it is a gamble...a very significant gamble considering how dependent the Cowboys entire team is on having that running game. Therein is the issue. The Cowboys entire upcoming season could depend on this one position...believe it or not. That is why, for me I'd rather see the Cowboys reach for this position as opposed to missing all together. If the Cowboys reach for what turns out to be a viable Murray replacement, in hindsight, it will not be considered a reach. In comparison to missing all together I can live with what is perceived by the masses as a reach.
 

percyhoward

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What got us there wasn't just Murray. It was the combination of Murray, a defense that went from league worst to slightly below average, better 3rd-down passing (especially 3rd and long), and an offensive line with 3 Pro Bowlers (including two first-team All-Pro's) that proved we could not be stopped in short yardage and goal line situations.

Here is what Murray did from 2011-2013 in short yardage and goal line (3rd or 4th down and 2 or less to go, or from the 1- or 2-yard line on any down). This is the percentage of runs that resulted in either first downs or touchdowns :
2011-2013: 27 of 41 65.9%

That's basically average. Last year, the Lions' success rate in these situations was 65%, which ranked 15th in the NFL. (The Eagles led the league at 81%)

Now here's what Murray did in those same situations over the first half of 2014:
19 of 21 (first 8 games) 90.5%
32 of 39 (full season) 82.0%

Same back. 82%, for an entire team, would have led the league last year.
 

DTown214

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1 more thing..

I believe Murray and McFadden were viewed as very similar players headed into last season.

1 played in the most optimal place to play for someone at his position and the other guy was stuck in as bad of a situation as you can have in the NFL.

That's a good point. I really hope McFadden works out here but I just wouldn't feel good about putting all our eggs in his basket based on his injury history. We have a pretty limited window of time to win a title (until Romo retires) and I'd hate to piss away a year because we didn't address RB in the draft and McFadden didn't stay healthy. Having McFadden as the starter while rotating the others in might work, but it's definitely risky.
 

SilverStarCowboy

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Easily the RB most like DeMarco in the Draft, T.J. Yeldon with a Trade down looks impressive in the 2nd.
 

AllProRico

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While I understand that McFadden has injury history, I also know that the Raiders have a terrible OL. I believe that McFadden will have a huge resurgence behind this OL especially since he is still fast(even if it isn't his original speed but he's still freaking fast). He's a better blocker than people think and can catch passes well. Run DMC can make people miss in space and doesn't look for contact like Murray did. I think we should definitely draft a RB but we aren't as doomed with DMC as people are making it out to be.
 

Idgit

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Agreed. Murray will never have a season like that again, just because of the vast amount of carries he took. I always thought he was underrated, he just needed enough carries, but letting him leave was the right option.

I do believe the running game helped the defense and passing game quite a bit more than some of the "stat" guys that fail to recognize. Our offensive line and rushing attack directly influenced our passing game immensely, especially play action. It also allowed our very mediocre defense (except for TO's. A tribute to Marinelli's coaching. The guy can teach turnovers. The turnaround is pretty amazing actually.) to get more rest. With how Marinelli wants you to play, the morest you can get the better. Granted, our passing game did improve with the development of Beez and TW, but I think we'd be fooling ourselves if the threat of DeMarco getting 6YPC behind a nasty OL didn't play a significant role in that regard.

I just think relying on a mid round pick, or the guys we currently have, is relying on hope. Can we get a RBC approach and still put up yards? Can we replace Murray with what we have? I don't think anyone knows the answer to that. Murray was a lot tougher than people want to give him credit for, he got some tough yards out there for us when we needed it.

Our OL is built for domination, as is. I think not building to your strengths on offense is a disservice. On defense, where your biggest weakness will get exploited, you take a different approach where you strive to at least be "average" at every position. On offense, you strive to create mismatches wherever you can, and score points. This is by building to your strengths.

Building to your strengths scores points. That's the overall objective when you break down the offense's objective. Just score points. How can you score more points? I think some are failing to see that our running game CAN actually be better than last year. I think everyone saw that if DeMarco had a little more speed and get-up in his saddle, there were some serious game changing opportunities.

I also think, with our OL, as I do believe the strength of our OL is the basis for my logic that a RB that's very talented could lead to an increase in Points Scored over the decrease in Points Allowed(and also, accordingly the change in points scored from relying on less talent at RB) from a 2nd round defensive player, in this years draft.

That's the end result for me. Will the talent allow a larger differential in Points Scored and Points Allowed, over the alternative? What exactly is the opportunity cost?

That being said, I can't say for sure who I'd want and who could play this role for us this season, I haven't really watched "film". But, I keep hearing this draft is incredibly deep and I'm imagining there will be a guy in the 2nd that can fit the bill. If the talent difference isn't that much different from a 2nd rounder and a 3rd rounder, then I guess my whole point is moot.

It's really hard to separate out what contributed how much to the winning increase. More effective passing, better pass defense, the running game, they're all interrelated.

What I tend to think happened is that the effectiveness of our running game wasn't the issue as much as the frequency of the rushing play calling was. I know that rushing effectiveness doesn't really impact wins and losses all that directly, but I think we were much more able to stay away from some bad decisions in the passing game by being willing to run in certain situations, instead. For example, maybe by checking from a run into another run rather than going from a run necessarily into one of two passing options. That made Romo more effective, which also helped put the defense in better situations later in games. I consider that stuff more play calling and design than I do a function of having Demarco Murray there. Though I agree with you that he was largely underrated for a long while here before he was overrated for about half a season.

Either way, I still think we're going to pick up a value RB and we'll stick with what's been working for us. Namely the shift in calling running plays (which was significant) and to improving the pressure and coverage ability of the defense, overall. I just think we'll still be able to do all that with a mid-round RB.
 

RonSpringsdaman20

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We are not the Patriots..... We are the cowboys, we run, get big plays in the passing game & play d to win our superbowls.....
worked five times.... bout to make it 6
 

Zekeats

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What got us there wasn't just Murray. It was the combination of Murray, a defense that went from league worst to slightly below average, better 3rd-down passing (especially 3rd and long), and an offensive line with 3 Pro Bowlers (including two first-team All-Pro's) that proved we could not be stopped in short yardage and goal line situations.

Here is what Murray did from 2011-2013 in short yardage and goal line (3rd or 4th down and 2 or less to go, or from the 1- or 2-yard line on any down). This is the percentage of runs that resulted in either first downs or touchdowns :
2011-2013: 27 of 41 65.9%

That's basically average. Last year, the Lions' success rate in these situations was 65%, which ranked 15th in the NFL. (The Eagles led the league at 81%)

Now here's what Murray did in those same situations over the first half of 2014:
19 of 21 (first 8 games) 90.5%
32 of 39 (full season) 82.0%

Same back. 82%, for an entire team, would have led the league last year.

stems from the running game
 
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