Zeke Advanced Efficiency Stats

[blueblood70]

Nah, it's largely homerism. You can see it in almost all your posts. You bristle every single time at any criticism of a coach or player.

Common sense tells you Elliott is a good back at this point, not a great one. Every stat, every game, indicates a good, not great TB. We are overpaying our TB. That's just reality.

I say its Not so take the NAH attitude and use it for TP..

stubborn hard headed myopic fans like you are not worth debating..

 

[RonnieT24]

The Zeke argument has been one that has been going on since he was drafted. Both sides use good/bad stretches, games, or seasons to promote their agenda.

In a season where the great Zeke Eilliott had a chance to shine, be the focus of the offense and lead the offense, he has disappeared. Pollard is outshining him, when he gets the chance.

Now its not tough to see that the fall of the Oline has been a big problem. But the anti Zeke crowd has always told the Zeke fans that the great Oline was one of the things making Zeke look better than he was.

I don't know if the line was making Zeke look better than he was so much as it was allowing him to showcase his greatness. No back shines without blocking.. that's simply a universal truth. Pollard looks good in spurts.. but there is nary a mention of all the times he has been tackled for a loss. According to pro-football-reference Pollard has broken one tackle on a run all year.. in 47 carries.. ONE.. So his break rate is 1/47. Meanwhile Zeke has broken 11. or 1/13.6 Now there are a number of ways to interpret that. Obviously Zeke is more powerful and should be able to break more tackles.. and since when he's in the game the entire defense is aware of him he's going to have to. Pollard gets to the second level quicker because he is classic wild stallion young runner. The problem is that typically when there is no hole he's done because he doesn't really break tackles. I can't find the numbers but I would wager Pollard has as many or more TFLs than Zeke on a third as many carries. Zeke is almost 4 times as likely to break a tackle than Pollard. Pollard's quickness may allow him to evade more tackles though.. But on about the 15th carry or so there is a precipitous drop in that quickness .. and over the course of a season it might disappear altogether. Then you have a back without burst who is 25 pounds lighter than Zeke. Then we find out what other tools he has in his bag. If it helps the team win to play Pollard more then play him more. But he's going to have to get better at blitz pickup and NOT being stopped behind the line of scrimmage in order for that to happen.

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

"starfan1,"
Since you got clever with your reply to me, I can't actually show your post. However...let me say this;

(I don't really love talking about picks from four years ago...or talk about money and contracts....but here goes anyway)

I think we both agree in 2016 that if it wasn't a perfect pick...it was a GOOD pick. So...maybe we should let that go? 2016 was a great year and I do think we BLEW IT! Our of pure superstition. Crazy. Anyway....

What I think SHOULD be in contention, is the crazy contract extension. I'd let you argue all day long THAT....was the true mistake.

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

I don't know if the line was making Zeke look better than he was so much as it was allowing him to showcase his greatness. No back shines without blocking.. that's simply a universal truth. Pollard looks good in spurts.. but there is nary a mention of all the times he has been tackled for a loss. According to pro-football-reference Pollard has broken one tackle on a run all year.. in 47 carries.. ONE.. So his break rate is 1/47. Meanwhile Zeke has broken 11. or 1/13.6 Now there are a number of ways to interpret that. Obviously Zeke is more powerful and should be able to break more tackles.. and since when he's in the game the entire defense is aware of him he's going to have to. Pollard gets to the second level quicker because he is classic wild stallion young runner. The problem is that typically when there is no hole he's done because he doesn't really break tackles. I can't find the numbers but I would wager Pollard has as many or more TFLs than Zeke on a third as many carries. Zeke is almost 4 times as likely to break a tackle than Pollard. Pollard's quickness may allow him to evade more tackles though.. But on about the 15th carry or so there is a precipitous drop in that quickness .. and over the course of a season it might disappear altogether. Then you have a back without burst who is 25 pounds lighter than Zeke. Then we find out what other tools he has in his bag. If it helps the team win to play Pollard more then play him more. But he's going to have to get better at blitz pickup and NOT being stopped behind the line of scrimmage in order for that to happen.

I rewatched the steelers game, and Pollard right away broke off a 20 yarder. He MUST be better than Zeke right?

Then proceeded for several no gainers and stalled drives.

But our o-line is great and zeke sucks, right?

(PS...I don't hate Pollard. Great #2 C.O.B. back.)

 

[RonnieT24]

Since you got clever with your reply to me, I can't actually show your post. However...let me say this;

(I don't really love talking about picks from four years ago...or talk about money and contracts....but here goes anyway)

I think we both agree in 2016 that if it wasn't a perfect pick...it was a GOOD pick. So...maybe we should let that go? 2016 was a great year and I do think we BLEW IT! Our of pure superstition. Crazy. Anyway....

What I think SHOULD be in contention, is the crazy contract extension. I'd let you argue all day long THAT....was the true mistake.

The contract extension has only been rendered a mistake by the shift in style of play. If we were still a pound the rock team it would be fine IMHO. Of course you would still need a healthy o-line and a competent QB to make it work.. but if these team was still closer to 50/50 run-pass as opposed to 70/30 like it has morphed into I would be fine with whatever they paid Zeke. Truth be told I don't really care what they paid him anyway.. His paycheck is of not interest to me.. Just his play.. I watch him tote the rock.. I have never watched him pick up his paycheck.

 

[CowboyRoy]

I don't know if the line was making Zeke look better than he was so much as it was allowing him to showcase his greatness. No back shines without blocking.. that's simply a universal truth. Pollard looks good in spurts.. but there is nary a mention of all the times he has been tackled for a loss. According to pro-football-reference Pollard has broken one tackle on a run all year.. in 47 carries.. ONE.. So his break rate is 1/47. Meanwhile Zeke has broken 11. or 1/13.6 Now there are a number of ways to interpret that. Obviously Zeke is more powerful and should be able to break more tackles.. and since when he's in the game the entire defense is aware of him he's going to have to. Pollard gets to the second level quicker because he is classic wild stallion young runner. The problem is that typically when there is no hole he's done because he doesn't really break tackles. I can't find the numbers but I would wager Pollard has as many or more TFLs than Zeke on a third as many carries. Zeke is almost 4 times as likely to break a tackle than Pollard. Pollard's quickness may allow him to evade more tackles though.. But on about the 15th carry or so there is a precipitous drop in that quickness .. and over the course of a season it might disappear altogether. Then you have a back without burst who is 25 pounds lighter than Zeke. Then we find out what other tools he has in his bag. If it helps the team win to play Pollard more then play him more. But he's going to have to get better at blitz pickup and NOT being stopped behind the line of scrimmage in order for that to happen.

Pollard has broken one tackle all year? LOL

You are one of the last blind Zeke homers left. A dying breed with every game.

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

The contract extension has only been rendered a mistake by the shift in style of play. If we were still a pound the rock team it would be fine IMHO. Of course you would still need a healthy o-line and a competent QB to make it work.. but if these team was still closer to 50/50 run-pass as opposed to 70/30 like it has morphed into I would be fine with whatever they paid Zeke. Truth be told I don't really care what they paid him anyway.. His paycheck is of not interest to me.. Just his play.. I watch him tote the rock.. I have never watched him pick up his paycheck.

I'm with you 100% brother!

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

The shift is because its obvious that Zeke doenst get the job done and Dak does.

Dont care who gets paid what? Casual fan?

So do you care about UNDERPAID players?

No...so please spare us.

LOL you care SO much ....on the ones you hate.

 

[RonnieT24]

I rewatched the steelers game, and Pollard right away broke off a 20 yarder. He MUST be better than Zeke right?

Then proceeded for several no gainers and stalled drives.

But our o-line is great and zeke sucks, right?

(PS...I don't hate Pollard. Great #2 C.O.B. back.)

Yeah every time Pollard got Pittsburgh's attention his positive runs came to a screeching halt. That's why he's a great change of pace back. He can come in and take advantage of the defense exhaling because Zeke is out of the game.. but as soon as they adjust and paint the target on him ... nada.. 52 yards on 3 carries.. 5 yards on the other 6 carries.. But people don't understand how that won't work as an every down back.. Or they do understand but their blind hatred for Zeke forces them to be intellectually dishonest.

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

Zeke isnt great. Thats the point. He is just a durable back that gets tons of carries behind a great line for most of his career.

Pollar has broken one tackle all year now? LOL Ok buddy. Last game he broke multiple tackles on one run.

TFL's is part of the game for any back. Pollard doenst have a "tackle behind the line" issue. Are you making that up?

Pollard has better vision, burst, speed, quickness, pass catching ability, big play ability, ect...ect.... Cowboys would be better served going with the hot hand.

Zeke pretty much just puts his head down and runs straight ahead. He is down to 3.8 YPC this year. Pathetic.

Go rewatch the steelers game....tell me how many yards he had after the 20 yard gain.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Yeah every time Pollard got Pittsburgh's attention his positive runs came to a screeching halt. That's why he's a great change of pace back. He can come in and take advantage of the defense exhaling because Zeke is out of the game.. but as soon as they adjust and paint the target on him ... nada.. 52 yards on 3 carries.. 5 yards on the other 6 carries.. But people don't understand how that won't work as an every down back.. Or they do understand but their blind hatred for Zeke forces them to be intellectually dishonest.

6.5 > 2.8

Drop out eh?

And that 3.8 YPC for Zeke on the year...............tough to out pace that!!!!!

 

[Sydla]

I say its Not so take the NAH attitude and use it for TP..

stubborn hard headed myopic fans like you are not worth debating..

You calling anyone stubborn is pretty funny. The evidence clearly shows Elliott has regressed to where he's no longer an elite back.

But you can't bring yourself to see or admit that because you are too big a Cowboys fan to admit it. That's stubborn.

 

[CowboyRoy]

its amazing the little you remember about football players around the league considered élite and either omit the facts or just have selective memory

Emmitt smith played 13 years in this league, a back much like Zeke considered a bell cow volume back speed was average didnt have a lot of breakaway speed and yet ended #1 nd in the HOF..Guess what 6 Years he finished with with under 4.0 YPC, one year 4YPC, 2 years with 4.1-4.5, two years at above 4.5 and one year at over 5. JUST ONE!!

Its crazy how zekes first bad year correlates with horrible line, no QB threat., and a terrible defense and new coaching staff but the lone Holdover is KM who rather pass 50times game.. yet Emmitt smith had 6 years in his career where his averages were under 4 SIX!


go look, Eddie George same thing, Jerome Bettis same thing etc etc etc

there are many kinds of backs and all are elite in their own way and Zeke not a shifty super fast scat back or one who ever was truly a speed back..he had some , was faste rtthen ES ever was but he is truly a bck you buld and offesne around and thats your identity RUN first , PA pass and own TOP wear down defenses..

guess what we actually were a playoff teams , best years were Zekes offense, the KM shift to Pass first not design or call run lays efficiently and tye and turn dak into

hers is the issue zekes dallas Cowboys Contract already dried 2 years ago, his cap says hes here another year maybe 2..

so quit with the constant threads trying to make case to why he shouldnt have got drafted or paid..it HAPPENED its OVER its in the past but the haters posting stats i have them at my disposal and can fins Backs in Zekes mold whom, were considered great and elite that have the same exact numbers..they in fact had many years like zekes having tis year..

sure this years fumbles were unacceptable but hey Russell Wilson started 6-0 this season because they limited TOs, funny hes now responsible for 9 of the 10 turnovers in the last 3 games that were all LOSSES/ 9 turnovers in 3 games, zeke has basically two bad fumble games in a row 5 total TOS all year and RW has 10 in 3 games and yet well hes élite.. LMAO..right selective memory, zekes not likable guy to most of you and not liking him personally has skewed your actual bias..

sorry man its the truth and really keep harping on the past and things that cant be changed ,definition of insanity..

Selective memory?

Emmitt was the heart and soul of that offense and that team. He came up HUGE in big games and they won SB's on the back of Emmitt Smith. In the 4th quarter Emmitt would take over. The NFC East also had the great defenses of the Eagles and Giants twice a year to tangle with. Emmitt was the unstoppable force and one of the big leaders of that team.

Zeke is nothing more than a high carry guy that happened to have a great Oline early in his career. A bad leader thats basically a drunken, immature punk that will be outta here in 2 years tops. NFC East during Zekes time has been a walk in the park literally.

To compare Zeke to Emmitt is pathetic for any Cowboys fan. Im shocked every time I hear one of you guys do it.

 

[Redline360]

Lol at comparing today's game to another era.

 

[Sydla]

Again, Elliott is a good back. He's just not an elite back at this point. And we are paying him to be an elite back. And frankly, if your first instinct to defend Elliott is blame the OL or the QB for Elliott's lack of production, you are actually undermining your own point. If a TB is so reliant on the other positions around him, then its not a wise football or business decision to pay him what we paid Elliott.

And that's why a lot of teams don't invest in the position like we have.

 

[starfan1]

"starfan1,"
Since you got clever with your reply to me, I can't actually show your post. However...let me say this; Clever? Me? Never lol!

(I don't really love talking about picks from four years ago...or talk about money and contracts....but here goes anyway)

I think we both agree in 2016 that if it wasn't a perfect pick...it was a GOOD pick. So...maybe we should let that go? 2016 was a great year and I do think we BLEW IT! Our of pure superstition. Crazy. Anyway.... No we don't agree on that. I will agree Zeke is a good player but the role he plays can be filled by many because his success was and is contingent on quality of the line and RB break down too soon. (there aren't many Emmitt's) and yes we blew it in 2016. i still have visions of Byron jones getting roasted and the defense of course. Daks slow start and Aaron Rodgers moving on. It is what it is i didn't get what i wanted in 2016 but it wouldn't have mattered because as much as i hate to admit it the right pick would have been Jaylon Ramsey. then followed up by a RB

What I think SHOULD be in contention, is the crazy contract extension. I'd let you argue all day long THAT....was the true mistake.[/QUOTE] Yes we do agree on that the cowboys extended the wrong people. Im coming around to Dlaw although id like to see more sacks but the others Im just not thinking hold value over Byron who i also think was ridiculously over paid.

Go rewatch the steelers game....tell me how many yards he had after the 20 yard gain.

and this business of using the steelers game as a talking point is nuts even though your point is factually true. if you cant look at the 2 running backs and see how one hits the hole with much more excelleration and burst I cant help you.

Im not one who is pimping Pollard to start but he should be used more.

 

[cern]

i cannot say why zeke's performance has fallen off like it has, only that it has. he is a shadow of his former self. and the fumbles have been the worst part of it.

 

[jazzcat22]

The narrative that Zeke always faces a stacked box is untrue. The stats here prove it.

In 2020, he’s facing an average of 6.3 defenders in the box, per run. That average ranks 62nd among all running backs. Zeke faces an 8-man box only 12% of the time, which is the 39th most among all running backs. And against a stacked box, Zeke averages 2.0 yards per carry.

Zeke is average, at best. He’s not a home run threat anymore, and defenses know it.

So to all of the Zeke defenders out there: PLEASE, find a new argument to use, because the “he opens things up for the rest of the offense because he garners so much attention” angle is fake news.

Any RB with out a quality QB (Dak being injured), and missing 3/5 or 4/5 of his starting line (all season long) will not have their same success.

Zeke haters need to stop looking for crap to make it seem like it is all him.

 

[Sydla]

Any RB with out a quality QB (Dak being injured), and missing 3/5 or 4/5 of his starting line (all season long) will not have their same success.

Zeke haters need to stop looking for crap to make it seem like it is all him.

If Zeke needs a really good OL and a QB, then guess what? He's not elite.

It's really not that hard a concept to grasp. In order of importance, having an elite TB is behind OL and QB in terms of importance. Which is why it was dumb to pay Elliott all that money.

 

[Established1971]

Go rewatch the steelers game....tell me how many yards he had after the 20 yard gain.

take away the 20 he had a 4.6 avg to Zekes 2.8