Twitter: Cavanaugh: Penalties Against Cowboys are Hogwash

[MarcusRock]

I never said it wasn’t the right call. Not once did I say that.

I said it’s a dumb rule (my opinion) and that runners do it all the time (not my opinion, a fact) but this is the first time it was called all season.

Neither of those two statements mean the call was wrong.

First time it was called on a RB, yes but how many change directions to initiate contact with a guy?

 

[HungryLion]

He doesn't have to get out of bounds. He's allowed to stay in just like Zeke was. As I said in the other thread, if Zeke continues to go straight and throws a shoulder, he probably wouldn't have gotten flagged. But he changed directions to target the guy and speared down at him with his helmet. That was unnecessary. The Arizona DB launched at Penny and already had his back towards him at the moment of impact. Those are totally different actions by the DB. You saying they aren't? THAT would be full of crap.

Oh Zeke attacked him?

What was Zeke’s next move? Was he going to pull out a knife and stab the guy on the field? Since Zeke was in “attack” mode.

Lol now a running back lowering his shoulder into a defender is “attacking” them.

And I’m not going to get sucked into a debate about the intent. The intent is clearly the same. Lower the shoulder and punish the defender. Just like running backs are taught to do from a young age.

Again, why it’s a dumb rule.

 

[HungryLion]

First time it was called on a RB, yes but how many change directions to initiate contact with a guy?

All the time. Watch football or Go pull up your own videos.

 

[HungryLion]

And the only reason Zeke turns his body into the defender is because if he doesn’t. The defender is going to blast him in his chest, stomach or legs if he doesn’t. Running backs instinctually square up with a defender to get behind their pads and protect themselves.

They also do it to get extra yards.

Again.... why it’s a dumb rule.

 

[MarcusRock]

All the time. Watch football or Go pull up your own videos.

Hey, I hear you but I'm busy providing evidence for my claims. I can't prove the points of others too. Otherwise I'm debating with myself.

 

[MarcusRock]

And the only reason Zeke turns his body into the defender is because if he doesn’t. The defender is going to blast him in his chest, stomach or legs if he doesn’t. Running backs instinctually square up with a defender to get behind their pads and protect themselves.

They also do it to get extra yards.

Again.... why it’s a dumb rule.

You're allowed to protect yourself and get extra yards, etc. You're not allowed to target.

 

[HungryLion]

Hey, I hear you but I'm busy providing evidence for my claims. I can't prove the points of others too. Otherwise I'm debating with myself.

That sounds like a good idea. Debate with yourself. Because if you don’t know enough about the game to know that running backs initiate contact frequently. And to understand why a runner would want to square up with a defender, rather than get hit from the side, then debating you isn’t worth it.

The reason the rule is dumb is because Zeke didn’t have a choice in that situation it was either do what he did, or allow the defender to blast him from the side. Which isn’t exactly safe for a running back either.

 

[Kaiser]

Otherwise I'm debating with myself.

You are doing something with yourself, but it isn't debating.

 

[HungryLion]

One last thing.

The new NFL rule doesn’t state anything about a runner having to “turn” into a defender. It simply states they cannot Lower their head to initiate contact with a defender.

So look at the Penny run again and tell me he doesn’t lower his head and initiate contact. Whether he turned into the defender or not is irrelevant.

I’m not arguing the refs called it against Zeke because if a conspiracy against the cowboys. I don’t believe that.

What I’m saying is. The rule sucks because runners lower their heads and initiate contact with defenders quite often. So it forces refs into a situation where they have to make judgment calls and split hairs.

Thus making the rule almost impossible to enforce the rule fairly and evenly.

Zeke is not the first runner this season to lower his head and initiate contact. It’s happened a lot.

 

[ESisback]

Compared to which teams' games that you watch every week? Maybe all teams get timely, subjective, game changing flags. Again, 1/32nds of a story.

And your jibber-jabbering is one of several million eyerolling opinions out of that 1/32nd! Since you like research, and finding the truth, here’s a challenge for you...find a link to the stat that shows the top ten teams with the most losses as a direct result of subjective and/or questionable penalties. I doubt you’ll find one. They don’t keep track of things like that, which helps keep the lines blurred! They KNOW no one is going to watch all the games and document the results of each penalty, and even if they did, there will always be a handful of subjective calls that could be debated forever.

 

[MarcusRock]

One last thing.

The new NFL rule doesn’t state anything about a runner having to “turn” into a defender. It simply states they cannot Lower their head to initiate contact with a defender.

So look at the Penny run again and tell me he doesn’t lower his head and initiate contact. Whether he turned into the defender or not is irrelevant.

I’m not arguing the refs called it against Zeke because if a conspiracy against the cowboys. I don’t believe that.

What I’m saying is. The rule sucks because runners lower their heads and initiate contact with defenders quite often. So it forces refs into a situation where they have to make judgment calls and split hairs.

Thus making the rule almost impossible to enforce the rule fairly and evenly.

Zeke is not the first runner this season to lower his head and initiate contact. It’s happened a lot.

Penny lowered his head to brace as well as stand his ground because he didn't want to go out of bounds. Zeke had time to run towards his guy and aim his head down at him at impact. The difference in the 2 cases is the Arizona DB had already launched himself at Penny. The Philly DB was flatfooted as Zeke came at him and we don't know what he was going to do before Zeke initiated contact.

Why don't you address the difference in the DB's actions? It's clear that what the RBs were facing were different and they were called correctly in each case, IMO.

 

[MarcusRock]

Since you like research, and finding the truth, here’s a challenge for you...find a link to the stat that shows the top ten teams with the most losses as a direct result of subjective and/or questionable penalties.

Since you claim Dallas is number 1 on that list, can you quote your source and I'll start there?

 

[ESisback]

Great post. This year I think a bunch of things contribute but we still are in the noise and not the signal. Last year it was obviously a pattern and the stats and the timing bear that out.

But I would add #7 to your list of why the calls are out of whack this year (for all teams). The NFL is trying (poorly) to implement a bunch of new tickytack rules for player safety. That (or the fact its a make up call) are why we get laughable calls like Randy Gregory being flagged for roughing the passer for having Wentz by the thighs.

That Gregory play was RIDICULOUS! You know what really gets me? The league COULDN’T CARE LESS about player safety. They care about public perception, and how their perceived support for player safety affects their rating$.

 

[HungryLion]

Penny lowered his head to brace as well as stand his ground because he didn't want to go out of bounds. Zeke had time to run towards his guy and aim his head down at him at impact. The difference in the 2 cases is the Arizona DB had already launched himself at Penny. The Philly DB was flatfooted as Zeke came at him and we don't know what he was going to do before Zeke initiated contact.

Why don't you address the difference in the DB's actions? It's clear that what the RBs were facing were different and they were called correctly in each case, IMO.

Lol so now you want to argue semantics of what initiating contact is?

The rule says nothing about the actions of the defender.

It just says a runner can’t Lower their head and initiate contact. So you’re arguing semantics and coming up with qualifiers that aren’t written into the rule.

But don’t bother responding. Getting into this debate with you is clearly just a waste of time.

Good day.

 

[Kaiser]

That Gregory play was RIDICULOUS! You know what really gets me? The league COULDN’T CARE LESS about player safety. They care about public perception, and how their perceived support for player safety affects their rating$.

Steelers FB Merrill Hoge is a TV analyst now and just wrote a book (with a league friendly MD) that CTE is completely made up. There is a rumor among TBI researchers that he either got paid to do it or did it to suck up to the NFL.

 

[MarcusRock]

Lol so now you want to argue semantics of what initiating contact is?

The rule says nothing about the actions of the defender.

It just says a runner can’t Lower their head and initiate contact. So you’re arguing semantics and coming up with qualifiers that aren’t written into the rule.

But don’t bother responding. Getting into this debate with you is clearly just a waste of time.

Good day.

So the defender doesn't matter at all? If someone launches at you first then you clearly aren't initiating contact because you CAN'T. That's one way to tell whether a runner did or not so you logically HAVE to look at the defender to make that determination. That's why you don't want to comment on it. And you accuse me of playing dumb? Projection is your defense when you want to cover up avoidance, I get it.

 

[Cowboyz88]

Regarding the Zeke helmet penalty.

Two rams on top of the mountain face each other, charge and lock horns.

How can you possibly determine who’s the aggressor?

 

[MarcusRock]

Regarding the Zeke helmet penalty.

Two rams on top of the mountain face each other, charge and lock horns.

How can you possibly determine who’s the aggressor?

When one's charging while the other is flat-footed.

 

[ESisback]

Since you claim Dallas is number 1 on that list, can you quote your source and I'll start there?

I never claimed Dallas was number one on any list, only that there certainly seems to be bias and malfeasance afoot. I believe there are influential people who may be trying to indirectly change or influence things that benefit themselves financially. My source is my own eyes and ears and instincts. I trust them. I don’t NEED notarized legal documents, affidavits or video footage. You do, so go...um...satisfy yourself!

 

[Cowboyz88]

When one's charging while the other is flat-footed.

Who’s flat footed in your example?