Would anyone give us a 1st for Zeke?

[Pants]

when we stop running the same scripted 15 to 20 plays top start the game (see: Garrett influence), then I will judge Zeke - he runs off guard and NEVER is the scheme to run him outside - especially in the first quarter - opposing defenses are ready for that EVERY time....people wonder why Pollard gets snaps in the 3rd or 4th series, IMO, because Moore can finally call the plays and sees the difference having two good backs can make....Zeke hasn't been perfect, but he is very good and still top 5....get rid of this scripted nonsense and just let Moore take the offense

 

[AmericanCowboy]

No way. He has been average at best.

 

[AmericanCowboy]

Yes we saw what Zeke can do when he gets some space, on the td catch, after he got the ball he blew down the field for the score. But for some reason Moore/Garrett insist on running Zeke right up the middle into a pile of defenders. People here complain he's not breaking tackles, but he is, the problem is he'd have to break 2 or 3 of them just to get past the line, and he's not having to break tackles by some safety or cornerback, he's having to take on 300 lb linemen.

The idea that Zeke is "done" or "a shell of his former self" at age 24 is laughable, if that is the case, why? Too many carries? For a 220+ pound back after 1,062 carries?
No.

Fat? Again he was 221 lbs coming into the league, if he's put on 20 or 30 pounds he'd be jiggling and flapping on runs, and besides, he has plenty of muscle, he could add 10 lbs and it wouldn't affect his speed or moves.

It's easy to select one player who's not doing as well as people think he should and say it's all his fault, whether it's the quarterback, running back, safety or whatever...

legit think every RB in the NFL would have scored on that screen pass

 

[LACowboysFan1]

legit think every RB in the NFL would have scored on that screen pass

Maybe, but people are saying he's now a slow back, the question remains, what would cause that, at 24 years old?

Just no reason, things don't happen in a vacuum, there has to be some causation....

 

[jaythecowboy]

legit think every RB in the NFL would have scored on that screen pass

The catch was the most difficult part.

 

[fifaguy]

Quite possibly. But he’s going nowhere. Can’t wait to see him sign a HUGE contract. He’s earned it.

Zeke, on the other hand, appears to be on the decline.

So much this.
Who would've thought that this would have been the case?

 

[aria]

Zeke isn't a top 5 RB in this league?

Wow! Just hilarious.

Stats say otherwise, but stats only matter when using them to defend his total yards over the past few years, right?

 

[Bullflop]

It's difficult at best to say how well Zeke might be doing if the health of the OL was anything approaching 100%. Seeing as how that's not the case, what we might say would be poorly influenced by arriving at a conclusion without the OL enjoying an injury free situation. It's for sure that Zeke's performance would be closer to ideal if the o-line's health were much closer to being ideal, as well.

Unfortunately, Zeke's performance is and has been greatly affected for the worse by the injuries that have plagued the OL for far too long already. Here's hoping that scenario improves somewhat in the weeks ahead. With back trouble, shoulder woes, knee and ankle pain being a significant part of it, nothing is guaranteed, though. Oddly enough, the OL's pass blocking doesn't seem affected, so that offers, at least, a fair degree of optimism.

 

[aria]

So to clear it up, if the O line dominates than Zeke succeeds. The same could be said about almost every back in the NFL and they don’t cost 90 million dollars and aren’t entitled punk diva bullies. CJ Anderson did just fine replacing Gurley when he had room to run. Ajayi did well in 2017 when he had room to run. Pollard is arguably better than Zeke when he has room to run. Scarbrough came off the practice squad and averaged 1 more ypc than Zeke and he wasn’t going against the 3rd worst defense.

Hmmm...so what did we pay Zeke for? There’s not one game we would have lost this year if it weren’t for him.

 

[gjkoeppen]

I think by now, its obvious to everyone that Zeke is no longer a top tier RB.

-Does anyone still think the 90 million dollar contract was worth it?
-Does anyone think that we could trade Zeke if we wanted to, if so, what could we get?
-Are there any people, besides me out there that thinks that Pollard has what it takes to be better than Zeke at this point?

I'm not saying he is or will be another Alfred Morris. Morris as a rookie was one of the top 2 or 3 for offensive rookie of the year awards. As a rookie he rushed for 1613 yards just 18 yards less than Elliott had as a rookie. Morris went on to have a couple more years of 1000+ yards and then his production started falling off and he lost his starting job. Now he's on his 4th team in a 4 year period.

There aren't many backs that can be very productive for a lot of years like Emmitt did and now Peterson. The average RB career is only 2.57 years the shortest of all positions in the NFL. For this reason I said from the getgo to not extend Elliott and let him sit out. At worse he would have come back after the Vikings game on the last year of his rookie contract if he wanted this year to count and probably wouldn't get many snaps until this week against the patriots. Then the Cowboys wouldn't have that huge contract hanging over their heads with his subpar production this season.

.

 

[LACowboysFan1]

Oddly enough, the OL's pass blocking hasn't been greatly affected, so that offers at least some degree of optimism.

Pass blocking depends greatly on movement by the o-line, just getting in the way of the defenders is often enough to give Dak the normal amount of time needed to go through his progressions and read the defense. But run blocking requires pushing on the defenders, coordination with the other members on the line, etc. Pushing requires a lot of strength, something apparently Williams is lacking (still), Martin has back issues, that is probably hurting him. Frederick is not his old self, close which is still better than most centers in the NFL, but his main value is in making line calls which of course has nothing to do with his body.

But IF the line can get back to their old selves, Zeke has the ability to use that and be one of, if not the, top back in the league. Sure others could probably do what Zeke is doing now, but that's their ceiling. Zeke can elevate the running game to a higher level. That's what he's paid for at this point, not so much has game performance.

But note that he's still 8th in the league in yards, 6th in touchdowns, and among the leaders in first down runs. Not too shabby. It's not like he's a poor running back, we've seen what happens when Pollard is run up the middle, seldom gets even a couple of yards, Zeke nearly always gets at least a couple.

As with Dak, Zeke isn't the reason this team is "only" 6-4, it's more than a couple of things, other than coaching, which I think we all agree is mediocre most games.

Look at the Chargers - last year they were 12-4, this year at best they can be 9-7. Last year they got the breaks and made the plays needed to win 12 games, this year not, though they still have Rivers, Gordon, Henry, Bosa, etc. It's a fine line between 6-4 and 8-2, after the season is over we can evaluate this team....

 

[Bullflop]

Pass blocking depends greatly on movement by the o-line, just getting in the way of the defenders is often enough to give Dak the normal amount of time needed to go through his progressions and read the defense. But run blocking requires pushing on the defenders, coordination with the other members on the line, etc. Pushing requires a lot of strength, something apparently Williams is lacking (still), Martin has back issues, that is probably hurting him. Frederick is not his old self, close which is still better than most centers in the NFL, but his main value is in making line calls which of course has nothing to do with his body.

But IF the line can get back to their old selves, Zeke has the ability to use that and be one of, if not the, top back in the league. Sure others could probably do what Zeke is doing now, but that's their ceiling. Zeke can elevate the running game to a higher level. That's what he's paid for at this point, not so much has game performance.

But note that he's still 8th in the league in yards, 6th in touchdowns, and among the leaders in first down runs. Not too shabby. It's not like he's a poor running back, we've seen what happens when Pollard is run up the middle, seldom gets even a couple of yards, Zeke nearly always gets at least a couple.

As with Dak, Zeke isn't the reason this team is "only" 6-4, it's more than a couple of things, other than coaching, which I think we all agree is mediocre most games.

Look at the Chargers - last year they were 12-4, this year at best they can be 9-7. Last year they got the breaks and made the plays needed to win 12 games, this year not, though they still have Rivers, Gordon, Henry, Bosa, etc. It's a fine line between 6-4 and 8-2, after the season is over we can evaluate this team....

Fortunately, Connor Williams is out with injury, so Xavier Su'a-Filo is on tap to replace him! He's a better run blocker than Williams.

 

[Redsfan_83]

You guys do know that just by having him in the back field helps our passing game, right? Wanna bet? Take him out and see how Dak does...

 

[LACowboysFan1]

You guys do know that just by having him in the back field helps our passing game, right? Wanna bet? Take him out and see how Dak does...

He's worth half of what he gets just by being able to pick up blitzes, that's not a common ability among NFL backs...

 

[AKATheRake]

Stats say otherwise, but stats only matter when using them to defend his total yards over the past few years, right?

Name 5 better backs in the last 4 years,

I understand McCaffrey is having a freak year, MVP type of year and Cook is having a very good year also. But a back can't win the rushing title every year. Believe me, teams are loading up that box and they know our gaps. Dak will continue to air it out but teams also want to hurt our time of posession because they know our running game gives us that and keeps our defense fresh.

That's another reason why our defense doesn't look the same as last year but is 7th in total yards and 8th in points against. Does not look it though, but those are the statistical facts.

Believe me, Zeke is a top 3 back. Still the best overall. McCaffrey and Cook don't get asked to stay in and block. Caralina has no choice but to go through McCaffrey with their QB situation and lack of aerial talent. Minnesota is a different situation but Dalvin Cook is not better than Zeke and no other back is a better all around RB.

Dalvin Cooks career: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/C/CookDa01.htm

Christian McCaffrey's career: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/McCaCh01.htm

Ezekiel Elliott's career: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/E/ElliEz00.htm


I'm going to mention that Zeke probably would have won the rushing title his 2nd season for not the suspension. Furthermore, Elliott has never missed a game to injury yet the other 2 have missed many. Zeke has also hit all that yardage not playing the last game of the season all season's while in the NFL. This season it is probably going to go down to the wire in this division right up to week 16 and by the end of the year I would be surprised if Elliott is not top 3 in rushing. Even in a down year for him.

Cook has also played 1 more game than Zeke this season. Watch how everything unfolds by season end. Zeke is much more durable and gets more productive as the season goes on.

I don't think I would trade Zeke for McCaffrey straight up. Zeke has had 2 season's already close to the season McCaffrey is having. McCaffrey will be getting a similar pay day to Zeke's and lets see how his durability holds up. Last year it was Gurley. The season before it was LeVeon Bell. The season before, David Johnson. But Zeke is always there since he came into the league. Moves the ball more.

Even with a down year Zeke is on pace to rush for 1333 yards. That's with him having 2 down games in a row. He's going to have more productive games and is still averaging 4.3 yards per carry.

So there's the stats, the numbers.

Zeke, the last 4 season's is the most productive RB in the entire NFL. Has not missed any games due to injury. Everyone else has. He's also the most durable.

If anyone thinks no other team would give up a 1st for Zeke and/or he is not a top 5 RB in this league, they're totally misled.

 

[Redsfan_83]

He's worth half of what he gets just by being able to pick up blitzes, that's not a common ability among NFL backs...

This and if they use him like they did on his TD, it would keep himi in the game more. Blame the coaches for not using him properly when he is getting stuffed at the line. Every other team can make use of their talents except ours.....haven't we had this dance for 20 years with this team?

Oh dare I say they are now starting to put him in the back field with Pollard...I'd like to think they are figuring out ways to get him some touches, will see

 

[gjkoeppen]

Pass blocking depends greatly on movement by the o-line, just getting in the way of the defenders is often enough to give Dak the normal amount of time needed to go through his progressions and read the defense. But run blocking requires pushing on the defenders, coordination with the other members on the line, etc. Pushing requires a lot of strength, something apparently Williams is lacking (still), Martin has back issues, that is probably hurting him. Frederick is not his old self, close which is still better than most centers in the NFL, but his main value is in making line calls which of course has nothing to do with his body.

But IF the line can get back to their old selves, Zeke has the ability to use that and be one of, if not the, top back in the league. Sure others could probably do what Zeke is doing now, but that's their ceiling. Zeke can elevate the running game to a higher level. That's what he's paid for at this point, not so much has game performance.

But note that he's still 8th in the league in yards, 6th in touchdowns, and among the leaders in first down runs. Not too shabby. It's not like he's a poor running back, we've seen what happens when Pollard is run up the middle, seldom gets even a couple of yards, Zeke nearly always gets at least a couple.

As with Dak, Zeke isn't the reason this team is "only" 6-4, it's more than a couple of things, other than coaching, which I think we all agree is mediocre most games.

Look at the Chargers - last year they were 12-4, this year at best they can be 9-7. Last year they got the breaks and made the plays needed to win 12 games, this year not, though they still have Rivers, Gordon, Henry, Bosa, etc. It's a fine line between 6-4 and 8-2, after the season is over we can evaluate this team....

Some of what you said is true but a lot of it isn't. What you said about the the health of the line is true. One thing makes no sense. You said " Zeke can elevate the running game to a higher level. That's what he's paid for at this point, not so much has game performance." If Elliott is doing what he being paid for by elevating the running game but his game performance or production is way down, just how do those 2 statements jive? He got that huge contract to be a league leading rusher, PRODUCTION, PERFORMANCE.

Here's what you didn't say. This season Elliott has more rushes for a loss or no gain than in his previous 3 seasons and needs just a couple more to have more than his first 2 seasons combined. You're all you rah rah about Elliott being in 8th place in rushing, 200 yards behind the leader and based on how he's been running lately that's about a 4 game difference. This for the guy who lead the league 2 out of the last 3 season. Elliott was great his rookie season and his 3rd season but this season he's in the same universe of being great.
.

 

[Bullflop]

I think Zeke has lost a step since his rookie year, although, he's still got it as a power back.

I'd say a 2nd would be more likely. Hard to say what one GM may do and it just takes one!

 

[LACowboysFan1]

He got that huge contract to be a league leading rusher, PRODUCTION, PERFORMANCE.

Contracts are mainly paid based on past performance. Lead the league in rushing 2 of your 3 years, and very possible he'd made it 3 in a row if not for the suspension. Do you think if he'd not done that he'd have gotten the huge contract? You just are hoping and thinking he can continue to do that, but the future is always uncertain.

And just because you get the big bucks doesn't mean you can just decide to be the best running back, you still have to play the games, on a team. It's not like golf or bowling where you control the outcome based solely on how well you play. Zeke can be playing as hard as ever, we aren't in his shoes, all we can do is look at results. If that's his fault, all or mostly, or all or mostly the team's fault, we can't tell....

 

[Shinaoi]

So to clear it up, if the O line dominates than Zeke succeeds. The same could be said about almost every back in the NFL and they don’t cost 90 million dollars and aren’t entitled punk diva bullies. CJ Anderson did just fine replacing Gurley when he had room to run. Ajayi did well in 2017 when he had room to run. Pollard is arguably better than Zeke when he has room to run. Scarbrough came off the practice squad and averaged 1 more ypc than Zeke and he wasn’t going against the 3rd worst defense.

Hmmm...so what did we pay Zeke for? There’s not one game we would have lost this year if it weren’t for him.

I made that same point in another thread. Basically zeke is only good if the oline is good so what the point ?