After this Mess of contract negotiation, will a team be willing to pay Dak?

[khiladi]

Please provide some detail how paying Dak 37 million over 4 years instead of 35 over 5 years is going to handcuff the Cowboys managing the Cap.

And if the effects and impacts on the team competitive status would be impacted more or less without Dak after next year .

His extension would have cost the Cowboys 16.8 million, but the new contract cost the Cowboys 11.5 million. The point is, neither Romo became the highest paid Qb in the league and his contract actually gave more room for the Cowboys to work with.

And unlike Dak, he was carrying a franchise on the back of a guy that was incompetent as a PC and didn’t know how to field and blend a RG in the overall offense.

 

[Diehardblues]

Bottom line, you extend a QB with the intent you can win a championship, right? Maybe some teams don't. As long as the QB brings them in money, who cares? It's a business, right? But to me it makes no sense to pay a QB to the point that you can't win a championship if that's your goal. I'm not saying you can't win with Dak. Just not with Dak at that price. The 49ers are a good example. They made it to the SB with a QB that doesn't blow anyone's hair back. But he's not taking up 20% of the cap.

I’m not sure winning a championship figures into it. I’d surely hope we are able to evaluate a QB talent level , ability and potential without attaching the teams success.

The problem is our organization has over hyped our QB. We might believe he’s a Bus Driver but that’s not how he’s been perceived to be. Ownership can’t tout our QB like one of the Elite in the league then try to back step come contract time.

And why my argument isn’t about what I think but analyzing how our organization has conducted and placed themselves in this position.

 

[Flamma]

I don’t go by everything I hear. Too much miss information is reported. Some of these clowns act like they’re sitting in on the negotiations.

You got that right. We really know very little. All we're doing here is arguing "as if" scenarios. Because they don't tell us anything but rumored reports.

 

[Flamma]

I’m not sure winning a championship figures into it. I’d surely hope we are able to evaluate a QB talent level , ability and potential without attaching the teams success.

Dude, I understand this perfectly clear. You don't need prior success to assume future success.

 

[Swagger]

I find it odd that a guy who has never been able to stay healthy enough to find out how he would end up as a playoff QB or MVP candidate gets credit with some for being a Super Bowl winning QB and MVP anyway. Durability is a key factor as well.

Wentz played in all 16 regular season games last season.

But we can agree to disagree on that point.

My point being people banging on about market value of QB contracts well let's look at comparable contracts since last year (figures are accurate to my knowledge feel free to correct I wouldn't be offended): -

Bridgewater $21 million 3 years
Tannehill $29.5 million. 4 year extension
Cousins $32 million 2 year extension so 3 years
Wentz $32 million 4 year extension so 5 years
Goff $33.5 million 4 year extension so 5 years
Wilson $35 million 4 years

If Prescott was offered circa $35 million a year with around $110 million guaranteed for 5 years with state tax benefits then I can only understand his reasoning for rejecting the offer is either that his sole concern is money or he's delusional as to his actual ability and views himself on the same level as Mahomes.

Wentz and Goff could have rejected and probably got more from a desperate team. But they like their set ups and accepted good deals.

Deshawn Watson is in a different situation to Prescott. The Texans haven't had a quality QB since...well Watson himself and he makes them a much better team. He is their franchise. Prescott simply isn't as important to the Cowboys as Watson is to the Texans.
Mahomes is on a different level to Prescott. No need to discuss further plus contract structured differently. Jackson's skill set is unique and he has completely transformed the Ravens' offence. Again not comparable to Prescott. The issue here is that I think Prescott does feel that he's a key cog to the Cowboys and without him they wouldn't be able to reach 8-8.

People bang on oh it was rejected because the length was 4 yrs not 5 yrs. Well Wentz and Goff have contracts that effectively elapse 5 years after signing their last contracts. Length of contract is still associated with money.

The front office made Prescott a very fair and reasonable offer if it's true that it was the amounts reported. I even think the offer was too much when compared with other recent contracts for Quarterbacks outside of Mahomes, Jackson and Watson.

So outside of at least reaching the NFC Championship game I just don't see the scenario of Prescott staying with the Cowboys beyond next season.

His conduct thus far has indicated that he wants as much as he can earn and will not be offered that at the Cowboys.

How he leaves will be interesting as we will want some picks for him but will have to trade him at the right time.

 

[OmerV]

Wentz played in all 16 regular season games last season.

But we can agree to disagree on that point.

My point being people banging on about market value of QB contracts well let's look at comparable contracts since last year (figures are accurate to my knowledge feel free to correct I wouldn't be offended): -

Bridgewater $21 million 3 years
Cousins $32 million 2 year extension so 3 years
Wentz $32 million 4 year extension so 5 years
Goff $33.5 million 4 year extension so 5 years
Wilson $35 million 4 years

If Prescott was offered circa $35 million a year with around $110 million guaranteed for 5 years with state tax benefits then I can only understand his reasoning for rejecting the offer is either that his sole concern is money or he's delusional as to his actual ability and views himself on the same level as Mahomes.

Wentz and Goff could have rejected and probably got more from a desperate team. But they like their set ups and accepted good deals.

Deshawn Watson is in a different situation to Prescott. The Texans haven't had a quality QB since...well Watson himself and he makes them a much better team. He is their franchise. Prescott simply isn't as important to the Cowboys as Watson is to the Texans.
Mahomes is on a different level to Prescott. No need to discuss further plus contract structured differently. Jackson's skill set is unique and he has completely transformed the Ravens' offence. Again not comparable to Prescott. The issue here is that I think Prescott does feel that he's a key cog to the Cowboys and without him they wouldn't be able to reach 8-8.

People bang on oh it was rejected because the length was 4 yrs not 5 yrs. Well Wentz and Goff have contracts that effectively elapse 5 years after signing their last contracts. Length of contract is still associated with money.

The front office made Prescott a very fair and reasonable offer if it's true that it was the amounts reported. I even think the offer was too much when compared with other recent contracts for Quarterbacks outside of Mahomes, Jackson and Watson.

So outside of at least reaching the NFC Championship game I just don't see the scenario of Prescott staying with the Cowboys beyond next season.

His conduct thus far has indicated that he wants as much as he can earn and will not be offered that at the Cowboys.

How he leaves will be interesting as we will want some picks for him but will have to trade him at the right time.

Yes, Wentz did make 16 games last year, and he neither won MVP or a playoff game. But you want to give him credit for MVP in a season he didn’t, and credit for winning a Super Bowl without playing in a single playoff game that season. I don’t see this helps your argument.

We are beating a dead horse here. Of course Dak is trying to maximize his earning potential, but teams don’t get breaks on what they have to pay because the state doesn’t have an income tax (of course some of the states a player plays in do, and he is subject to those taxes) nor do they get breaks on paying for a QB because they haven’t gone as long without a good QB as another team.

Time to just agree to disagree.

 

[Swagger]

Yes, Wentz did make 16 games last year, and he neither won MVP or a playoff game. But you want to give him credit for MVP in a season he didn’t, and credit for winning a Super Bowl without playing in a single playoff game that season. I don’t see this helps your argument.

We are beating a dead horse here. Of course Dak is trying to maximize his earning potential, but teams don’t get breaks on what they have to pay because the state doesn’t have an income tax, nor do they get breaks on paying for a QB because they haven’t gone as long without a good QB as another team.

Time to just agree to disagree.

In your previous post you were insinuating that Wentz has been unable to stay healthy long enough over a season to find out how he would end up as an MVP candidate. Well he just played 16 regular season games which is when players are clearly considered for MVP votes.

Again overall team record is crucial for a player in receiving MVP votes so Wentz was never in with a shot for MVP last season.

How did Prescott get on with MVP votes in 2016 after playing a full season with the Cowboys finishing 13-3?

 

[Swagger]

Yes, Wentz did make 16 games last year, and he neither won MVP or a playoff game. But you want to give him credit for MVP in a season he didn’t, and credit for winning a Super Bowl without playing in a single playoff game that season. I don’t see this helps your argument.

We are beating a dead horse here. Of course Dak is trying to maximize his earning potential, but teams don’t get breaks on what they have to pay because the state doesn’t have an income tax (of course some of the states a player plays in do, and he is subject to those taxes) nor do they get breaks on paying for a QB because they haven’t gone as long without a good QB as another team.

Time to just agree to disagree.

I'm not claiming that teams should get a break or let off for how much they offer a player due to those reasons. A player should actually have a brain and factor in those reasons himself. Prescott comes across as having his head screwed on yet wants top dollar on one of the most QB friendly offenses in the league on a franchise that will ensure long term prosperity by just being QB of the Dallas Cowboys over a long period of time.

It's not as if he was offered $28 million a year on a team friendly deal.

It's bizarre to me if he wants to make a few million more for a franchise that has far less chance of winning a SB than the current team he is on. Le'veon Bell springs to mind.

 

[OmerV]

In your previous post you were insinuating that Wentz has been unable to stay healthy long enough over a season to find out how he would end up as an MVP candidate. Well he just played 16 regular season games which is when players are clearly considered for MVP votes.

Again overall team record is crucial for a player in receiving MVP votes so Wentz was never in with a shot for MVP last season.

How did Prescott get on with MVP votes in 2016 after playing a full season with the Cowboys finishing 13-3?

Well, I was thinking about in a season he might actually be an MVP candidate, but if you are arguing that he stayed healthy enough last year to found out, and what he found was that he didn’t do well enough to be in the MVP pictture, that’s okay with me.

As for how Prescott did in the MVP voting, im not sure of the relevance since I never credited him with being a league MVP, nor did I say Wentz wouldn’t have been in the runniNg in 2017 had he not got hurt. The point I made was that being healthy and available factors into value when comparing to a player that often isn’t. But I looked it up anyway, and he got 1 vote. He did, however, get Rookie of the year, beating out Wentz, so there’s that if the individual awards are important to you.

Frankly I don’t think either Wentz or Dak has run away from the other with what they have accomplished.

 

[OmerV]

I'm not claiming that teams should get a break or let off for how much they offer a player due to those reasons. A player should actually have a brain and factor in those reasons himself. Prescott comes across as having his head screwed on yet wants top dollar on one of the most QB friendly offenses in the league on a franchise that will ensure long term prosperity by just being QB of the Dallas Cowboys over a long period of time.

It's not as if he was offered $28 million a year on a team friendly deal.

It's bizarre to me if he wants to make a few million more for a franchise that has far less chance of winning a SB than the current team he is on. Le'veon Bell springs to mind.

So, you aren’t saying things like state income tax and how long a team has gone without.a strong QB shouldn’t be a factor, yet you are using those things as part of your argument anyway? And now you are adding earning potential just for being a Dallas Cowboy to that list as well?

Bye the way,I never suggested the Cowboys offered Dak a terrible deal. I don’t actually have a problem with the Cowboys deciding a 5th year is important to them. I see points on both sides.

 

[GMO415]

That's 365 away. Who cares?

 

[Diehardblues]

Fans who aren’t sold Dak is an Elite or top 10 QB type are supportive of standing firm on the Cowboys offer.

They’d rather risk the effects and impact on the team of not having a QB until we can acquire and or develop another one.

 

[Diehardblues]

I'm not claiming that teams should get a break or let off for how much they offer a player due to those reasons. A player should actually have a brain and factor in those reasons himself. Prescott comes across as having his head screwed on yet wants top dollar on one of the most QB friendly offenses in the league on a franchise that will ensure long term prosperity by just being QB of the Dallas Cowboys over a long period of time.

It's not as if he was offered $28 million a year on a team friendly deal.

It's bizarre to me if he wants to make a few million more for a franchise that has far less chance of winning a SB than the current team he is on. Le'veon Bell springs to mind.

Fans place winning at a much higher priority than the players . Most players never win a SB.

Id take more money on a lesser team everyday. Much like we’d move away from home for a job that pays more.

Most players only have a few years to make it. Their careers could end on the next snap. Winning a championship while everyone’s ultimate goal is just gravy.

Much like at the College level everyone knows not all teams have a legit opportunity to win a championship but they play for the spirit of competition to get an education and possibly an opportunity to go pros.

Fans attach winning a championship is everything. It’s not.

 

[Diehardblues]

So, you aren’t saying things like state income tax and how long a team has gone without.a strong QB shouldn’t be a factor, yet you are using those things as part of your argument anyway? And now you are adding earning potential just for being a Dallas Cowboy to that list as well?

Bye the way,I never suggested the Cowboys offered Dak a terrible deal. I don’t actually have a problem with the Cowboys deciding a 5th year is important to them. I see points on both sides.

Yep

I’d actually think playing for the Cowboys this era is a negative. More media exposure, crappy organization and dysfunctional owner.

 

[Wood]

After this mess of a contract negotiation, will there be a team who is willing to pay Dak? Any team will now know that Dak will be intent on raking them through the coals and will be completely unwilling to even negotiate. This has been a bad faith ordeal by Francis from the start.

very hard to predict because we don't know Corona impact this year (how much it pulls Salary Cap down in '21 & '22) and we don't know what kind of year Dak has. If Dallas doesn't get into playoffs again then I think Dak has hard time getting contract he wants. So many unknowns.

 

[kskboys]

Fans place winning at a much higher priority than the players . Most players never win a SB.

Id take more money on a lesser team everyday. Much like we’d move away from home for a job that pays more.

Most players only have a few years to make it. Their careers could end on the next snap. Winning a championship while everyone’s ultimate goal is just gravy.

Much like at the College level everyone knows not all teams have a legit opportunity to win a championship but they play for the spirit of competition to get an education and possibly an opportunity to go pros.

Fans attach winning a championship is everything. It’s not.

Define more money.

I'd take 30 mil w/ a super bowl win over 35 and no playoffs any day.

 

[Diehardblues]

Define more money.

I'd take 30 mil w/ a super bowl win over 35 and no playoffs any day.

I understand but not most players. And why they usually leave for more money.

I think fans place more priority with winning than players do.

Also remember there’s no guarantees we win a Super Bowl if he stays.

5 million times 4 or 5 years is 20-25 million. I think I’d leave for that. That’s a lot of moola.

And who knows the team he goes to could end up going to a Super Bowl.

 

[Diehardblues]

There’s over 1700 players in the NFL. Most of them will never sniff a Super Bowl.

Fans place so much importance in winning a Super Bowl and while its the ultimate goal most of the league goes thru the grind every year knowing most will not meet expectations.

In the end it’s all about making money and securing you and your family. The average career is now only about 4 years. And you never know when your last play will be. Even the greater and longer lasting veterans eventually will be shunned before most are ready for a younger and cheaper replacement.

There’s really very little loyalty anymore by the players to their franchises and who could blame them. The owners will cut them loose without any loyalty. Fans bash them at every turn if the team comes up short.

In the end the NFL is a Sports Entertainment business at the highest level. Make it while you can cause the league will go on making it long after you’re gone treating you like commodity that’s no longer viable.

 

[kskboys]

I understand but not most players. And why they usually leave for more money.

I think fans place more priority with winning than players do.

Also remember there’s no guarantees we win a Super Bowl if he stays.

5 million times 4 or 5 years is 20-25 million. I think I’d leave for that. That’s a lot of moola.

And who knows the team he goes to could end up going to a Super Bowl.

No way. If you make 30 mil for 5 years, you'll have all you ever need, even after taxes.

 

[Diehardblues]

No way. If you make 30 mil for 5 years, you'll have all you ever need, even after taxes.

If the guy down the road is going to pay you 25-30 million more over 4 or 5 years, that’s where you go.

Since when is “ all you need “ a measurement in professional sports “. Or any profession.

We have to stop thinking from a fans perspective with the envy of money they make.