News: Quarterback trap

OmerV

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glimmerman said:
I don’t think that Daks agent would have a big problem if they wanted to wait till next season to negotiate a contract. Barring injury our Offense is set to be better than last year. Only going to make it easier for his agent to start at more than 30.
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That's an interesting question. The injury concern is really the main reason an agent would want to get it done now instead of waiting. I would think an agent would rather take the big money now than run the risk of an injury derailing things while they wait for even bigger money next year. Kind of a bird in the hand thing.
 
glimmerman

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OmerV said:
That's an interesting question. The injury concern is really the main reason an agent would want to get it done now instead of waiting. I would think an agent would rather take the big money now than run the risk of an injury derailing things while they wait for even bigger money next year. Kind of a bird in the hand thing.
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Yep. I don’t disagree. Dak is a running QB at times and increases his odds of injury. If they have offered Dak 30 then I think the deal gets done and it’s a matter of guaranteed money. But if he can’t get it then I am not sure if they are scrambling. Lol.
 
aikemirv

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dckid said:
https://bleacherreport.com/articles...om&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=editorial

Great article talking about the QB trap that the Vikings fell into last off season. Sounds a heck of a lot like the situation we are headed towards with Dak.

The Vikings flew straight into the pitcher plant with Cousins by paying a premium for a journeyman whose only hope for an MVP season comes from being surrounded by a superteam.

Just because the market says $30 million for your QB who is hitting Free agency at the right time doesn't mean he is Brees, Wilson, Rodgers, Luck.
Dak is an average starter. You can win with him, he won't kill you with a 5 turnover game. I never expect him to carry this team because I know what to expect. He has a solid floor and a low celing. Not someone I want to pay 30 million a year for.
All the Dak lovers can spin doctor this all day, but if you are actually honest with yourself. Dak is not an elite QB, and I am not insulting him. He is what he is. A good QB who should be paid fairly. To me that number is what Foles is getting in Jacksonville.
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Minnesotas problem was that they decided to replaced a QB who played really well in their system for a QB who played well.

They should have kept Case and saved the $!
 
Toruk_Makto

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ItzKelz said:
Dak was the best QB in the NFC the second half of last season after he got a true #1. Which includes the likes of Brees, Wilson, Rodgers and Ryan....all of which have top #1 WRs in the NFL. Everyone needs talent
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Brees: Michael Thomas: MId 2nd round pick
Wilson: Tyler Lockett: Mid 3rd round pick
Rodgers: Devante Adams: Late 2nd round pick
Ryan: Julio Jones: Top pick

Of your examples it appears that Brees, Wilson and Rodgers are actually elevating the players around them. Ryan has had top offensive tools since day 1. Thought experiment over the last 3 years if Dak and Ryan switched spots Ryan probably would have played as well or better than Dak. I very much doubt the opposite is true.

Dak needs 1st rounders and/or hall of fame talent at every position on offense before he can produce. And if he doesn't he gets a pass. This is not hyperbole.

If his hall of famer LT is out? He gets a pass.
If his all pro center is lost? He gets a pass.
If his all pro RB is suspended? He gets a pass.
If he doesn't have a top of the 1st round WR? He gets a pass.
And if everyone is in but he plays poorly...its the coaches? He gets a pass.

This is your king?
 
OmerV

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Toruk_Makto said:
Brees: Michael Thomas: MId 2nd round pick
Wilson: Tyler Lockett: Mid 3rd round pick
Rodgers: Devante Adams: Late 2nd round pick
Ryan: Julio Jones: Top pick

Of your examples it appears that Brees, Wilson and Rodgers are actually elevating the players around them. Ryan has had top offensive tools since day 1. Thought experiment over the last 3 years if Dak and Ryan switched spots Ryan probably would have played as well or better than Dak. I very much doubt the opposite is true.

Dak needs 1st rounders and/or hall of fame talent at every position on offense before he can produce. And if he doesn't he gets a pass. This is not hyperbole.

If his hall of famer LT is out? He gets a pass.
If his all pro center is lost? He gets a pass.
If his all pro RB is suspended? He gets a pass.
If he doesn't have a top of the 1st round WR? He gets a pass.
And if everyone is in but he plays poorly...its the coaches? He gets a pass.

This is your king?
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If it's draft status that determines if a player is a top talent or not, then maybe it's Michael Thomas that is elevating Brees. After all, Thomas was drafted higher than Brees was.

The reality is that while playing with a quality QB obviously helps a WR, it's wrong to simply suggest that player would not be a top player without the QB elevating him. Players go beyond or fall behind their draft status all the time.
 

dckid

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glimmerman said:
Yep. I don’t disagree. Dak is a running QB at times and increases his odds of injury. If they have offered Dak 30 then I think the deal gets done and it’s a matter of guaranteed money. But if he can’t get it then I am not sure if they are scrambling. Lol.
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Great point. I am always on the edge of my seat when Dak runs head first diving into the endzone. I wish he was a bit less reckless in those situations.
 

QuincyCarterEra

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Toruk_Makto said:
Brees: Michael Thomas: MId 2nd round pick
Wilson: Tyler Lockett: Mid 3rd round pick
Rodgers: Devante Adams: Late 2nd round pick
Ryan: Julio Jones: Top pick

Of your examples it appears that Brees, Wilson and Rodgers are actually elevating the players around them. Ryan has had top offensive tools since day 1. Thought experiment over the last 3 years if Dak and Ryan switched spots Ryan probably would have played as well or better than Dak. I very much doubt the opposite is true.

Dak needs 1st rounders and/or hall of fame talent at every position on offense before he can produce. And if he doesn't he gets a pass. This is not hyperbole.

If his hall of famer LT is out? He gets a pass.
If his all pro center is lost? He gets a pass.
If his all pro RB is suspended? He gets a pass.
If he doesn't have a top of the 1st round WR? He gets a pass.
And if everyone is in but he plays poorly...its the coaches? He gets a pass.

This is your king?
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"This is not hyperbole"

While your entire statement is hyperbole. Woof. This is bad.

"Dak needs 1st rounders or hall of Fame talent at every position on offense to produce", and so since Dak has produced already and has never been surrounded purely by HOFers or 1st rounder how stupid does that make your comment?

Yes Ryan has had tools around him since day 1, and starting Day 1 Ryan wasn't any good until his 5th season in the league. And you want to run off a player that was light years better than Ryan at this point in their careers.

And claiming QBs elevate their WRs based on the WRs draft status..... never mind not going to go there lmao..

In 2017 Adam's played the first 6 games of the season with Rodgers. Adam's had 56.5 yards per game. The next 7 games Adams played without Rodgers and averaged 70 yards per game. How exactly did Rodgers elevate Adam's?

Lost his HOF LT and was replaced by one of the worst LT performances the league has ever seen? Doesnt get a pass by anyone, especially not you. He gets all the blame.
Didnt have his All-pro center all of last year. Did he get a pass? No he didnt need one. He still produced.
 
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glimmerman

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dckid said:
Great point. I am always on the edge of my seat when Dak runs head first diving into the endzone. I wish he was a bit less reckless in those situations.
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Wasn’t that how wentz got his knee hurt.
 
PUSHfold

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Oh a "Dak isn't that great and isn't worth 30m" a year thread...man wish I had thought of that.
 
TexasHillbilly

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glimmerman said:
Wasn’t that how wentz got his knee hurt.
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That's how I saw Vick get knocked out of a game when he played for the eagles. I believe your Wentz comment was also correct. Trying to get that extra yard or td can get you put out of the game if not the season.
 
glimmerman

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TexasHillbilly said:
That's how I saw Vick get knocked out of a game when he played for the eagles. I believe your Wentz comment was also correct. Trying to get that extra yard or td can get you put out of the game if not the season.
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I believe ratliff knocked vick out of a game against us. Gave him a concussion.
 
InTheZone

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Toruk_Makto said:
Brees: Michael Thomas: MId 2nd round pick
Wilson: Tyler Lockett: Mid 3rd round pick
Rodgers: Devante Adams: Late 2nd round pick
Ryan: Julio Jones: Top pick

Of your examples it appears that Brees, Wilson and Rodgers are actually elevating the players around them. Ryan has had top offensive tools since day 1. Thought experiment over the last 3 years if Dak and Ryan switched spots Ryan probably would have played as well or better than Dak. I very much doubt the opposite is true.

Dak needs 1st rounders and/or hall of fame talent at every position on offense before he can produce. And if he doesn't he gets a pass. This is not hyperbole.

If his hall of famer LT is out? He gets a pass.
If his all pro center is lost? He gets a pass.
If his all pro RB is suspended? He gets a pass.
If he doesn't have a top of the 1st round WR? He gets a pass.
And if everyone is in but he plays poorly...its the coaches? He gets a pass.

This is your king?
Click to expand...
giphy.gif
 
Irvin88_4life

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PJTHEDOORS said:
Cowboys should have done this with Bus driver Aikman by these haters standards. We should have let him walk after his rookie contract.
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Difference is Aikman was garbage his first 3 years. Dak on the other hand has broke records and was in MVP discussion his rookie year.
 
BigCatMonaco

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dckid said:
https://bleacherreport.com/articles...om&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=editorial

Great article talking about the QB trap that the Vikings fell into last off season. Sounds a heck of a lot like the situation we are headed towards with Dak.

The Vikings flew straight into the pitcher plant with Cousins by paying a premium for a journeyman whose only hope for an MVP season comes from being surrounded by a superteam.

Just because the market says $30 million for your QB who is hitting Free agency at the right time doesn't mean he is Brees, Wilson, Rodgers, Luck.
Dak is an average starter. You can win with him, he won't kill you with a 5 turnover game. I never expect him to carry this team because I know what to expect. He has a solid floor and a low celing. Not someone I want to pay 30 million a year for.
All the Dak lovers can spin doctor this all day, but if you are actually honest with yourself. Dak is not an elite QB, and I am not insulting him. He is what he is. A good QB who should be paid fairly. To me that number is what Foles is getting in Jacksonville.
Click to expand...


Nick foles second best passing season was a 13 TD performance.


If that’s worth 22, daks worth 40.
 

dckid

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Irvin88_4life said:
Difference is Aikman was garbage his first 3 years. Dak on the other hand has broke records and was in MVP discussion his rookie year.
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Aikman literally was playing with hot garbage. 1-15 to 7-9 to 11-5.
 
Johnny23

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jazzcat22 said:
Emmitt only missed the last game of the year in 1996, he played in all the other 15 games. They had the division wrapped up, so did not play.
The only time he missed 2 games besides the 1993 no contract year, was 2001 he missed games 7 and 8. But I do not recall if it his neck at that time.
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He injuried his neck in 1996 blocking a guy against the Bears in a Monday Night Game. He didn't miss time but it was an injury that hampered him the rest of the season.

As for paying Dak 30+ million his intangibles not make make up for his lack of tangibles. Nor the fact people get blinded by the Thanksgiving game against Washington and the second egals game in regard to Cooper and his production but fail to look at everything else. We are all fans so it's easy to get caught up in the moment and and go crazy. If Alex Smith can get traded twice and he is the Dak equivenlent holding onto dak's not the best route.
 
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