Why You Can Stop Worrying About the Japan Nuclear Reactors

[BrAinPaiNt]

not a big sailor but i'm fairly sure that thats one of the most important parts of steering your boat

Oh they move them away from those items to keep from crashing or getting stuck...not due to "normal background radiation levels"

 

[burmafrd]

Really burm. What exactly do you know about it? Are you saying the plant can't meltdown? That radiation can't be released? btw, I haven't been watching this on TV. To me *THIS* story isn't what I'm talking about, it's just an instance of what *could* happen.

I'm well aware of what radiation is and what it does. I don't need a mediot to tell me. I am pro nuclear energy, but I'm also extremely aware that it is infinity more dangerous than a coal or natural gas plant.

Some people have an extreme view of some subjects and some have a lackadaisical view. I consider myself very middle ground. I am for it as long as you can make it safe. I'm well aware that the people who build these with ever effort to make them safe. All I said is if you are going to build a nuclear power plant in an extremely volatile area, then it should be able to withstand extreme conditions. Japan is an extremely volatile area. They have lots of earthquakes, tsunamis, volcanoes, typhoons, floods and giant mudslides all compacted into a relatively small land mass.

The Japaneses plant is sitting on an extremely active fault line, unlike the Comanche Peak plant in Glen Rose.

Well I grew up about 35 miles from a Nuclear Power plant. was curious about it from the first time I heard about it. So for about 40 years now I have been interested in Nuclear Power. There is no relation to chernobyll in really any way except both are nuclear power plants. What happened at that place was a text book example of what not to do all the way from initial design to the last day. I have talked to some people who were in the industry, rad techs and other tech experts, over the years. So frankly I think I know a whole lot more about it then you do.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

I studied the Chernobyl disaster when I was in school. I know step by step what and how it happen there.

Well you think you know what happened.

But as it turns out, the truth was finally revealed thanks to the show "the Event".

It turns out that one of the aliens named Thomas tried to basically teleport some items out of the Chernobyl plant and that is really what caused the meltdown. They were trying to get the items to build a receiving station to bring all of his fellow aliens to Earth.

Now that you know the truth and I bet you feel foolish saying that you knew it all.

 

[YosemiteSam]

Well I grew up about 35 miles from a Nuclear Power plant. was curious about it from the first time I heard about it. So for about 40 years now I have been interested in Nuclear Power. There is no relation to chernobyll in really any way except both are nuclear power plants. What happened at that place was a text book example of what not to do all the way from initial design to the last day. I have talked to some people who were in the industry, rad techs and other tech experts, over the years. So frankly I think I know a whole lot more about it then you do.

That is an assumption. You know what they say about assumptions right?

 

[StanleySpadowski]

I lived in the shadow of TMI when it happened. What should have been seen as a positive....worst case scenario happened and no one was injured...turned into the deathknell of Nuclear Power in the United States thanks to media sensationalism and the media hasn't gotten any better since with the 24 news cycle.

People are naturally afraid of radiation because it's an unseen killer but the safety of nuclear power is unprecedented. Every year 1000s of people are killed across the globe in providing other forms of power while less than 100 have been killed since the advent of the nuclear age.

 

[YosemiteSam]

I lived in the shadow of TMI when it happened. What should have been seen as a positive....worst case scenario happened and no one was injured...turned into the deathknell of Nuclear Power in the United States thanks to media sensationalism and the media hasn't gotten any better since with the 24 news cycle.

People are naturally afraid of radiation because it's an unseen killer but the safety of nuclear power is unprecedented. Every year 1000s of people are killed across the globe in providing other forms of power while less than 100 have been killed since the advent of the nuclear age.

I agree. My wife is deathly afraid of almost everything and the media doesn't help the problem. Nuclear energy's benefits IMO outweigh any of the risks as long as you pay strict attention to those risks. The problem at TMI and Chernobyl were both preventable, yet they still happen. People made stupid mistakes in both cases that caused the problem. The fact that they happen IMO is unacceptable. Mistakes happen, but *stupid* mistakes are unacceptable in extremely dangerous places.

 

[StanleySpadowski]

I agree. My wife is deathly afraid of almost everything and the media doesn't help the problem. Nuclear energy's benefits IMO outweigh any of the risks as long as you pay strict attention to those risks. The problem at TMI and Chernobyl were both preventable, yet they still happen. People made stupid mistakes in both cases that caused the problem. The fact that they happen IMO is unacceptable. Mistakes happen, but *stupid* mistakes are unacceptable in extremely dangerous places.

Stupid mistakes happen in every walk of life, the only difference is that nuclear facilities have safeguards and protocols in place that prevent the loss of life when they happen.

No one is going to lose their life in Japan due to radiation despite a massive earthquake and tsunami. Absolute worst case scenario and it's still relatively safe. Yet that's all the media wants to talk about. People are being butchered in Libya but that's yesterday's news...it makes me sick.

 

[YosemiteSam]

Stupid mistakes happen in every walk of life, the only difference is that nuclear facilities have safeguards and protocols in place that prevent the loss of life when they happen.

No one is going to lose their life in Japan due to radiation despite a massive earthquake and tsunami. Absolute worst case scenario and it's still relatively safe. Yet that's all the media wants to talk about. People are being butchered in Libya but that's yesterday's news...it makes me sick.

Mistakes happen, but safeguards and protocols are created to prevent *stupid mistakes*. At both TMI and Chernobyl people didn't follow protocol and made *stupid mistakes*. That is the sole point I was making. If you are making a hamburger at McDonalds and make a stupid mistake, it means nothing. At a nuclear power plant, its meaning carries a lot more weight. Again, mistakes happen and I accept that, but stupid mistakes in critical locations are not acceptable. Stupid mistakes happen because people become complacent. I don't think a nuclear facility is a place to become complacent.

 

[StanleySpadowski]

Mistakes happen, but safeguards and protocols are created to prevent *stupid mistakes*. At both TMI and Chernobyl people didn't follow protocol and made *stupid mistakes*. That is the sole point I was making. If you are making a hamburger at McDonalds and make a stupid mistake, it means nothing. At a nuclear power plant, its meaning carries a lot more weight. Again, mistakes happen and I accept that, but stupid mistakes in critical locations are not acceptable. Stupid mistakes happen because people become complacent. I don't think a nuclear facility is a place to become complacent.

Stupid mistakes at McDonalds kill far more people than nuclear power. Salmonella or even influenza from an employee not washing their hands are a much bigger threat to you.

 

[YosemiteSam]

Stupid mistakes at McDonalds kill far more people than nuclear power. Salmonella or even influenza from an employee not washing their hands are a much bigger threat to you.

I understand and agree with your argument. I know more people die that way. Just like cars kill more people than airplanes, but an airplane crash (and nuclear disaster) are far more destructive on an event by event basis. You can't compare an outbreak of Salmonella at a local McDonalds to a plane crash or a nuclear power plant disaster.

 

[TwoCentPlain]

Rebuild them right where they are. Being able to flush the reactors with saltwater (Go Team!) is one of the reasons things are under control

Flushing a reactor with seawater is an act of last resort from what I have heard. Does that sound like things are "under control?"

They were considering dropping water from helicopters on the reactor today before giving up on that idea. Does that sound like things are "under control?"

Fuel rod fires and hydrogen explosions near the reactor. Does that sound like things are "under control?"

The evacuation area keeps expanding, water near the reactor is testing positive for radioactive contamination, military aircraft are returning because their sensors detected radioactive material, American soldiers needed to be washed down, and people near the site are told to tape their windows. Does that sound like things are "under control?"

To this electrical engineer, things don't seem to be "under control." More like, screwed up beyond repair, get as far away as possible ASAP. I guess it all depends on how you define "control."

 

[YosemiteSam]

Flushing a reactor with seawater is an act of last resort from what I have heard. Does that sound like things are "under control?"

They were considering dropping water from helicopters on the reactor today before giving up on that idea. Does that sound like things are "under control?"

Fuel rod fires and hydrogen explosions near the reactor. Does that sound like things are "under control?"

The evacuation area keeps expanding, water near the reactor is testing positive for radioactive contamination, military aircraft are returning because their sensors detected radioactive material, American soldiers needed to be washed down, and people near the site are told to tape their windows. Does that sound like things are "under control?"

To this electrical engineer, things don't seem to be "under control." More like, screwed up beyond repair, get as far away as possible ASAP. I guess it all depends on how you define "control."

I believe the second they flush it with saltwater, the reactor is officially offline for good. It ruins it. (thats what I read anyhow)

 

[burmafrd]

That is an assumption. You know what they say about assumptions right?

Well you certainly are trying to sound like an internet expert.

 

[SaltwaterServr]

Flushing a reactor with seawater is an act of last resort from what I have heard. Does that sound like things are "under control?"

They were considering dropping water from helicopters on the reactor today before giving up on that idea. Does that sound like things are "under control?"

Fuel rod fires and hydrogen explosions near the reactor. Does that sound like things are "under control?"

The evacuation area keeps expanding, water near the reactor is testing positive for radioactive contamination, military aircraft are returning because their sensors detected radioactive material, American soldiers needed to be washed down, and people near the site are told to tape their windows. Does that sound like things are "under control?"

To this electrical engineer, things don't seem to be "under control." More like, screwed up beyond repair, get as far away as possible ASAP. I guess it all depends on how you define "control."

You have any idea how sensitive the sensors are on the aircraft? How much precaution is taken to use soap and water to wash off POTENIALLY radioactive particles?

Are things pretty damn serious? Yes, out of control? According to you, yes. According to the head of the IAEA? No.

Who has more credibility on the issue? Lemme think.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/03/16/us-japan-quake-idUSTRE72A0SS20110316

The head of the world's nuclear watchdog, meanwhile, said it was not accurate to say things were "out of control" in Japan, but the situation was "very serious", with core damage to three units at the plant, around 240 kms (150 miles) north of Tokyo.

 

[Baileyneverfailey]

Don't worry guys. They're just dropping water on to the reactors from helicopters for fun. There's no danger to worry about.

 

[YosemiteSam]

Well you certainly are trying to sound like an internet expert.

Oh I'm no expert, but it is a subject of interest to me. You are the one declaring you're an expert because you *know* somebody.

 

[SaltwaterServr]

Oh I'm no expert, but it is a subject of interest to me. You are the one declaring you're an expert because you *know* somebody.

If you did do a bit of research on it you knew, or perhaps have forgotten, that Chernobyl didn't even have a secondary containment system in place.

The hydrogen explosion that blew the tops off of the Daiichi reactor buildings was the same reaction generated hydrogen explosion that blew Chernobyl's roof off and exposed the Chernobyl reactor core to the atmosphere.

Under Chernobyl's reactor chamber? The hardware and pipes that pumped water into the reaction chamber to cool it. The design was like putting a gun's trigger mechanism in front of the muzzle. Once it got hot enough to generate hydrogen in quantity, it was completely screwed.

 

[burmafrd]

Oh I'm no expert, but it is a subject of interest to me. You are the one declaring you're an expert because you *know* somebody.

I do not claim to be an expert like you have. I lived near one and learned about it and kept an interest all my life. I am just more informed on the subject then you are.

 

[YosemiteSam]

If you did do a bit of research on it you knew, or perhaps have forgotten, that Chernobyl didn't even have a secondary containment system in place.

The hydrogen explosion that blew the tops off of the Daiichi reactor buildings was the same reaction generated hydrogen explosion that blew Chernobyl's roof off and exposed the Chernobyl reactor core to the atmosphere.

Under Chernobyl's reactor chamber? The hardware and pipes that pumped water into the reaction chamber to cool it. The design was like putting a gun's trigger mechanism in front of the muzzle. Once it got hot enough to generate hydrogen in quantity, it was completely screwed.

Chernobyl was a complete mess from top to bottom. It was a train-wreck from a design and operational stand point. Obviously design lessons were learned after Chernobyl was built, (before the accident) but the fact that they knew of it's flaws yet still were extremely lackadaisical with safety procedures and in many cases, staff education about those flaws was a gross misconduct.

 

[YosemiteSam]

I do not claim to be an expert like you have. I lived near one and learned about it and kept an interest all my life. I am just more informed on the subject then you are.

Where did I claim to be an expert? I didn't.

Again, you assume. (true or not) You have no clue what my knowledge level is on the subject. I said, if they are going to build a reactor on a an active fault line, it should be capable of withstanding a 9.0 earthquake. (since they DO occur) At that point, you told me I didn't know what I was talking about and never looked back since.

I never claimed to be an expert and the initial comment you started claiming I didn't know what I was talking about was an opinion which means you applied your great (or lack thereof) knowledge in declaring me ignorant on the subject. It seems the only thing I can determine about your actual knowledge is minimal, but you support it with opinion and assumptions. I haven't seen a single post of yours that supports your claims with substantiated fact.

Thus far, I have only seen one person posting here that has proven he has more that a passing knowledge of any of it and that Salt. Most people posting as if they do have some great knowledge, only seem to be presenting opinion supported by hearsay.

So, with that said. My discussion of who knows what with *you* about this subject is over.