News: All Seven Rounds Of Dallas Cowboys 2016 Draft Board Rankings Possibly Revealed

[silver]

the problem with a guy like Hitchens is that he appeared to regress or at least stall out last year instead of progressing.....in baseball they call it the sophomore slump but it has more to do with strenuous schedule and the pitchers getting a book on you.......in football it should be the opposite....the game slows down and you get stronger....

This is a huge year for Hitch

In his defense, he was dealing with a high ankle sprain IIRC.

 

[wileedog]

Two college interceptions with lots of drops versus an amazing career at Ohio State.

Which is riskier?

The point is Ramsey is potentially a huge improvement over any of Church/Carr/Mo.

McFadden was the 4th leading rusher last year behind this line even after not starting half of season. And he is extremely easy to improve upon with a combo of a 2nd day draft pick or FA.

Was any of Church/Carr/Mo considered among the top 5 in productivity at their position last year? Or even in the same universe of that production?

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

Two college interceptions with lots of drops versus an amazing career at Ohio State.

Which is riskier?

C'mon mayne, judging cornerbacks by INT totals is about the worst way to gauge ability.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

Two college interceptions with lots of drops versus an amazing career at Ohio State.

Which is riskier?

The RB. Because of the average longevity of the position and the wealth of talent that can be found later in the draft.

Ramsey was the first true freshman to start at FSU in 30 years in 2013. He was also an All-American and All-ACC in both 2014 and 2015. He won a national championship and also made the college football playoffs. What exactly about Ramsey's career wasn't "amazing?" When you have to resort to silly hyperbole to try and prove a point...you're not helping yourself.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

Yet your pet safety with a bumb knee was gonna come in and dominate.

I have never said that.

He also did not have a "bump" knee when the draft happened.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

It's strikingly crazy to me that someone can make the claim that "great" cornerbacks can be found in the late rounds and then turn around and advocate taking RB 4th overall, as if there was any other position in football that it's been proven repeatedly and historically that you can quality players in the late rounds and even off the streets.

It's incredible. I mean literally flying in the face of history.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

Stupidity is making the same mistake over and over.

This team cannot develop defensive players ....... they develop Offensive players well.

Stupidity is also wanting to take a Safety with the 4th pick of the draft even before his knee surgery.

This is silly.

 

[zrinkill]

This is silly.

My exact thought every time you mention Zeke.

 

[Denim Chicken]

C'mon mayne, judging cornerbacks by INT totals is about the worst way to gauge ability.

The average passer rating of opposing quarterbacks when they target Ramsey is 39.9. To compare, the worst team passer rating in the country is Georgia Sothern’s average of 65.73.

The average completion percentage of passes toward Ramsey is 30.7 and he’s allowing 2.9 yards per target.

Those numbers are stellar, but would be even more impressive if a 25-yard completion against Texas State didn’t occur. Ramsey diagnosed the play as a run when he saw a lineman downfield and was burnt on a long pass.

“I don’t like many excuses or anything, but it was a run,” Ramsey said. “There were linemen downfield, the quarterback pulled the ball…and I read run. It should’ve been a penalty but it wasn’t.”

If that play was negated, Ramsey would be surrendering just 1.25 yards per passing attempt and opponents would have a passer rating of 18.83 when targeting him.

 

[Plankton]

For those who care about these things, for comparison sake to where you can find elite players in the draft, here's how it shakes out for cornerbacks in the Hall of Fame:

There are currently 17 players in the Hall of Fame that played cornerback (the position was not created until the early 1940's by Earle "Greasy" Neale, when he created the defensive halfback position in his Eagle defense). Here's where they were drafted (NOTE: this shows Mel Renfro, Ronnie Lott, Rod Woodson and Aeneas Williams as cornerbacks):

• 8 were selected in the First Round of the draft - 47% of the total
• 2 were selected in the Second Round of the draft
• 2 were selected in the Third Round of the draft
• 1 was selected in the Fifth Round of the draft
• 4 were Undrafted Free Agents

Here's how the safety position is represented in the Hall of Fame:

There are currently 7 safeties in the Hall of Fame (grossly underrepresented, IMHO). Here's where they were drafted:

• 1 was selected in the Second Round of the draft
• 1 was selected in the Third Round of the draft
• 1 was selected in the Sixth Round of the draft
• 1 was selected in the Seventh Round of the draft
• 1 was selected in the Ninth Round of the draft
• 2 were Undrafted Free Agents

Using this as a barometer, if you want an elite corner, you generally will find them in the First Round. If you want an elite safety, you can literally find them anywhere, and don't need to use a First Round pick to do it.

If you view Jalen Ramsey as being a cornerback, and a potentially elite one, the numbers bear out selecting him high. The percentage of running backs in the HOF selected in the First Round is higher, though (55%-47%).

If you view him as a safety, and a potentially elite one, history doesn't bear this out.

 

[erod]

The RB. Because of the average longevity of the position and the wealth of talent that can be found later in the draft.

Ramsey was the first true freshman to start at FSU in 30 years in 2013. He was also an All-American and All-ACC in both 2014 and 2015. He won a national championship and also made the college football playoffs. What exactly about Ramsey's career wasn't "amazing?" When you have to resort to silly hyperbole to try and prove a point...you're not helping yourself.

And yet nobody knows if he's a corner or safety.

Speaking of longevity....Eugene Monroe. Calvin Johnson. Chris Borland.

I think the 12-year pro will become a thing of the past. Players are looking to get in, make some money, and get out when they have to start settling for the "veteran" contracts.

 

[erod]

C'mon mayne, judging cornerbacks by INT totals is about the worst way to gauge ability.

I agree. And judging Elliott based on "other" running backs without half his versatility is not a good way to gauge him either.

 

[erod]

It's strikingly crazy to me that someone can make the claim that "great" cornerbacks can be found in the late rounds and then turn around and advocate taking RB 4th overall, as if there was any other position in football that it's been proven repeatedly and historically that you can quality players in the late rounds and even off the streets.

Which was basically my point, which was a retort to another post.

It's dumb to draft positions specifically by round, other than QB. You take the most impactful player on the board early. Period.

A lot of corners bust in the first round. A lot of running backs don't live up to their billing. There is no proven method in that regard.

Elliott is the most complete running back to come out since Adrian Peterson. Runs inside, runs outside, speed and power, great receiver, tremendous pass protector, lead blocker on Buckeye sweeps, almost never fumbled, solid citizen......you take that guy and pair him with this offensive line and never look back.

Ramsey would have been just another corner here wishing for a pass rush.

 

[slick325]

For those who care about these things, for comparison sake to where you can find elite players in the draft, here's how it shakes out for cornerbacks in the Hall of Fame:

There are currently 17 players in the Hall of Fame that played cornerback (the position was not created until the early 1940's by Earle "Greasy" Neale, when he created the defensive halfback position in his Eagle defense). Here's where they were drafted (NOTE: this shows Mel Renfro, Ronnie Lott, Rod Woodson and Aeneas Williams as cornerbacks):

• 8 were selected in the First Round of the draft - 47% of the total
• 2 were selected in the Second Round of the draft
• 2 were selected in the Third Round of the draft
• 1 was selected in the Fifth Round of the draft
• 4 were Undrafted Free Agents

Here's how the safety position is represented in the Hall of Fame:

There are currently 7 safeties in the Hall of Fame (grossly underrepresented, IMHO). Here's where they were drafted:

• 1 was selected in the Second Round of the draft
• 1 was selected in the Third Round of the draft
• 1 was selected in the Sixth Round of the draft
• 1 was selected in the Seventh Round of the draft
• 1 was selected in the Ninth Round of the draft
• 2 were Undrafted Free Agents

Using this as a barometer, if you want an elite corner, you generally will find them in the First Round. If you want an elite safety, you can literally find them anywhere, and don't need to use a First Round pick to do it.

If you view Jalen Ramsey as being a cornerback, and a potentially elite one, the numbers bear out selecting him high. The percentage of running backs in the HOF selected in the First Round is higher, though (55%-47%).

If you view him as a safety, and a potentially elite one, history doesn't bear this out.

Thanks for this breakdown Plankton. The numbers for 1st round safeties will increase by two once Ed Reed and Troy P are inducted. Interesting topic.

Regarding having to find a CB early if you want to increase your chances of getting a good one or potential Hall of Famer, months back I did something similar to show where Hall of Fame running backs were drafted. It is even more apparent that a great back should be taken early once you take a look at the list of Hall of Fame RB's.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

And yet nobody knows if he's a corner or safety.

Scouts think he can be elite at either or. How horrible. The previous was sarcasm.

Speaking of longevity....Eugene Monroe. Calvin Johnson. Chris Borland.

If Zeke lasts as long as Monroe or Johnson he will have meaningfully beaten average running back expectation.

I think the 12-year pro will become a thing of the past. Players are looking to get in, make some money, and get out when they have to start settling for the "veteran" contracts.

Of course you think it's a thing of the past. That's the only way you can justify your staunch support of wasteful resource allocation.

 

[erod]

Of course you think it's a thing of the past. That's the only way you can justify your staunch support of wasteful resource allocation.

Elite running backs play a long, long time if they want to. There's nothing wasteful about it.

 

[Sydla]

And yet nobody knows if he's a corner or safety.

Speaking of longevity....Eugene Monroe. Calvin Johnson. Chris Borland.

I think the 12-year pro will become a thing of the past. Players are looking to get in, make some money, and get out when they have to start settling for the "veteran" contracts.

You are the king of exaggeration.

Teams know where they were going to play him. Dallas wanted him as a CB. Jags immediately put him at CB.

 

[erod]

You are the king of exaggeration.

Teams know where they were going to play him. Dallas wanted him as a CB. Jags immediately put him at CB.

Corners are very iffy when it comes to transitioning to the NFL. They mostly cover nobodies in college. Easy covers. Then, the NFL brings a tough cover most every week. That's why so many corners bust in the NFL.

Besides, elite corner in the NFL are still reliant on a pass rush, unlike college.

We'll see, but I'll bet he's nothing more than another Terrance Newman, who was the 5th pick in the draft.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

Elite running backs play a long, long time if they want to. There's nothing wasteful about it.

Very few are worth it through their 2nd contracts.

Zeke has to not just be great but special to justify his draft selection. That's the problem. When your draft pick has to be special or you messed up...that's what we call a terrible risk/reward profile.

 

[erod]

Very few are worth it through their 2nd contracts.

Zeke has to not just be great but special to justify his draft selection. That's the problem. When your draft pick has to be special or you messed up...that's what we call a terrible risk/reward profile.

I put it at 85 percent that he'll be a top 3 back in football instantly. Very little risk.

Ramsey will be special in 3-4 years.

It's time to win now.