Are fans ready to accept the Micah trade devasted our defense?

[gimmesix]

He drafted excellent DL
Canty, Hatcher, Ratliff; even spears was better then what we have now

Some of it may have been his 3-4 system, but they played well for Phillips, too, and Canty, Hatcher and UDFA Stephen Bowen were decent elsewhere. Of course, Maliek Collins is now decent elsewhere, but players like Trysten Hill were a complete swing and a miss.

 

[kskboys]

Yea, trading Micah wasn’t in the plans or intention. But all of these fans are supporting it. Doesn’t make sense.

Fans are supporting it mostly due to the massive salary we'd have had to pay him.

 

[Kwyn]

And got himself away from Jerry’s carnival show.

This and the two picks are the only positive out of the whole debacle

 

[pansophy]

Maybe Parsons would have been worth every penny if he ever got a holding call. That appears to have carried over to the Packers. https://bleacherreport.com/articles...s-out-nfl-refs-after-5-years-not-getting-call

 

[coult44]

I did t say “ much” better but possibly enough to win a couple more games .

And moving forward a key piece to build around .

If we’re in a total rebuild why resign Dak. It’s going to waste his final years.

We actually agree on all of that.

 

[Diehardblues]

Fans are supporting it mostly due to the massive salary we'd have had to pay him.

I understand but these huge contracts for our most talented players are often over dramatized in media.

After a huge signing bonus( 44 million) his cap hits this year about 9 million , 19 in 2026, then 26 in 2027. Like most of these big deals the weight is on back end of deal and why they are usually restructured, renegotiated or simply walk in FA.

But it’s very rare for a talent of his level not to be resigned after Rookie contract . It’s more common a departure after 2nd contract due to Cap casualty or underperformance.

But this departure didn’t have anything to do with performance , Cap hit or casualty. We had every intention and intent to make him one of if not highest paid defensive players . And the fact we received 2 1st rounders in 11th hour a week before season begun punctuated how Elite talent he is.

The difference to 41 which we initially were alleged offered and 47 which he signed for is very minimal over 4 years and signing bonus which allows teams to minimize impacts to yearly Cap hits. Not including fact the Cap goes up about 10% each year.

We’ll see how this shakes out and our use of these picks but the effects and impacts this season are already being noted. The lingering effects moving forward TBD.

Fans have taken it upon themselves to declare the failed contract negotiations as some sort of indication we are now in rebuild mode which I’ve maintained throughout this deal I would have supported if that was our intent going in early on in offseason. And as you’ve suggested we could have traded others or moved on as well since they probably wouldn’t be around anyway once total rebuild is complete.

So, if Jethro is still All In that this team he sees as a contender with Dak and offense he invested heavily in and uses our resources as such then it certainly would seem logical to have resigned Parsons and continued to attempt to add pieces around him.

I’m basing my thoughts on what our owner is actually doing and saying not what we hope he’s going to do or what we think needs to be done. And I don’t expect a rebuild of any sorts as most fans think we need until Dak is done.

 

[Diehardblues]

Beyond all of this what really gets me is we finally hit the jackpot on a generational defensive player after years of busting on DL 1st round picks like Mazi, Taco and early round picks like Tristen. The list goes on.

While most critics agreed Micah was worthy of a huge league leading type deal we get pushback from fans for various reasons . I guess I shouldn’t be so surprised anymore.

We actually have the offense that can contend on some levels but now will need some kind of retooling or reload of our defense which depending on how well these Bozos draft could linger on wasting this offense we have amassed.

My hunch is maybe by the time we hit on some more DL and or develop a better defense it will be time to draft or find another franchise QB and start all over there again.

Just when we’d finally hit and looked like we’d also hit on a LB with Overshown as well with 2 CB we just recently signed to long term deals as well. Now we have let go our cornerstone on defense and watching it crumble down . Amazing how an Elite talent mask other weaknesses and with double and triple teams enables others to make more plays and impact.

What we should have done is resigned Micah last year and then pursued in FA more support on defense. But part of the problem is all too often we aren’t out in front of these higher talented players contract.

Our local media and fans have continued to rip our dysfunctional ownership for such and this influences my thoughts as well. And there have been many fans here who are aligned. But I guess I shouldn’t be so surprised there’s resistance from this forum as I’ve been met with it for years with my continued criticism of our owner.

This failed contract negotiation is being considered our owners most tainted effort in recent years if not in his entire era. But yet we still have fans claiming or supporting the 11th hour bailout trade was good for the Cowboys mostly because they believe it indicates a concession by our owner a rebuild is in motion. Or he finally got tough on a contract. Lol

 

[dfense]

Parsons is 40th in sacks even though he's not playing full time. Maliek Collins has more sacks. Micah is on pace for 8 sacks this season. Does that sound like a 35 million a year investment?

 

[kskboys]

I understand but these huge contracts for our most talented players are often over dramatized in media.

After a huge signing bonus( 44 million) his cap hits this year about 9 million , 19 in 2026, then 26 in 2027. Like most of these big deals the weight is on back end of deal and why they are usually restructured, renegotiated or simply walk in FA.

But it’s very rare for a talent of his level not to be resigned after Rookie contract . It’s more common a departure after 2nd contract due to Cap casualty or underperformance.

But this departure didn’t have anything to do with performance , Cap hit or casualty. We had every intention and intent to make him one of if not highest paid defensive players . And the fact we received 2 1st rounders in 11th hour a week before season begun punctuated how Elite talent he is.

The difference to 41 which we initially were alleged offered and 47 which he signed for is very minimal over 4 years and signing bonus which allows teams to minimize impacts to yearly Cap hits. Not including fact the Cap goes up about 10% each year.

We’ll see how this shakes out and our use of these picks but the effects and impacts this season are already being noted. The lingering effects moving forward TBD.

Fans have taken it upon themselves to declare the failed contract negotiations as some sort of indication we are now in rebuild mode which I’ve maintained throughout this deal I would have supported if that was our intent going in early on in offseason. And as you’ve suggested we could have traded others or moved on as well since they probably wouldn’t be around anyway once total rebuild is complete.

So, if Jethro is still All In that this team he sees as a contender with Dak and offense he invested heavily in and uses our resources as such then it certainly would seem logical to have resigned Parsons and continued to attempt to add pieces around him.

I’m basing my thoughts on what our owner is actually doing and saying not what we hope he’s going to do or what we think needs to be done. And I don’t expect a rebuild of any sorts as most fans think we need until Dak is done.

Parsons = Robert Quinn. One dimensional pass rusher. Yes, that dimension is phenomenal, but still not worth 47 mil.

Everyone keeps screwing w/ the contracts numbers, when all that matters is the average. Paying a one dimensional pass rusher a very high salary is the type of move that has kept us mostly mediocre.

 

[kskboys]

Beyond all of this what really gets me is we finally hit the jackpot on a generational defensive player after years of busting on DL 1st round picks like Mazi, Taco and early round picks like Tristen. The list goes on.

While most critics agreed Micah was worthy of a huge league leading type deal we get pushback from fans for various reasons . I guess I shouldn’t be so surprised anymore.

We actually have the offense that can contend on some levels but now will need some kind of retooling or reload of our defense which depending on how well these Bozos draft could linger on wasting this offense we have amassed.

My hunch is maybe by the time we hit on some more DL and or develop a better defense it will be time to draft or find another franchise QB and start all over there again.

Just when we’d finally hit and looked like we’d also hit on a LB with Overshown as well with 2 CB we just recently signed to long term deals as well. Now we have let go our cornerstone on defense and watching it crumble down . Amazing how an Elite talent mask other weaknesses and with double and triple teams enables others to make more plays and impact.

What we should have done is resigned Micah last year and then pursued in FA more support on defense. But part of the problem is all too often we aren’t out in front of these higher talented players contract.

Our local media and fans have continued to rip our dysfunctional ownership for such and this influences my thoughts as well. And there have been many fans here who are aligned. But I guess I shouldn’t be so surprised there’s resistance from this forum as I’ve been met with it for years with my continued criticism of our owner.

This failed contract negotiation is being considered our owners most tainted effort in recent years if not in his entire era. But yet we still have fans claiming or supporting the 11th hour bailout trade was good for the Cowboys mostly because they believe it indicates a concession by our owner a rebuild is in motion. Or he finally got tough on a contract. Lol

Or played him at LB where he belongs.

We created a mess putting him at DE. Colossal mistake.

 

[Creeper]

You can't have one playmaker on defense and expect him to make the entire defense good. Teams took Micah away from the Cowboys defense by double and triple teaming him. What they were telling us if no one else is good enough to stop them. Defenses need a few good players. It is a team effort.

What the Cowboys should have done, and they had the opportunity to do it, is to add good players to play along side Micah Parsons. Instead Jerry allowed the talent to leave and left Micah virtually alone on defense.

Maybe the should have tried to keep Armstrong and Lewis? Maybe in 2024 when there were a bunch of top DTs available, Jerry could have attempted to sign one. Maybe In the 2025 draft, which was loaded with DTs, he should have taken one instead of an offensive Guard.

Instead Jerry made it seem like we could only have Micah and no one else, or 5 or 6 players but not Micah. Why does anyone continue to buy Jerry's horse manure?

 

[thunderpimp91]

Parsons is 40th in sacks even though he's not playing full time. Maliek Collins has more sacks. Micah is on pace for 8 sacks this season. Does that sound like a 35 million a year investment?

Yes, sacks are probably the most misleading number when evaluating pass rushers individually. Sacks are largely a team stat. Give a quality pass rusher an above average secondary and he will rack up more sacks than one that can't cover 3+ seconds. Give a quality pass rusher another player on the DL that can demand double teams and youll see more sacks. Teams that blitz more typically rack up more sacks. Green Bay is 2nd in the league giving up just 4.8 yards per pass play so high sack totals or not their pass defense has been fantastic this year, and this is despite getting destroyed in Dallas a few weeks ago. They're also bottom 5 in blitz percentage so they're mostly playing coverage and letting Parsons/Gary generate pressure without much manufacturing it. Maliek Collins gets to line up next to Myles Garrett and get a lot of known 1v1 situations.

 

[thunderpimp91]

Everyone keeps screwing w/ the contracts numbers, when all that matters is the average. Paying a one dimensional pass rusher a very high salary is the type of move that has kept us mostly mediocre.

I have no issues moving on from Parsons, but disagree on the bolded part here. Contract average is probably the least important number of any multi year deal. For example Diggs got a pretty high average, but the low guaranteed money makes his deal mostly a non factor as we can get out of it at any time. Mahomes got top of the market money when he signed, but that $45m is a bargain due to the length of his contract. For Micah the AAV is largely for show as his guaranteed money per year is right in line with the other top guys at the position. Its almost a given that he wont see the final year of that deal in 2029 as they'll either cut him for next to nothing or reach another extension. By that time comes his average cash per year should be around $40M, his cap number in the 20s or low 30s average depending on if they cut or extend him. Him seeing the $47m number by either cash or cap hit is about a 1% scenario.

 

[gtb1943]

Yes, sacks are probably the most misleading number when evaluating pass rushers individually. Sacks are largely a team stat. Give a quality pass rusher an above average secondary and he will rack up more sacks than one that can't cover 3+ seconds. Give a quality pass rusher another player on the DL that can demand double teams and youll see more sacks. Teams that blitz more typically rack up more sacks. Green Bay is 2nd in the league giving up just 4.8 yards per pass play so high sack totals or not their pass defense has been fantastic this year, and this is despite getting destroyed in Dallas a few weeks ago. They're also bottom 5 in blitz percentage so they're mostly playing coverage and letting Parsons/Gary generate pressure without much manufacturing it. Maliek Collins gets to line up next to Myles Garrett and get a lot of known 1v1 situations.

BS.

 

[Diehardblues]

Parsons = Robert Quinn. One dimensional pass rusher. Yes, that dimension is phenomenal, but still not worth 47 mil.

Everyone keeps screwing w/ the contracts numbers, when all that matters is the average. Paying a one dimensional pass rusher a very high salary is the type of move that has kept us mostly mediocre.

Other teams have managed to pay their edge rushers and remain a contender and strong defense.

I’d argue our other draft bust, misses , under achievers and poor judgement of priorities have hurt us more but I hear ya.
Appreciate your input which I always respect. Thanks

 

[Chocolate Lab]

This failed contract negotiation is being considered our owners most tainted effort in recent years if not in his entire era.

Come on, man. It's not even close to his most "tainted effort" in his entire era. There's Jimmy, there's a decade of Garrett, there are a lot of other things.

 

[Diehardblues]

I have no issues moving on from Parsons, but disagree on the bolded part here. Contract average is probably the least important number of any multi year deal. For example Diggs got a pretty high average, but the low guaranteed money makes his deal mostly a non factor as we can get out of it at any time. Mahomes got top of the market money when he signed, but that $45m is a bargain due to the length of his contract. For Micah the AAV is largely for show as his guaranteed money per year is right in line with the other top guys at the position. It’s almost a given that he wont see the final year of that deal in 2029 as they'll either cut him for next to nothing or reach another extension. By that time comes his average cash per year should be around $40M, his cap number in the 20s or low 30s average depending on if they cut or extend him. Him seeing the $47m number by either cash or cap hit is about a 1% scenario.

I agree. The average isn’t as meaningful but more of what the media publicizes. The individual Cap hits each season is what most critical.

 

[Diehardblues]

Come on, man. It's not even close to his most "tainted effort" in his entire era. There's Jimmy, there's a decade of Garrett, there are a lot of other things.

I was referring to player negotiations not coaches. Sorry I didn’t make that clear.

 

[Diehardblues]

Parsons = Robert Quinn. One dimensional pass rusher. Yes, that dimension is phenomenal, but still not worth 47 mil.

Everyone keeps screwing w/ the contracts numbers, when all that matters is the average. Paying a one dimensional pass rusher a very high salary is the type of move that has kept us mostly mediocre.

When you look at actual Cap hits do you think he’s worth the 9 million this year and 19 and 26 the next 2 years?

Aren’t those the numbers we should be discussing. The 47 is very misleading since signing bonus and end of contract covers most of that.

His final season of 4 year deal is 42 but Salary Cap will have increased about 10% each season by then and that’s when most teams look at the guaranteed portion and if can’t renegotiate or restructure often look to release or trade then after second contract.

 

[tm1119]

Two things can be true:
1. Micah (or any 1 player) isn’t going to turn this D around.
2. We are much worse off in terms of building a good defense in the near future without Micah.

And a 3rd truth: The big, bad Cap Monster isn’t actually coming to get the Cowboys. We just have an inept front office