"Win-or-go-home" from a team point of view

[jobberone]

One game then that's an easy answer. You conjure up Otto Graham in his prime and play him. There's a few in the next tier some of which didn't even do that well in CC games.

There's so many I'd have to think long and hard about really answering that if it mattered in the real world. And you can't pick the QB without picking the team including O, D, STs, coaches and organization top to bottom.

 

[Doomsday101]

In addition it completely ignores that Miami's defense outplayed Chicago's that day, in order to fit the agenda of it being all about the QBs. McMahon only threw 6 passes, but he and Fuller combined for 3 picks and 6 sacks while Chicago could only manufacture 3 sacks and 1 pick.

It's really perfect for illustrating the pass offense is just as important as pass defense point. Talk about your all time backfires...

Frankly team play makes the overall differance. Jimmy once said you have 3 phase offense, defense and special teams. If you can win 2 of those you give yourself a very good chance at winning. We sit here debating somewhat the importance of a position. I think most will say a QB is very important he can give you a chance to win no doubt but the overall team must perform if they fail, if the line does not block or the Recievers are not making the catches if the defense is not stopping the opposing team then odds are you will lose no matter who is the QB. Montana is a HOF QB one of the best of all time yet vs 85 Bears his line could not protect him and the Bears ate him up, Joe was no less of a QB but without others around him doing the job all of his greatness means nothing.

 

[KJJ]

and yet the 85 Bears destroyed Montana. You are picking 1 game on the season where the Bears went 15-1 they faced other great QB and destroyed them. Talk about spinning. lol

You call what I posted spinning? LOL I gave an example of what a great performance by a great QB can do to even the greatest defense the league has ever seen. Marino beat the Bears defense with his quick release and timing to his receivers. He missed a number of throws in that game having to get the ball off quick but hit them on some big plays they were unable to defend. He would take a short drop and fire the ball and a lot of them missed but when he was on target 3 of them found the end zone and the Bears had no answers.

He kept the Bears defense off balance the entire game. Had that been another QB the Bears would have never lost a game that season. The Bears were able to get to Montana before he had a chance to even set up. To beat the Bears defense that season it took a QB with a quick release. Marino's quick release threw the Bears off he was at the top of his game that night.

 

[Doomsday101]

You call what I posted spinning? LOL I gave an example of what a great performance by a great QB can do to even the greatest defense the league has ever seen. Marino beat the Bears defense with his quick release and timing to his receivers. He missed a number of throws in that game having to get the ball off quick but hit them on some big plays they were unable to defend. He would take a short drop and fire the ball and a lot of them missed but when he was on target 3 of them found the end zone and the Bears had no answers.

He kept the Bears defense off balance the entire game. Had that been another QB the Bears would have never lost a game that season. The Bears were able to get to Montana before he had a chance to even set up. To beat that Bears defense that season it took a QB with a quick release. Marino's quick release threw the Bears off he was at the top of his game that night.

You took 1 game out of 16 a season in which the Bears had already clinched and went 15-1 playing on the road vs a good team who was still fighting for a playoff spot. No doubt Marino is a great QB but Chicago faced other great QB and when it counted the most they killed those QB's. Yes it is spinning taking 1 game out of a season but then the guy who loves to accuse others of spinning does not. Give it a rest.

By the Way how many SB rings does Marino have? Yeah that is right NONE

I guess since it is the QB or HC it must have been Don Shula or Jimmy Johnsons fault

 

[5Stars]

You took 1 game out of 16 a season in which the Bears had already clinched and went 15-1 playing on the road vs a good team who was still fighting for a playoff spot. No doubt Marino is a great QB but Chicago faced other great QB and when it counted the most they killed those QB's. Yes it is spinning taking 1 game out of a season but then the guy who loves to accuse others of spinning does not. Give it a rest.

By the Way how many SB rings does Marino have? Yeah that is right NONE

I guess since it is the QB or HC it must have been Don Shula or Jimmy Johnsons fault

Give it a rest? Are you kidding! lmao

Until this thread is closed KJJ is never going to let you have the last word.

I have brought up Marino in this thread somewhere that he was great but did not have a SB. Did it matter? No.

 

[Doomsday101]

Give it a rest? Are you kidding! lmao

Until this thread is closed KJJ is never going to let you have the last word.

I have brought up Marino in this thread somewhere that he was great but did not have a SB. Did it matter? No.

Fact is on one hand he will tell me when talking about Aikman how the game has changed and you somehow can't use that data then turns around and is talking Marino in 85? Whatever.

 

[KJJ]

I think that is not the best way to use that stat. If you have a negative turnover diff of -2 then you are only going to win about 20% of those games at home and a little less away. So you can say any team regardless of QB is going to lose most of those games. You could go thru each game and look at turnovers but you'd really have to watch them or the film to even get a guess as to whether the QB is responsible for them.

I'm talking about the TD to turnover ratio in win or go home games. Usually when QB's start turning the ball over in these games it leads to them struggling. It's in win or go home games that a QB's TD to turnover ratio can really impact the outcome of a game especially on the road. Turnovers by a QB in playoff games can drastically change the momentum of a game and cause a QB to lose their poise and confidence.

Multiple turnovers by a QB in elimination games "almost" always leads to a QB struggling and a loss. Eli had 3 turnovers vs the Panthers in the playoffs in 05 and finished the game with a passer rating of 35.3. In Flacco's back to back AFC title game losses in 08 and 09 his 5 turnovers resulted in passer ratings of 18.2 and 48.4. Once it starts going bad for a QB in the playoffs they can't seem to right the ship.

 

[dboyz]

You call what I posted spinning? LOL I gave an example of what a great performance by a great QB can do to even the greatest defense the league has ever seen. Marino beat the Bears defense with his quick release and timing to his receivers. He missed a number of throws in that game having to get the ball off quick but hit them on some big plays they were unable to defend. He would take a short drop and fire the ball and a lot of them missed but when he was on target 3 of them found the end zone and the Bears had no answers.

He kept the Bears defense off balance the entire game. Had that been another QB the Bears would have never lost a game that season. The Bears were able to get to Montana before he had a chance to even set up. To beat the Bears defense that season it took a QB with a quick release. Marino's quick release threw the Bears off he was at the top of his game that night.

Yeah but what was Marino like in WOGH games?

 

[5Stars]

Yeah but what was Marino like in WOGH games?

This will not compute...please restart your computer.

 

[KJJ]

Yeah but what was Marino like in WOGH games?

Marino was a first ballot Hall of Famer and finished his career as the all-time leading passer and held several NFL passing records. That tells me he was great in a lot of games.

 

[Doomsday101]

Marino was a first ballot Hall of Famer and finished his career as the all-time leading passer and held several NFL passing records. That tells me he was great in a lot of games.

Yeap and not a single SB. If not mistaken Don Shula is in the HOF as well

 

[justbob]

Give it a rest? Are you kidding! lmao

Until this thread is closed KJJ is never going to let you have the last word.

I have brought up Marino in this thread somewhere that he was great but did not have a SB. Did it matter? No.

Only one who gets the last word is me.

 

[5Stars]

Marino was a first ballot Hall of Famer and finished his career as the all-time leading passer and held several NFL passing records. That tells me he was great in a lot of games.

Romo as of right now is not a HOF'er but he also has had a lot of great games. So your point is?

 

[Doomsday101]

Romo as of right now is not a HOF'er but he also has had a lot of great games. So your point is?

Based on some guys who made it in the HOF and guys who are not in the HOF based on sports writers who knows which player will make it? lol

 

[5Stars]

Based on some guys who made it in the HOF and guys who are not in the HOF based on sports writers who knows which player will make it? lol

Well, Romo better step it up if he even has a chance because as of right now, he has no chance.

But, then again, Marino got in so who knows? lol

 

[dboyz]

This will not compute...please restart your computer.

I thought KJJ might find some irony in that.

 

[percyhoward]

One game then that's an easy answer. You conjure up Otto Graham in his prime and play him. There's a few in the next tier some of which didn't even do that well in CC games.

There's so many I'd have to think long and hard about really answering that if it mattered in the real world. And you can't pick the QB without picking the team including O, D, STs, coaches and organization top to bottom.

The reason I responded was that you mentioned Graham. I had intended to put him in with Starr, Montana, and Warner.

And wouldn't you know it, the Browns had the best pass defenses of the 50s, the Packers had the best pass defenses of the 60s, the 49ers had the best pass defenses of the 80s, and even the Rams held opposing QB to season ratings of 64.1 and 69.9 in their Super Bowl years.

It just keeps coming back to "team," which in a team sport shouldn't be a surprise, I guess.

 

[Doomsday101]

Well, Romo better step it up if he even has a chance because as of right now, he has no chance.

But, then again, Marino got in so who knows? lol

I hope one day he can but my concerns have always been more about the team than the individual accolades.

 

[5Stars]

I hope one day he can but my concerns have always been more about the team than the individual accolades.

Well, when you consider that football is not a one man sport then you have to be concerned about the team.

It would be cool if someone could post Romo's numbers for the time he's been the starting QB in years vs. the numbers that Marino had in the same period of time. Now, I hope someone does not spin this into Romo is as great as Marino!

 

[dstovall5]

Well, when you consider that football is not a one man sport then you have to be concerned about the team.

It would be cool if someone could post Romo's numbers for the time he's been the starting QB in years vs. the numbers that Marino had in the same period of time. Now, I hope someone does not spin this into Romo is as great as Marino!

He just said Romo is just as good as Marino!