Zeke v. Saquon shades of Emmitt v. Barry

[tyke1doe]

Barry Sanders had 2 all pro lineman and 3 pro bowl lineman when he came into the NFL.
Emmitt had none, they became all pro and went to the pro bowl after Emmitt came in. Nate Newton often says this. They were nobody's until Emmitt came along.

As for Barry having more strength than Emmitt, then answer this. Why did they remove Barry inside the 5 yard line, and Emmitt was in there every time inside the 5 year line, 10, and 20 yard line too.
Barry's speed was a non factor there, maybe his elusiveness could work at times. But it was his lack of power that was why he was not in there as much.

But people need to get over this Ol vs. OL crap. But it is the only argument they have which is a false argument.

I think Emmitt's lower body was stronger than Barry's, but I disagree that Barry was taken out because of a lack of strength. Barry was taken out because Barry was too elusive for his own good. He would not follow the hole nor was he patient enough to wait for it to open, unlike Emmitt.
A running back is a balance of patience and quick twitch. You have to sometimes wait for a hole to open then have the acceleration to get through. Barry didn't have that patience - not at the goal line. And running is different down inside the five than at the 50. Besides, Barry's line wasn't as good as Emmitt's. Not taking away from Emmitt because he made the Cowboys line, but they got good fast. And Eric Williams, Mark Stepnoski and Larry Allen weren't exactly Swiss cheese.

 

[Super_Kazuya]

I am specifically responding to @nate dizzle's statement

"However he played for one of the worst offensive lines on what was perennially one of the worst teams in the league."

There is no need to list out who was better per the above statement that my reply was based upon.

Fair enough. And there does seem at times too much sentiment that Barry always played behind bad lines. You don’t run for 2,000 yards behind a bad line. But he actually did at times play on bad teams behind bad lines. There certainly shouldn’t be any attempt to try to equate the quality of players the two played with.

 

[nate dizzle]

You should look up Barry's team and check your facts before making a statement like that.

Both Glover and Brown were ProBowl OL. Detroit's offense was not some scrub unit either. They had Herman Moore, Brett Perriman, and Johnny Morton with Scott Mitchell throwing to them. They could put up points and rack up yards on any team.

I do agree though Zeke vs Saquon has the makings to be just like Barry vs Emmitt.

From what I remember Barry was consistently being greeted in the backfield. It's been a long time though and maybe my memory isn't recalling it correctly.

 

[tyke1doe]

From what I remember Barry was consistently being greeted in the backfield. It's been a long time though and maybe my memory isn't recalling it correctly.

He was. But he also didn't wait for his blocks. I remember one of his lineman saying that he sometimes didn't know where Barry was. That was a backhand slap at his running style, but in a nice way.
In no way am I trying to detract from Barry's greatness. But Barry freelanced A LOT. He got a way with it A LOT too for 80-yard runs. But it's not coincidental either that he led the league in negative yards too.

 

[Playmaker3128]

I think at times zeke can be very under appreciated. Zeke was a huge part in 2 playoff runs the past three years. As someone earlier in this thread said, he's a chain mover. Maybe he doesn't break off huge runs, everytime he touches the ball its at least 4-5 yards. Everytime we need a 3rd or 4th and 1 he gets it. Even when he's stopped he makes a play. Zeke has elite vision for a RB, if he stays healthy and has no off the field issues he will be a hall of famer.

He has 4000 yards in 3 years. If he averages that the next 6 years he's in the top 15 all time and probably a hall of famer.

Fully expect barkley to be one as well.

 

[CowboyRoy]

The Zeke vs. Saquon debate could end being the Emmitt vs. Barry debate of this generation.

Emmitt ran behind what is probably considered the greatest offensive line of all time playing for what was one of the greatest teams in terms of offensive talent of that time. He had uncanny vision and quickness so he saw the hole as it was developing and would be through it in an instant. Aside from that, his grit, determination, and durability were probably his greatest attributes.

Barry was undeniably the more physically gifted in terms of speed, strength, and agility. However he played for one of the worst offensive lines on what was perennially one of the worst teams in the league.

I think we may find the situation with Zeke and Saquon (time will tell) to be very similar. Zeke, who isn't as physically gifted as Saquon (dude is a freak of nature) will likely play most of his career behind a far superior offensive line and probably put up better rushing numbers.

Zeke is playing with a rising star at QB with a ton of weapons on offense, while Saquon is playing for a team with a lame duck QB who will in all likelihood be ending his career this year, and has little offensive firepower outside of himself and Engram.

If they should both be durable enough to play for the next 7 years or so, I think you will see Zeke edge out Saquon in rushing numbers but there will be an argument to be made that Saquon was the better all around back.

Should be fun to watch and discuss over the years...

Sequan deserves to be in the conversation, but Zeke does not.

 

[CowboyRoy]

I think at times zeke can be very under appreciated. Zeke was a huge part in 2 playoff runs the past three years. As someone earlier in this thread said, he's a chain mover. Maybe he doesn't break off huge runs, everytime he touches the ball its at least 4-5 yards. Everytime we need a 3rd or 4th and 1 he gets it. Even when he's stopped he makes a play. Zeke has elite vision for a RB, if he stays healthy and has no off the field issues he will be a hall of famer.

He has 4000 yards in 3 years. If he averages that the next 6 years he's in the top 15 all time and probably a hall of famer.

Fully expect barkley to be one as well.

Ummm.......No he doesnt get it. Especially last year. It was a big problem for this offense because Zeke wasnt picking them up. Eventually they started giving that duty mostly to Dak picking up the tough yards on short yardage plays.

 

[nate dizzle]

He was. But he also didn't wait for his blocks. I remember one of his lineman saying that he sometimes didn't know where Barry was. That was a backhand slap at his running style, but in a nice way.
In no way am I trying to detract from Barry's greatness. But Barry freelanced A LOT. He got a way with it A LOT too for 80-yard runs. But it's not coincidental either that he led the league in negative yards too.

Yeah I do remember that about him as well. He definitely did not have Emmitt's patience and vision. His ability to know where the hole was going to be I feel is what really set him apart from Barry.

 

[viman96]

From what I remember Barry was consistently being greeted in the backfield. It's been a long time though and maybe my memory isn't recalling it correctly.

Yep that happened plenty of times. Barry did not always follow his blocks and danced around looking to break a run vs taking what was available. Which is the primary reason they pulled him in short yardage and around the goal line. They did not trust him to bang it up the gut so to speak and grind out the dirty yards.

 

[Thomas82]

Maybe Emmitt had something to do with those lines looking so great. I'm not sure Barry had more strength than Emmitt.

Facts!! 3/5 of that line was there for years before Emmitt got there and nobody had ever heard of them.

 

[nate dizzle]

I can see that, but, Zeke is quicker than 22 and Barkley is not as quick as Sanders. One is 4.47 and one is 4.4. Not a ton of difference, one guy takes the quicker shorter steps and appears to going twice as fast, but he really isn't. I'd take either guy.

I'm with you, I would take either one out of Zeke and Saquon and be happy. Love Zeke and glad he's a Cowboy, however, if they had both been available in the draft at the same time, I would go with Saquon without even flinching.

 

[HappyOnions]

Barkley is better and much less of a ridiculous person.

I think most Cowboys fans would honestly say that they'd rather have Barkley.

 

[JPostSam]

they're both great backs. it will be exciting watching both compete in this division for a long time.

as far the emmitt vs. barry comparison, i only hope that, once again, our guy wins three super bowls and theirs wins none.

 

[blueblood70]

Sequan deserves to be in the conversation, but Zeke does not.

troll remarks dont hold weight.... he does belong.. its obvious.. but cant see through the hate and disdain.. he got paid hes Cowboy, hes in every conversation apparently besides yours on whos the top back...all over espn zeke is mentioned 1-3 no matter what, and his and ES style are very similar outside of zeke finishing runs bit harder..they run patient, take what the d gives them and waits for big plays to come but doesnt force them..

Our Zone blocking has forced EE to ne more patient before he finds and hits the soft part in the zone.. SB is told here this is the schemed hole go hit it hard and fast.. its different Zeke been elite since hS has a College Title and was considered the best back in that draft and since has two rushing titles, and the other year led in YPC , second in rushing tds..hes done nothing to be dismissed by you 10 fans in here..10 on how many members lol and in real circles same thing very few clueless haters think hes not one of the best.. so yes hes in all conversations..yes he will sustain this because hes not injury prone..long enough to get in the conversation for HOF, that i dont know but ES best part of his game was longevity ..

 

[Cowboysheelsreds053]

Lions should have had better scouts then, that is on them.

 

[Cowboysheelsreds053]

You should look up Barry's team and check your facts before making a statement like that.

Both Glover and Brown were ProBowl OL. Detroit's offense was not some scrub unit either. They had Herman Moore, Brett Perriman, and Johnny Morton with Scott Mitchell throwing to them. They could put up points and rack up yards on any team.

I do agree though Zeke vs Saquon has the makings to be just like Barry vs Emmitt.

This! My brother said BS line was pretty darn good and people for some reason always assumed his OL was dog ----.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

It's not shades, it's a complete, direct parallel.

Saquon is hands-down the better home run hitter. Zeke is hands-down the better chain mover.

What you want out of a back basically determines which one you think is better.

Zeke wasn't particularly effective in moving the chains last year. I'm sorry but that's the reality of the situation.

We would be an appreciably better team with Barkley than Zeke. If you watched Sunday's game and came away with any other conclusion then congrats you're a grade A homer!

 

[JW82]

I'm with you, I would take either one out of Zeke and Saquon and be happy. Love Zeke and glad he's a Cowboy, however, if they had both been available in the draft at the same time, I would go with Saquon without even flinching.

I hear you. Just basing on what I saw in College,
barkley was the big play machine.

 

[TNCowboy]

Bogus premise from the get go. Barry Sanders had a very good OL, he just never had a good QB.

Emmitt Smith ran behind some guys who were a league-wide joke before he got here. Kevin Gogan, Nate Newton, Mark Tuinei were nobodies before Emmitt showed up.

 

[Super_Kazuya]

Bogus premise from the get go. Barry Sanders had a very good OL, he just never had a good QB.

Emmitt Smith ran behind some guys who were a league-wide joke before he got here. Kevin Gogan, Nate Newton, Mark Tuinei were nobodies before Emmitt showed up.

So count up all the All-Pros and Pro Bowls that each guy’s OL teammates accumulated over their careers and then get back to me...