Attention all those that hate our draft!

[Marktui]

I am no draft expert, the things I see on these players are from Draft Boards, youtube and this forum.

I have no problem with this draft. Looks like we picked up players that are athletic and love to play football.

I will leave it to the guys who do this for a living and work at it 11 months of the year. We got some good players last year, so looks like the scouting department knows what they are doing. Let's cut them some slack...

 

[GimmeTheBall!]

The outpouring of optimism for our draft is heart-rending. Makes me proud to be around such true Cowboy fans.

But the fact remains -- and whistle past the cemetery if you must -- this draft was, at best, a C. Personally, a C-.

Later picks. Idiotic priorities such as QB and a WR? A WR in the later rounds? You looking for a Rice?

McGee? Mr. Roboto who is not known for his agility?

Not their fault that Jerra sold the franchise for a wild grab at Roy Williams. Now Jerra pays for it with surrendering higher draft picks. The reality is, a bad draft this weekend. And time will prove this.

Just a dissenting view. Nothing personal, fellow inmates, i love the Cowboys but believe the team has missed a chance to beef it up for a SB run.

With this draft, and with Wade as HC, things sure look dismal for this die-hard fan.

 

[dcfanatic]

I disagree I only thing this draft was weak at RB and DB. The only reason for that is because they didn't put up the combine numbers people put up before that. Which is what they were expecting. I pretty sure if some of the big name RB ran 4.3 or 4.4 40's a the combine their wouldn't be a lack of talent. People keep saying there's a lack of talent but outside of RB and DB which weren't weak IMO it's just they didn't put the numbers in the combine that were expected. So outside of RB and DB where was the lack of talent in this daft? I want to hear this....

QB. DT. Safety. MLB. CB.

Most experts including everyone's favorite around here Goose Gosselin said this was a weak draft...

Goose on GAC

You wanted to hear it. The man said worst in 18 years!!!

Are you happy now that you heard it? lol.

Now do you think more people are going to take your word or his?

 

[MarionBarberThe4th]

I would of done the deal that was made right after us. #172 for a 7th and 2010 4th rounder. We could of done that and came away w/ the same group.

And if Unger, Jaron Gilbert and Igleasis were our guys, it would of been worth small trade ups.

 

[Clove]

My point is...perhaps this organization is begining to realize that this is NOT Hollywood and the Cowboys are NOT a reality show. We need to get BACK to playing football. Notice how Tank Johnson JUST found a home. How Pac Man has NOT found a home. How TO had to go to Buffalo to find a home. I guess we were NOT the only team that decided that these guys are not needed to win games.

We need to get back to playing sound defense. Being a physical running team. And making field poistion a priority on special teams. This is HOW you win in December in the playoffs. There is nothing new come December. Everyone has film on everyone. Legs are tired. Bodies are banged up. The toughest teams. The most disciplined teams. The teams that make the other teams fight for every yard by not giving a way field position with TERRIBLE special teams play. That is what seperates the good teams from the teams that are playing in the confererence championship games and Super Bowl. You cannot go into games in December with plans to throw the ball 40 times. But you do that when you have to keep a TO happy. Would TO be with you in the 4th quarter of the Super Bowl like Larry Fitzgerald was...after being ignored for the 1st 3 quarters? There is NO way TO would show the poise and professionalism Fitzgerald showed in the Super Bowl. You cannot win with him...and cleary many other teams felt the same way.

I wasn't going to respond in this post or about TO but since you so nicely brought it up, I'll take it from here.

You whine about this is how you win football games, yada yada yada, but you failed to remember we won 13 games a couple years back with the same cast of characters.

So, if you won that many games with the same staff of clowns, how did you then not make the play offs the next season? COACHING COACHING COACHING and bad QB play.

As soon as we get this thru our heads, the happier we'll be. Unfortunately, we still have the same inept coaching staff that couldn't respond to creative ways to shut down our offense, they're not going to wake up all of a sudden and figure it out.

You can bring in an all star team, as long as we have jokers in the coaching staff and as our leader, we will continue to cry about chemistry, divas, and all the other crap that has nothing to do with ON THE FIELD PLAY.

 

[Beast_from_East]

That doesn't make sense. There are more choices available with the 11th pick than there is with the 25th pick of the same round . The odds are that the Patriots weren't the only team Tennessee called to trade up.

Had the Cowboys chosen to, they could have gotten a 2nd round pick in 2010 for that choice.

The Titans were not trading up for the hell of it dude, they were trading up to leap frog some teams that were fixing to take their player, the TE that Mortenson said reminded him of Shannon Sharpe.

The Pats just lucked out that their pick was ahead of a couple of teams that were interested in that same TE, that is why the Titans had to jump in front and offered the Pats a sweet deal to do it.

This is how trades are done, you just dont decide "what the hell, I am going to trade my 3rd rounder here for a 2nd rounder next year" and pick up the phone and start calling. It doesnt work that way, you have to have a team below you that wants to move into your spot. That is how we got picks when Brady Quinn started dropping and Cleveland knew that the Chiefs who picked behind us were going to take him so they called us up and offered up their 1st the next year.

We didnt decide to trade for Clevland's 1st, the situation is what allowed us to do it not the fact we just wanted to do it for the hell of it.



So if nobody wanted to move into our slot in the 3rd, how you going to force a team to give up a 2nd next year?????

 

[AdamJT13]

I looked at a few positions and Walter, whoever he is, seems to be about 70% accurate in the first 6 rounds - as far as predicting what rounds players would be chosen in.

As far as teams, I looked at the Pats and I think that 8-9 players were picked at par or superior to his predictions (so, only 25%-30% reaches), and the Steelers had only 2 reaches (one round down) for 22%, whereas we had roughly 50% reaches and many big, big reaches for or most valuable picks (2-4 round reaches).

Walter Football's top-100 list finished 43rd out of the 52 top-100 lists tracked by The Huddle Report.

But hey, if you think Walter Football knows more than Rick Gosselin (who was No. 1 this year and almost every other year) or Gil Brandt (No. 2 last year, No. 18 this year), more power to you.

 

[Beast_from_East]

Walter Football's top-100 list finished 43rd out of the 52 top-100 lists tracked by The Huddle Report.

But hey, if you think Walter Football knows more than Rick Gosselin (who was No. 1 this year and almost every other year) or Gil Brandt (No. 2 last year, No. 18 this year), more power to you.

Adam with some major ownage here, right between the eyes.:laugh2:

 

[Doomsay]

Walter Football's top-100 list finished 43rd out of the 52 top-100 lists tracked by The Huddle Report.

But hey, if you think Walter Football knows more than Rick Gosselin (who was No. 1 this year and almost every other year) or Gil Brandt (No. 2 last year, No. 18 this year), more power to you.

Nice try, didn't say anything of the kind, try reading the post rather than going to auto-gotcha mode. Somebody else referenced the site in relationship to suggested rounds for player signings. I looked at the suggested rounds in the site and used empirical evidence to see where they players were actually chosen. The guy had roughly a 70% accuracy in the first 6 rounds - as pointed out above. The Steelers and NE chose players in a 75-80% correlation with his per-round suggestions, we were at roughly 50% - that pretty much summarizes it.

 

[Doomsay]

Adam with some major ownage here, right between the eyes.:laugh2:

Or not, as is the case.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Nice try, didn't say anything of the kind, try reading the post rather than going to auto-gotcha mode. Somebody else referenced the site in relationship to suggested rounds for player signings. I looked at the suggested rounds in the site and used empirical evidence to see where they players were actually chosen. The guy had roughly a 70% accuracy in the first 6 rounds - as pointed out above. The Steelers and NE chose players in a 75-80% correlation with his per-round suggestions, we were at roughly 50% - that pretty much summarizes it.

Who cares... Goose and Brandt are clearly better and their lists paint a different story. You go with the 50th most accurate and I will go with the top 5.

 

[Doomsay]

Who cares... Goose and Brandt are clearly better and their lists paint a different story. You go with the 50th most accurate and I will go with the top 5.

I'll go with the actual data, trumps any prediction. I don't actually follow boards, don't care. Just looked at what this guy put out there in terms of predicted rounds and that comported with how the 2 best teams of the decade chose their pics. You go with your board, I'll go with the teams. He might be worthless in predicting how players will fit in/produce etc., don't care we are just talking about what round they went in. Trying to straw dog this guy beyond the original intent is a reach at best.

 

[Bach]

The outpouring of optimism for our draft is heart-rending. Makes me proud to be around such true Cowboy fans.

But the fact remains -- and whistle past the cemetery if you must -- this draft was, at best, a C. Personally, a C-.

Not their fault that Jerra sold the franchise for a wild grab at Roy Williams. Now Jerra pays for it with surrendering higher draft picks. The reality is, a bad draft this weekend. And time will prove this.

Just a dissenting view. Nothing personal, fellow inmates, i love the Cowboys but believe the team has missed a chance to beef it up for a SB run.

With this draft, and with Wade as HC, things sure look dismal for this die-hard fan.

 

[SMCowboy]

Nice try, didn't say anything of the kind, try reading the post rather than going to auto-gotcha mode. Somebody else referenced the site in relationship to suggested rounds for player signings. I looked at the suggested rounds in the site and used empirical evidence to see where they players were actually chosen. The guy had roughly a 70% accuracy in the first 6 rounds - as pointed out above. The Steelers and NE chose players in a 75-80% correlation with his per-round suggestions, we were at roughly 50% - that pretty much summarizes it.

Well, I don't know how he manages to get roughly 70% right out of the first six rounds. I checked this year against where players were chosen, and out of all 6 rounds, he managed to get only 40% right. With the following breakdown by round:
Round 1: 94%
Round 2: 69% with one UDFA
Round 3: 28% with four UDFA's
Round 4: 31% with six UDFA's
Round 5: 14% with fifteen UDFA's
Round 6: 17% with seventeen UDFA's

For the record that would be 21% of the players that he drafted in the first 6 rounds ended up being UDFA's this year......

To go one step further, I checked how many players went within 2 rounds of where WaltersFootball had them going or were UDFA's and he had selected, and I came up with only 64% right.

And for the record, to figure out if the player went in the round that WaltersFootball projected, I compared the difference in pick numbers by the number of picks in the round. So if Waltersfootball had a guy going with the 25th pick in round 4, but he was selected with the 28th pick in round 3, I counted that as going within the same round as predicted.

 

[Alexander]

William Beatty was still on the board, and if CL wants to use Goose as the end all be all in draft ranking he was a full 18 players higher than Brewster.

Brewster's ceiling is probably an ok starting Guard - Kosier Part II. Beatty could potentially replace Flo (which is something that is going to need replacing soon).

And that's besides the fact that most of us think we should have been more aggressive about trading up, not down or staying put.

Beatty also was one of those players who had questionable desire and might not have football as a priority.

And if you listen to Ciskowski's profile, he should have been eliminated. So should Duke Robinson, Michael Johnson and Jarron Gilbert, three other players I keep seeing people suggest would have been better choices.

It is one thing to simply disagree with his concept. It is another to suggest he simply become hypocritical and take players that are against his prinicples.

 

[Chief]

Beatty also was one of those players who had questionable desire and might not have football as a priority.

And if you listen to Ciskowski's profile, he should have been eliminated. So should Duke Robinson, Michael Johnson and Jarron Gilbert, three other players I keep seeing people suggest would have been better choices.

It is one thing to simply disagree with his concept. It is another to suggest he simply become hypocritical and take players that are against his prinicples.

Great post.

I didn't have any problem with Dallas passing on those guys.

There may have been a couple of reaches, but the profile of the guys they took are remarkably similar and fits Ciskowski's plan.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

You have examples or just throwing something out there?

I'd say if we had drafted 3-4 guys in the 2nd-3rd round that were 2nd -3rd round talent then most would be on board with it. Just like most were on board with the type of draft we had last year.

Funny how that works. Teams do a good job drafting and their draft gets praised and acknowledged. They do a poor job and it gets duly criticized. Go figure.

I realise this. The point is that you could pick 3-4 guys you'd have liked to have had there, that you think were worth being there, and you know, without a doubt, that there would be people who wouldn't like one of them, some of them, all of them because they're not the guys they wanted.

Want examples? Look around at all the pre-draft, draft day, and post draft threads. There are TONS of examples of some people liking this guy, others not liking him, some guys wanting these 3 players, some wanting only 1 of those 3 players.

It's not hard to figure out, or realise, that no matter who all was drafted that not everyone would be happy. We could have gotten Sidbury, Johnson, and Iglesis (i'm sure I still spell his name wrong) and there would be people here who wouldn't like all those picks.

In fact there are plenty of examples in this very thread of people who don't like the Johnson pick you suggested. It's not rocket science, bro, there is no such thing as a draft that everyone would be completely happy with.

People liked our draft last year, for the most part, but you still had people complaining about some of the picks. Quite a few were upset that we picked Bennett in round two. I suppose now that they've seen him play most people who didn't like that pick will now say they always did. None the less they still had something to complain about last year, even in a draft that everyone thought was good.

Walden is another good example of a guy people complained about in a good draft. It's easy, without even trying really, to see how no matter what there are going to be sections of fans who aren't pleased with something, or all of, the teams drafts no matter what. It's life.

 

[AdamJT13]

Nice try, didn't say anything of the kind

You claimed we had a bunch of reaches because of where guys were ranked at BAN-INCOMING-IN-3-2-1.

Is that what you said, or not?

 

[Bob Sacamano]

BAN-INCOMING-IN-3-2-1?

 

[Doomsay]

Walter Football's top-100 list finished 43rd out of the 52 top-100 lists tracked by The Huddle Report.

But hey, if you think Walter Football knows more than Rick Gosselin (who was No. 1 this year and almost every other year) or Gil Brandt (No. 2 last year, No. 18 this year), more power to you.

Come now, let's have full disclosure here - He's also right on the cusp of the top 3rd in the Huddle Report's mock draft rankings both this year and on a 3 year average (40 should tie him for 16th, but they have him as 18th - with some tie breaker, I assume). Never said that he was better than Gosselin or anybody else, that's all manufactured by you - I never looked at his site until yesterday when someone was being mocked for using it.

If you look behind the rankings (I found 2 top mock guys that had at least 3 rounds of picks - on free websites ..Abromowitz @2 and McCrystal @10) the top guys don't seem to be all that different than say a top second quartile guy in terms of placing a player in the proper round. The 2 top guys had on an average correctly placed players in rounds 51% of the time, while Watler had achieved 47%, not a meaningful difference.

Once more, Abromowitz at #2 had a similar 50% reach factor that you found so objectionable coming from Walter for our picks looking at his 7 round mock. In the end, I wonder if the collective scouting departments (the good and the bad) are better than the best mock drafter in terms of predicting actual performance. There is a high correlation between actual draft order and ultimate success in the NFL, at least at the top levels, I wonder if there have been studies of certain mock draft's value as a predictor of future performance?