Video: And You Would Let 21 Walk

[CouchCoach]

Absolutely,, but again this offense the way its built, is run first, and you better have an elite back in order to function.
Despite all of Zekes negatives, all off field,,,, on field he is a beast.
The only way you keep a Zeke is high draft pick,, you can find functional RBs that will perform behind this top grade OL, but if you want to dominate according to the build, this roster requires elite RB talent.
Elite RB performance is required, or this will not work, and Moore will be called a failure.
I have come around,, despite all of Zekes bone headed off the field actions, he is more valuable than Dak, but we will pay both and that will totally kill other positions going forward, within the next 4-5 years.
You have to pick your poison.

There's a thread posted with some research about how much the Cowboys run and Q1-3, they're not in the top 10.

However, all of this is unknown as we don't know two things. One, how will Moore call the games and two, what kind of leeway will he have. Will Booger and/or Garrett give him his marching orders about who he features?

From that comment Booger made after Moore was promoted, I read more wide open offense into it. Is there a shift in the thinking of how they're going to run the offense?

Might just be me but I do believe this is not going to be a run it through the RB offense. Part of that is dependent on what they do contractually with Elliott but more of it has to do with the acquisition of Cooper and Cobb and if they do a 30M+ with the QB, that's not to feature the RB. Top that off with a 17M deal with the WR1. This is Romo-Owens or Bryant all over again and nothing could make Booger happier.

 

[xwalker]

Why does this offense require an "elite" RB? Why can't they spend a 1st on a RB every 4 years? 5, if they use the option and he'll play for that.

What team has proven that an elite RB is a necessity? The Vikings never won jack with the best RB of his time.

As far as that superior grade OL, I think Shanahan disproved your point that the RB has to be elite.....and paid like it. Quality depth at RB is key and he made sure he had a stable of them.

So, let's assume you are going to pay Elliott his 15M a season, what are you doing with Prescott and Cooper, make this the highest paid triplets taking down the largest % of the cap in history? Already got a DE in the top 5 paid, think there aren't 2 LBs waiting to get paid and a CB? Not to mention that superior grade and paid OL.

Belichick's cap theory isn't about one player, it's about all of them that start lining up after one breaks the bank. Look at PIT. What NFL player doesn't have an inflated view of his value? Belichick didn't even take a run at Flowers, didn't even tag him because he knew the message he would send to the other players.

If they make him the highest paid RB to ever play the game, you will not see this team in a SB, maybe not even the playoffs in the next two years.

I think people are missing the bigger issue.

Will they have a potential replacement for Zeke?

If they have nothing to replace him then it's not much of a debate but if they have a decent replacement then debating Zeke vs a slightly above average NFL RB is a legit debate topic.

The Rams drafted Darrell Henderson in the 3rd round this year. IMO he might be the best RB in this draft. He didn't go higher because teams seem to want bigger RBs but Henderson is about Emmitt/Barry Sanders size.

The Rams will pay Gurley the big money for a couple of years then cut him and move on.

It's not as clean as the Belichick method but it's also not paying big money every year to a RB.

FYI - I'm a big fan of the Tony Pollard pick as a versatile offensive weapon with both size and speed. He's not a tiny speed guy like Tavon Austin: however, I don't see him as a full time starting RB to eventually replace Zeke. It's possible but I would not plan on it. They never should have made Felix Jones into a starter. Felix would have been a terrific offensive weapon if he didn't bulk up to become a starter.

They have Zeke for 2 more years without doing anything contract-wise. It might good to consider drafting a RB in the 2nd or 3rd next year. Even a late 1st should be considered for the right player. The probability of getting a really good RB late 1st is much better than the probability of getting an elite DE.

I said during the 2017 draft that I would consider drafting Dalvin Cook at #28. Cook has had injury issues in the NFL but I would still trade Taco straight up for him. He would only have a year of contract control past Zeke but as a backup wouldn't get a mega-contract if re-signed in 2021 when Zeke is a free agent.

 

[CouchCoach]

I think people are missing the bigger issue.

Will they have a potential replacement for Zeke?

If they have nothing to replace him then it's not much of a debate but if they have a decent replacement then debating Zeke vs a slightly above average NFL RB is a legit debate topic.

The Rams drafted Darrell Henderson in the 3rd round this year. IMO he might be the best RB in this draft. He didn't go higher because teams seem to want bigger RBs but Henderson is about Emmitt/Barry Sanders size.

The Rams will pay Gurley the big money for a couple of years then cut him and move on.

It's not as clean as the Belichick method but it's also not paying big money every year to a RB.

FYI - I'm a big fan of the Tony Pollard pick as a versatile offensive weapon with both size and speed. He's not a tiny speed guy like Tavon Austin: however, I don't see him as a full time starting RB to eventually replace Zeke. It's possible but I would not plan on it. They never should have made Felix Jones into a starter. Felix would have been a terrific offensive weapon if he didn't bulk up to become a starter.

They have Zeke for 2 more years without doing anything contract-wise. It might good to consider drafting a RB in the 2nd or 3rd next year. Even a late 1st should be considered for the right player. The probability of getting a really good RB late 1st is much better than the probability of getting an elite DE.

I said during the 2017 draft that I would consider drafting Dalvin Cook at #28. Cook has had injury issues in the NFL but I would still trade Taco straight up for him. He would only have a year of contract control past Zeke but as a backup wouldn't get a mega-contract if re-signed in 2021 when Zeke is a free agent.

I agree with this and too many are positioning this as keep Elliott or start some scrub and no one has suggested that.

The Belchick way works because he has Brady and probably the best OL coach in the game.

RB's are the best value picks in the draft and college is just gonna keep putting them out there every year.

 

[xwalker]

Why does this offense require an "elite" RB? Why can't they spend a 1st on a RB every 4 years? 5, if they use the option and he'll play for that.

What team has proven that an elite RB is a necessity? The Vikings never won jack with the best RB of his time.

As far as that superior grade OL, I think Shanahan disproved your point that the RB has to be elite.....and paid like it. Quality depth at RB is key and he made sure he had a stable of them.

So, let's assume you are going to pay Elliott his 15M a season, what are you doing with Prescott and Cooper, make this the highest paid triplets taking down the largest % of the cap in history? Already got a DE in the top 5 paid, think there aren't 2 LBs waiting to get paid and a CB? Not to mention that superior grade and paid OL.

Belichick's cap theory isn't about one player, it's about all of them that start lining up after one breaks the bank. Look at PIT. What NFL player doesn't have an inflated view of his value? Belichick didn't even take a run at Flowers, didn't even tag him because he knew the message he would send to the other players.

If they make him the highest paid RB to ever play the game, you will not see this team in a SB, maybe not even the playoffs in the next two years.

The flip side of the RBs aren't worth it argument is that RBs cost less than most other positions.

Getting possibly the best player at his position for about 15M per vs 21M per for DLaw is an interesting topic. I'm not certain DLaw is even top 5 at his position.

There is something to be said for having uber-elite players on the roster at any position. My contention is that last years defense needed to add one elite player at any position as much or more than it needed standard upgrades at specific positions.

Imagine adding a prime of their career Darren Woodson or Earl Thomas or Charles Haley or Deion. They could have had a game plan to be much more aggressive against the run because they wouldn't need to be so conservative against the pass. One Deion pick-6 completely changes that game which the Cowboys lost by 8 points. Obviously adding a Jerome Brown at DT would directly address the issue in the Rams game; however, if the choice is an incremental upgrade at DT vs an uber-elite player at any position, I'll take the uber-elite player.

The top pass rusher contract is 23.5M per. DLaw got 21M per. The top RB is 14.375M per.

Zeke 15M + Justin Houston 11.5M = 26.5M

DLaw 21M + 5.5M RB = 26.5M

A non-rookie contract RB at 5.5M gets you a Duke Johnson type.

The choice becomes:
Zeke + Justin Houston

Duke Johnson + DLaw

 

[glimmerman]

[UOTE="xwalker, post: 9269045, member: 5194"]The flip side of the RBs aren't worth it argument is that RBs cost less than most other positions.

Getting possibly the best player at his position for about 15M per vs 21M per for DLaw is an interesting topic. I'm not certain DLaw is even top 5 at his position.

There is something to be said for having uber-elite players on the roster at any position. My contention is that last years defense needed to add one elite player at any position as much or more than it needed standard upgrades at specific positions.

Imagine adding a prime of their career Darren Woodson or Earl Thomas or Charles Haley or Deion. They could have had a game plan to be much more aggressive against the run because they wouldn't need to be so conservative against the pass. One Deion pick-6 completely changes that game which the Cowboys lost by 8 points. Obviously adding a Jerome Brown at DT would directly address the issue in the Rams game; however, if the choice is an incremental upgrade at DT vs an uber-elite player at any position, I'll take the uber-elite player.

The top pass rusher contract is 23.5M per. DLaw got 21M per. The top RB is 14.375M per.

Zeke 15M + Justin Houston 11.5M = 26.5M

DLaw 21M + 5.5M RB = 26.5M

A non-rookie contract RB at 5.5M gets you a Duke Johnson type.

The choice becomes:
Zeke + Justin Houston

Duke Johnson + DLaw[/QUOTE]
whats going to happen is D-Law + Elliot... Lol, I think SJ wants to keep him. 36.5.. Plus Dak, Plus Cooper.. They let Byron walk..

 

[Bobhaze]

There's a thread posted with some research about how much the Cowboys run and Q1-3, they're not in the top 10.

However, all of this is unknown as we don't know two things. One, how will Moore call the games and two, what kind of leeway will he have. Will Booger and/or Garrett give him his marching orders about who he features?

From that comment Booger made after Moore was promoted, I read more wide open offense into it. Is there a shift in the thinking of how they're going to run the offense?

Might just be me but I do believe this is not going to be a run it through the RB offense. Part of that is dependent on what they do contractually with Elliott but more of it has to do with the acquisition of Cooper and Cobb and if they do a 30M+ with the QB, that's not to feature the RB. Top that off with a 17M deal with the WR1. This is Romo-Owens or Bryant all over again and nothing could make Booger happier.

Jerry almost had to be threatened by Jimmy in ‘93 to get Emmitt signed to a long term deal. That never seems to happen with Jerry when it comes to his fave WR or QB.

 

[CouchCoach]

Jerry almost had to be threatened by Jimmy in ‘93 to get Emmitt signed to a long term deal. That never seems to happen with Jerry when it comes to his fave WR or QB.

LMAO, Jimmy had an assist from some death threats. That shot of the second game with Booger hiding in the alcove of TS was hilarious. Wouldn't surprise me if the OL got together and made the death threats.

The cops took those seriously too. "Mr. Jones, this is football and this is Texas and this is football in Texas and you are from Arkansas. There is a limit to our protection".

 

[Bobhaze]

LMAO, Jimmy had an assist from some death threats. That shot of the second game with Booger hiding in the alcove of TS was hilarious. Wouldn't surprise me if the OL got together and made the death threats.

The cops took those seriously too. "Mr. Jones, this is football and this is Texas and this is football in Texas and you are from Arkansas. There is a limit to our protection".

LOL! Never saw that happen with Troy’s or Michael Irvin’s new deals...or Romo’s. Jerry loves him some passing game.

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

The flip side of the RBs aren't worth it argument is that RBs cost less than most other positions.

Getting possibly the best player at his position for about 15M per vs 21M per for DLaw is an interesting topic. I'm not certain DLaw is even top 5 at his position.

There is something to be said for having uber-elite players on the roster at any position. My contention is that last years defense needed to add one elite player at any position as much or more than it needed standard upgrades at specific positions.

Imagine adding a prime of their career Darren Woodson or Earl Thomas or Charles Haley or Deion. They could have had a game plan to be much more aggressive against the run because they wouldn't need to be so conservative against the pass. One Deion pick-6 completely changes that game which the Cowboys lost by 8 points. Obviously adding a Jerome Brown at DT would directly address the issue in the Rams game; however, if the choice is an incremental upgrade at DT vs an uber-elite player at any position, I'll take the uber-elite player.

The top pass rusher contract is 23.5M per. DLaw got 21M per. The top RB is 14.375M per.

Zeke 15M + Justin Houston 11.5M = 26.5M

DLaw 21M + 5.5M RB = 26.5M

A non-rookie contract RB at 5.5M gets you a Duke Johnson type.

The choice becomes:
Zeke + Justin Houston

Duke Johnson + DLaw

Duke Johnson and Dlaw helps you win more games. Easy choice.

 

[Johnny23]

You missed the point. Without a salary cap there is no doubt that Dallas would field one of the best teams. All the top players would go to Dallas because they would get paid.

No they wouldn't. That's a myth created by Cowboys fans like you. No one's trying to come here. With or without the salary cap.

 

[Irvin88_4life]

No they wouldn't. That's a myth created by Cowboys fans like you. No one's trying to come here. With or without the salary cap.

That's foolish just like the statement you just made. Money talks and without a salary cap guys would go anywhere the money led them.

"No one's trying to come here with or without the salary cap"........ Every year guys sign here so you're wrong.

 

[Einstein]

Power running backs don't last forever. That's why you let them go instead of plunking down big bucks for their extension.

And what kind of RB was Emmitt Smith? He ran best between the Tackles, and seemed to last a good many years being a STUD behind some good OL's.

 

[Johnny23]

That's foolish just like the statement you just made. Money talks and without a salary cap guys would go anywhere the money led them.

"No one's trying to come here with or without the salary cap"........ Every year guys sign here so you're wrong.

You're right. Nobody is trying to come here if they're a top free agent. I am not talking about the jags who are happy to still be in the NFL that we load up on. I am talking the players who actually matter and move the needle. None of them are checking for us if they're available regardless of cap.

The Cowboys are irrelevant regardless of what you think.

 

[Irvin88_4life]

You're right. Nobody is trying to come here if they're a top free agent. I am not talking about the jags who are happy to still be in the NFL that we load up on. I am talking the players who actually matter and move the needle. None of them are checking for us if they're available regardless of cap.

The Cowboys are irrelevant regardless of what you think.

Wrong again. Dallas has won 3 of the last 5 division titles. The reason we haven't signed top free agents is because Stephen isn't shopping in free agency for expensive guys. If there was no salary cap I bet you anything you want that Dallas would sign whoever that want.

 

[Johnny23]

Wrong again. Dallas has won 3 of the last 5 division titles. The reason we haven't signed top free agents is because Stephen isn't shopping in free agency for expensive guys. If there was no salary cap I bet you anything you want that Dallas would sign whoever that want.

I don't buy that if money was no object players,star players would flock here. I think it's just what Cowboys fans like us try to say to delude ourselves. Sure you go on about fugal Stephen and not wanting to spend Monday.

 

[Whyjerry]

I don't think anyone will question whether or not Zeke is a great player. He is one of the best if not the best RBs. The problem is the salary cap and a demonstrated history of RBs diminishing during second contracts. I will also layer in the impact of the RB position in the modern game. If salary cap wasn't an issue - 100% resign him. The problem is you MUST consider the cap.

 

[InTheZone]

This thread like every Zeke thread will be littered with posters who made the same arguments before we drafted Zeke. They hated the pick. Came here over and over telling us you don’t draft a RB in the first round. Blah blah blah.

They were clearly wrong before. They are wrong now.

The good news for the fans that appreciate the impact a player of Zekes caliber has on the game have the Cowboys front office and probably the FO of every team in this league on their side.
ZEKE ISN’T GOING ANYWHERE.

What's funny is that I was against this pick when it was announced, like sick to my stomach, when we passed on Ramsey because I was beyond tired of Brandon Carr allowing career days on a weekly basis. And ever since that first preseason I saw everything I needed to see with Zeke. Instantly became a favorite player.

 

[CouchCoach]

That's foolish just like the statement you just made. Money talks and without a salary cap guys would go anywhere the money led them.

"No one's trying to come here with or without the salary cap"........ Every year guys sign here so you're wrong.

They sign where the money talks, you are right. However, you assume that Booger's bucks would speak the loudest and that is completely unproven as he's not the wealthiest owner or the only one willing to buy a ring.

There is this belief that all players want to be Cowboys and all coaches would line up for this job. I don't know how that even came about other than fan ego.

All of these players, including the ones that are Cowboys now, will go where the money is the best, even places like BUF and CLE.

The other element of this is contracts in force. A team could hire every FA available and not make the playoffs.

 

[CouchCoach]

What's funny is that I was against this pick when it was announced, like sick to my stomach, when we passed on Ramsey because I was beyond tired of Brandon Carr allowing career days on a weekly basis. And ever since that first preseason I saw everything I needed to see with Zeke. Instantly became a favorite player.

But could they not do the same thing with another rookie RB? And let's not forget that the rookie RB and QB stepped into a team with a top 3 rated OL.

If this worked once, could it not work again and not have a top 3 paid RB?

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

Really good listen

https://1053thefan.radio.com/blogs/jeff-cavanaugh/proof-scott-linehan-hampered-cowboys-last-year