3 rookie QBs played today, and they all struggled

[thunderpimp91]

Wasn't you I was talking about.

I didn't say these guys would all be busts. I'm pointing out that drafting a QB high and hoping they're the savior isn't likely.

Trevor Lawrence was a #1 overall pick, is far from a bust, and got PAID too. Have the Jaguars won anything with him??? Nope.

So even the 1st Round QBs who AREN'T busts still need an elite team around them to win. Could say the same for Justin Herbert.

We already have a very good QB. Tossing him aside without a viable replacement would've been insanely stupid.

My apologies for thinking everything is about me haha. I agree drafting isnt a high probability, but I dont think that means you have to be afraid to do it either. The Cowboys do have a good QB, I wont dismiss that for a second, I'm just in the minority of people who think the QB position is overrated in general. Good teams cant simply plug and play any joe off the street, but good rosters do tend to find ways to be competitive with lesser QBs.

Ultimately with Dak extended I think the QB analysis is simply tiring, but maybe thats my fault for still clicking the threads. I just hope the Cowboys are serious about trying to make a super bowl run and wont shy away from a deadline trade if needed to get this team over the top. Now that Lamb/Dak are extended the Cowboys have the cap flex to be aggressive the next 2-3 years.

 

[Cmac]

Rather simple......in college you throw to the open receiver (athleticism, talent discrepancy). In the NFL.....you throw the receiver open. (timing, passing window that is very small, crisp route running, pocket protection/awarenesss, progressions, etc). Despite records....there are no Tougaloo States on the schedule.

 

[Jarv]

Jayden Daniels had a good game, even a higher QB rating than our QB.

 

[Nav22]

thats not how the NFL works but carry on…

LOL, it's exactly how the NFL works.

CJ Stroud was drafted by a terrible team.
He was great as a rookie anyways, won a playoff game, and was a Pro Bowler and Offensive Rookie of the Year.

 

[Nav22]

Jayden Daniels had a good game, even a higher QB rating than our QB.

That's funny. I'll remember that next time Dak needs to score in garbage time in order to lose a game 37-20 instead of 37-13.

 

[JohnsKey19]

LOL, it's exactly how the NFL works.

CJ Stroud was drafted by a terrible team.
He was great as a rookie anyways, won a playoff game, and was a Pro Bowler and Offensive Rookie of the Year.

It’s his FIRST GAME! You can’t be serious…

 

[CWR]

#1 overall pick Caleb Williams...
14-29, 93 Yds, 56 Passer Rating, 22 QBR

#2 overall pick Jayden Daniels...
17-24, 184 Yds, 2 Rush TD (1 in garbage time), 3 fumbles (0 lost), 93 Passer Rating, 42 QBR

#12 overall pick Bo Nix...
26-42, 138 Yds, 2 Int, Rush TD, 47 Passer Rating, 30 QBR


Just for fun, let's throw in last year's #1 overall pick too!

#1 overall pick Bryce Young...
13-30, 161 Yds, 2 Int, Rush TD, 33 Passer Rating, 11 QBR
--------------------

Weird, huh?

It's almost like playing QB in the NFL is extremely difficult and drafting a QB in the 1st Round with the hopes that he'll be an elite franchise QB isn't very likely.

For every Mahomes or Josh Allen there's a dozen flameouts or more. Playing QB Lottery in the draft every few years and hoping to strike oil isn't much of a strategy.

I won't embarrass the dude who said it's "easier than ever" to find a QB nowadays, but hopefully he sees this and learns something.

I think the strategy is to draft one with tools in round 2-4 ish and develop him a couple years behind your starter.

I'm only wanting to go qb earlier if it's an elite prospect.

 

[Nav22]

It’s his FIRST GAME! You can’t be serious…

Are you serious?

Stroud struggled in his first game too. Then he went on to be great later on that year.

You don't need to handicap these guys. Just call it like it is. Daniels struggled. That doesn't mean he's doomed forever.

 

[DallasEast]

Additional first game comparisons:

#1 overall pick Joe Burrow (2000)...
23-36, 193 Yds, 66.1 Passer Rating, 13.9 QBR (link)

#7 overall pick Josh Allen (2018)...
6-15, 74 Yds, 56.0 Passer Rating, 37.0 QBR (link)

#1 overall pick Jared Goff (2016)...
17-31, 134 Yds, 65.8 Passer Rating, 48.2 QBR (link)

__________________

Jerry Jones decision-making is the real discussion that is rarely talked about, regardless if someone is pro or against drafting a first-round quarterback. When did Jones hand in a card for a first-round quarterback? How many years ago did that occur?

Right. Nitpicking Posting first-round quarterbacks' first game production is so easy, a moderator Caveman can do it.


DE?
Yes?
You ARE a Caveman.
Shaddup! I know that already!

 

[Nav22]

I think the strategy is to draft one with tools in round 2-4 ish and develop him a couple years behind your starter.

I'm only wanting to go qb earlier if it's an elite prospect.

That's fine. We traded for Lance a year ago hoping he'd develop.

What's NOT fine is getting rid of your good QB WITHOUT a young replacement you feel great about.

 

[Nav22]

Additional first game comparisons:

#1 overall pick Joe Burrow (2000)...
23-36, 193 Yds, 66.1 Passer Rating, 13.9 QBR (link)

#7 overall pick Josh Allen (2018)...
6-15, 74 Yds, 56.0 Passer Rating, 37.0 QBR (link)

#1 overall pick Jared Goff (2016)...
17-31, 134 Yds, 65.8 Passer Rating, 48.2 QBR (link)

__________________

Jerry Jones decision-making is the real discussion that is rarely talked about, regardless if someone is pro-drafting or con-drafting a first-round quarterback. When did Jones hand in a card for a first-round quarterback? How many years ago did that occur?

Right. Nitpicking Posting first-round quarterbacks' first game production is so easy, a moderator Caveman can do it.


DE?
Yes?
You ARE a Caveman.
Shaddup! I know that already!

Traded for a young, former #3 overall pick just a year ago.

Swing and a miss!

 

[Jarv]

That's funny. I'll remember that next time Dak needs to score in garbage time in order to lose a game 37-20 instead of 37-13.

What funny about a fact? I just looked at the stats. You are very sensitive,

 

[DallasEast]

I didn't say these guys would all be busts. I'm pointing out that drafting a QB high and hoping they're the savior isn't likely.

Traded for a young, former #3 overall pick just a year ago.

Swing and a miss!

You created a thread based on how three rookie quarterbacks performed by the teams that drafted them. You said you did so to point out drafting a quarterback high was a poor 'savior' argument.

Jerry Jones, a.k.a. the Dallas Cowboys, did not draft Trey Lance. San Francisco drafted him as their first-round pick.

You are correct that Jones traded for Lance. Lance was not a rookie quarterback when Jones traded for him. Lance did not struggle in his first game as a rookie for Dallas. Logically, Lance is a poor counterpoint for my additional information of your OP.

 

[BoysForLife]

Jayden Daniels putting up those numbers vs a Todd Bowles defense on the road isn’t exactly struggling. He was pretty good. His team just stinks.

Daniel's numbers were better than Prescott's across the board. Higher completion percentage, higher yards per attempt, higher rating and higher qbr

Also consider that he did this as a rookie making his first NFL start surrounded by significantly worse Talent on the offensive side of the ball.

I would love to have that kid on a rookie contract. We would be a Super Bowl Contender next year

 

[DFWJC]

If immediate instant gratification is what your goal is, then a rookie QB would rarely give that to you on week 1.

But teams never draft QBs with that expectation.

Not even sure what the point of this thread is

 

[Nav22]

You created a thread based on how three rookie quarterbacks performed by the teams that drafted them. You said you did so to point out drafting a quarterback high was a poor 'savior' argument.

Jerry Jones, a.k.a. the Dallas Cowboys, did not draft Trey Lance. San Francisco drafted him as their first-round pick.

You are correct that Jones traded for Lance. Lance was not a rookie quarterback when Jones traded for him. Lance did not struggle in his first game as a rookie for Dallas. Logically, Lance is a poor counterpoint for my additional information of your OP.

So because Jerry himself hasn't tried to draft one recently, we should ignore the data around the league?

I guess he needed to trade up for Paxton Lynch (like he desperately wanted to) in order for you guys to learn the obvious lesson here.

 

[SultanOfSix]

Dak doesn't need you to make him "magically better."

He's an All-Pro QB and the reigning MVP runner-up.

Those are facts, no matter how they make you feel.

Second team “All-Pro” and MVP-runner up against the worst passing D’s in the league. That’s more factual.

So what was your point in posting that rookie QBs don’t usually play good?

Was that some profound insight you were providing all of us?

I guess it was just a crapshoot that Aikman was the #1 pick in the draft and became a HOF. Just like Payton Manning too.

Or that perhaps Roger Staubach was drafted in the 12th round and that’s what made him a HOF?

 

[Nav22]

Second team “All-Pro” and MVP-runner up against the worst passing D’s in the league. That’s more factual because it’s detailed.

So what was your point in posting that rookie QBs don’t usually play good?

Was that some profound insight you were providing all of us?

Guy who says "play good" like he was raised by wolves insulting someone's intelligence: always hilarious.

Putting "All-Pro" in quotes doesn't make it less true, no matter how badly you wish it did.

 

[DallasEast]

So because Jerry himself hasn't tried to draft one recently, we should ignore the data around the league?

I guess he needed to trade up for Paxton Lynch (like he desperately wanted to) in order for you guys to learn the obvious lesson here.

Basically, your response is ignoring that your OP was examples of drafted rookie quarterbacks struggling in their first games--which you are using to support your assessment that drafting a first-round quarterback is not a good argument. I provided additional league data (e.g. how the three additional rookie quarterbacks performed in their first games), so I did not ignore anything.

Then you interject Paxton Lynch as a supportive example. Jones did not draft Lynch. He tried but failed. So, another argumentative deflection is trying to draft a first-round quarterback but not succeeding? That helps your argument in your opinion?

Okay.

I'm out.

 

[Blitzen]

LOL, it's exactly how the NFL works.

CJ Stroud was drafted by a terrible team.
He was great as a rookie anyways, won a playoff game, and was a Pro Bowler and Offensive Rookie of the Year.

I actually think the Texans were pretty decent the year before they drafted CJ (though they lost lots of games lol). They had several injuries and did need an upgrade at the QB position. But they gave several teams a tough time including our Cowboys that year. Tunsil is a very good LT, and they got a better coach and also grabbed a good edge defender-they already had some receiver weapons.

Bryce Young went to maybe the most dysfunctional team going right now. The draft capital they used was enormous (which may have helped a young QB) and then they traded their best offensive player too (that would have greatly assisted a young QB). Lots of these young QBs are just thrown to the wolves, and somehow folks try to condemn them as though it’s their fault they ended up on a crappy team. It’s more the teams drafting are completely terrible and continuously restarting that cause the QB issues-not the QB’s themselves. The ones that succeed typically have some really good pieces to build upon already in place or drafted at the same time.

Elite or very good lines of scrimmage still rule the day. Even medium talent QBs can look very good and even quasi elite behind very good offensive lines with some good/great playmakers. Purdy, Dak, Hurts, etc have all greatly benefited from teams that really prioritize the offensive line along with getting the QB some weapons. They also are on squads with a stable front office without huge recent turnover.