Bill Parcells get a pass if...

[Trip]

DT will be addressed in the draft.

Maybe.

And its a darn shame if it is with all of the other needs we have, and considering we just signed one in free agency for a boatload of cash.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Maybe.

And its a darn shame if it is with all of the other needs we have, and considering we just signed one in free agency for a boatload of cash.

NT is a position we MIGHT look at in the near future, in the draft, DE is pretty set, and you can get solid ones on the 2nd day, 4-7th round

plus we have Thomas Johnson waiting in the wings anyways, I wouldn't worry too much

 

[wxcpo]

I agree that BP has this team on the right track, but some of you guys seem to be caught up in the fact that BP has turned this team from three consecutive 5-11 seasons to 9-6 and possibly 10-6 after this Sunday. Sure 5 more regular season wins are nice and point to a more successful season for the head coach, but when that season ends with the team staying home for the playoffs then IMO it is really no more successful than those Campo coached teams.

 

[Clove]

Maybe.

And its a darn shame if it is with all of the other needs we have, and considering we just signed one in free agency for a boatload of cash.

I think we draft one, but Ferguson will start, bank on it. However, if there is a game in which Ferguson is not getting push on the line, and a team is running at will, he may stick the new guy in there and that could spell the end of Ferguson.

 

[Maikeru-sama]

Are there any other measures of a team's progress that you would like to throw out?

Since im specifically evaluating whether a 10-6 Season without a playoff berth is a success or not..prolly...not!

- Mike G.

 

[Trip]

I agree that BP has this team on the right track, but some of you guys seem to be caught up in the fact that BP has turned this team from three consecutive 5-11 seasons to 9-6 and possibly 10-6 after this Sunday. Sure 5 more regular season wins are nice and point to a more successful season for the head coach, but when that season ends with the team staying home for the playoffs then IMO it is really no more successful than those Campo coached teams.

Exactly.

And those Campo coached teams were coming off salary cap trouble, without the flexibility to sign free agents, while the last two years we've been in great shape because of the suffering of the Campo years.

And we haven't exactly spent our free agency money wisely: Ferguson, Rivera and Dat Dude.

Those Campo years we were missing 1st round draft choices 2 consecutive seasons because we tried to hang on at the end of the Aikman/Irvin era.

And we got some nice draft choices like Roy Williams and Terence Newman because of those Campo years.

We should be a playoff team. This hasn't been any miraculous Parcells turnaround, as much as many want it to be.

He has restored structure and discipline, I'll grant that.

I'll feel a lot better in a couple of weeks when we're the playoff team making a push, that we ought to be at this point.

 

[wileedog]

Exactly.

And those Campo coached teams were coming off salary cap trouble, without the flexibility to sign free agents, while the last two years we've been in great shape because of the suffering of the Campo years.

So you're argument is that its a good thing that the Campo years sucked and we drafted so utterly horribly because now we had a couple of good draft picks for Parcells to use them right?

And we haven't exactly spent our free agency money wisely: Ferguson, Rivera and Dat Dude.

Henry was pretty good, Ferguson has been doing fine. Wiley cost us nothing to cut.

Rivera I'll give you.

Those Campo years we were missing 1st round draft choices 2 consecutive seasons because we tried to hang on at the end of the Aikman/Irvin era.

Who gives a snot when you consistently mess up the other 6 rounds?

We should be a playoff team. This hasn't been any miraculous Parcells turnaround, as much as many want it to be.

We were a FG kicker away, mostly because Cundiff got hurt in the last week of TC.

If you don't think this team is significantly better than Campo's last effort I really don't know what to say.

 

[AbeBeta]

BP stayed with an ineffective run game and you have yet to explain why he played for the fieldgoal when we were 1st and ten from the 20! He ran three straight plays down there, we were dominating this yeam the whole game.
Who called for the that god forsaken three man front on the final drive for the hawks. Check your replays and explain that please!

1st and 10 from the 20.

get it right. 1st and 10 from the 12. The 3rd down play was a pass play that was blown up by the pass rush -- Drew RAN b/c he couldn't throw. And when you are averaging over 4 yards a carry running the ball -- and taking time off the clock is a great call.

we went with a 3 man front b/c that gave us more guys in coverage. unfortunately, Pile and Glenn both picked up penalties and we had a handful of blown coverages. You can put 4 guys up there but Seattle's O-line is just going to eat them up.

 

[Trip]

So you're argument is that its a good thing that the Campo years sucked and we drafted so utterly horribly because now we had a couple of good draft picks for Parcells to use them right?

No, my argument is it's a good thing that Parcells had the luxury of inheriting a 1st round, 8th choice safety and a 1st round 5th overall choice that he could use to draft a CB and begin to build his defense around those players. Campo had no such luxury.

Henry was pretty good, Ferguson has been doing fine. Wiley cost us nothing to cut.

Rivera I'll give you.

Henry was pretty good, Ferguson hasn't been fine, and Dat Dude cost $3.5 million to cut.

Who gives a snot when you consistently mess up the other 6 rounds?

I suppose you blame that on Campo?

We were a FG kicker away, mostly because Cundiff got hurt in the last week of TC.

We weren't a FG kicker away, we were a FG kicking coach away, that we had, and Parcells let go, for no apparent reason. That decision alone could cost us a playoff spot. That was flat out ignorant.

If you don't think this team is significantly better than Campo's last effort I really don't know what to say.

Good. Then don't say anything because that's not what I said.

 

[wileedog]

No, my argument is it's a good thing that Parcells had the luxury of inheriting a 1st round, 8th choice safety and a 1st round 5th overall choice that he could use to draft a CB and begin to build his defense around those players. Campo had no such luxury.

As opposed to the draft haul that Jimmy got with the Herschel trade?

PLease, all new coaches tend to come to bad teams with decent picks.

And Campo didn't draft crap, those were all Jerry drafts.

Henry was pretty good, Ferguson hasn't been fine, and Dat Dude cost $3.5 million to cut.

We disagree on Ferguson, but nevertheless you are hardly talking about crippling mistakes.

I suppose you blame that on Campo?

Nope, purely on Jerry.

Why is this relevant?

We weren't a FG kicker away, we were a FG kicking coach away, that we had, and Parcells let go, for no apparent reason. That decision alone could cost us a playoff spot. That was flat out ignorant.

No other team in the league carries a kicking coach.

None.

If they were so critical, you'd think someone else would jump on this, no?

Good. Then don't say anything because that's not what I said.

You said Parcells hadn't turned the team around. OK, the term you used was 'miraculous', which I agree with you its not.

BUt the team is certainly looking better than it has in good long time.

Some people choose not to criticize a coach for turning a team around, even if that particular turnaround doesn't warrant attention from the Pope.

 

[Trip]

Don't compare what Parcells has done here to what Jimmy did.

The mistakes can begin to look crippling when you look at Rivera's cap number down the road, and Ferguson's. You're talking about $11-12 million tied up in two players that I'm not sure will be worth crap in a couple of years.

The point is not what other teams do, it's what we had. A guy that has proven to have success with bargain basement kickers for years. That's one spot that we haven't had to worry about much for a long time. Parcells fired him, why? Because he's an egomaniac?

I'm not criticizing a coach for turning a team around. I just believe he came into a much better situation than Campo did, that's all.

Neither of us know what state Parcells will leave the Cowboys in for the next guy, but a couple more Rivera's and Ferguson's and Wiley's in free agency and it might not look so good.

 

[wileedog]

Don't compare what Parcells has done here to what Jimmy did.

I wouldn't dream of it. Its apples and oranges as Jimmy was handed a draft smorgesboard on a plate and no worries about a salary cap or losing players to FA.

Too bad he wasted a number 1 pick in the supplemental draft on Steve Walsh. Could you imagine the peasant revolt around here if Bill did something like that?

The mistakes can begin to look crippling when you look at Rivera's cap number down the road, and Ferguson's. You're talking about $11-12 million tied up in two players that I'm not sure will be worth crap in a couple of years.

We just disagree here. Fair enough.

The point is not what other teams do, it's what we had. A guy that has proven to have success with bargain basement kickers for years. That's one spot that we haven't had to worry about much for a long time. Parcells fired him, why? Because he's an egomaniac?

All of which has absolutely positively nothing to do with Billy Cundiff getting hurt and the best kicker available being Jose Cortez. And then Cundiff coming back (after working with Hoffman) and sucking arse.

Other teams don't feel the need to coddle their kickers with their own special coach, and yet somehow they all manage to hit critical 34 yard FGs the vast majority of the time. Go figure.

I'm not criticizing a coach for turning a team around. I just believe he came into a much better situation than Campo did, that's all.

And is a better coach to boot.

Look, I like Campo, I though he was a good DC. What he inherited and how he was dealt with by Jerry vs. Bill really has no bearing at all on the accountability of Bill.

The team sucked under Campo for 3 straight years. Many of the starters on Campos 2002 team are now out of football (which Jerry is owed much of the blame for). Enough said.

[Neither of us know what state Parcells will leave the Cowboys in for the next guy, but a couple more Rivera's and Ferguson's and Wiley's in free agency and it might not look so good.

Parcell's free agent decisions don't concern me that much. He tends not to go overboard and his hit/miss ratio is pretty consistent with other coaches.

Oh, and lets not forget guys like Aaron Glenn or even Drew Bledsoe who signed at a discount just to play with Parcells again. You think they would have done that for Campo?

 

[Trip]

I really don't want to get into a Jimmy discussion with you, it's way in the past, but if you keep throwing crap like that out there, I'll have to. Jimmy's the one that traded Walker and wrought that "draft smorgesboard" as you called it.

We've never had as poor a kicking season with Hoffman around as we've had this year. Period. And it might cost us a spot in the playoffs.

Some players like to play for Parcells. I think that comes from the structure and discipline, which I gave him credit for in the first place. But some of those players that like to play for Parcells, like that crappy tackle we signed from the Jets a few years ago, and paid a lot money to, that isn't around anymore, aren't worth the trouble. What was his name again?

Some of Parcells free agency decisions don't concern you? Really?

 

[wileedog]

I really don't want to get into a Jimmy discussion with you, it's way in the past, but if you keep throwing crap like that out there, I'll have to. Jimmy's the one that traded Walker and wrought that "draft smorgesboard" as you called it.

And who did Bill inherit that he could trade for a multitude of draft picks?

Quincy Carter? Troy Hambrick?

You are the one who started the "This coach came into a better situation then that coach" argument. Don't back away from it now.

We've never had as poor a kicking season with Hoffman around as we've had this year. Period. And it might cost us a spot in the playoffs.

We've never had our starting kicker go down in the last week of training camp. Period.

Why is this so hard to understand?

Some players like to play for Parcells. I think that comes from the structure and discipline, which I gave him credit for in the first place. But some of those players that like to play for Parcells, like that crappy tackle we signed from the Jets a few years ago, and paid a lot money to, that isn't around anymore, aren't worth the trouble. What was his name again?

Some of Parcells free agency decisions don't concern you? Really?

I suggest you PM AdamJT13 and ask him about our cap situation. I suspect he will tell you its just fine and dandy.

And the OT you are talking about is Ryan Young, who got hurt. You want to blame Parcells for that too?

Rivera was a bad signing. I freely admit that. In fact the one place I have been most critical of Parcells is that I think its pretty awful that the guy wants to run a TOP, good defense based philosophy and yet in 3 years he has yet to solidify the offensive line. The draft and FA mistakes have hurt.

BUt when I look at guys like Glenn and Bledsoe and Henry and Richie Anderson and the fact the Parcells generally doesn't chase big money signings just to chase them then no, I'm not particularly uncomfortable with his FA decisions.

If he finally fixes the O-line, we have a serious contender on our hands.

Even without the oh so critical kicking coach.

 

[Trip]

If he finally fixes the O-line? Okay. Two 2nd round picks, a 3rd and multiple bad free agent signings, and a 7th rounder starting that looks lost sometimes... I'm not holding my breath.

Injuries, injuries, injuries. Parcells has to be the unluckiest coach on the planet.

You can mock my opinion of Hoffman if you want. I just think you're running out of excuses for that dumb decision.

I know pretty much exactly where we are with our cap situation (at least I think I do), but I'd be glad to exchange numbers with anyone who wants to.

I've got us with about $13 million to sign free agents, after estimations for bonuses/LTBE, draft picks and EFA/RFA's.

Jimmy inherited Herchel and that's it. You got me.

 

[wileedog]

If he finally fixes the O-line? Okay. Two 2nd round picks, a 3rd and multiple bad free agent signings, and a 7th rounder starting that looks lost sometimes... I'm not holding my breath.

Good for you. Lets lynch the guy who has improved nearly every other facet of the team because he missed on some OL decisions.

You can mock my opinion of Hoffman if you want. I just think you're running out of excuses for that dumb decision.

LMAO! I never knew why we retained a kicking coach in the first place.

I know pretty much exactly where we are with our cap situation (at least I think I do), but I'd be glad to exchange numbers with anyone who wants to.

I've got us with about $13 million to sign free agents, after estimations for bonuses/LTBE, draft picks and EFA/RFA's.

That looks like a heck of a lot of room to me to do whatever we want. How have Bill's decisions really hurt us?

Jimmy inherited Herchel and that's it. You got me.

No, its more than that.

That trade would not even be possible now with the salary cap in place. There is no way any GM not named Matt Millen would even consider doing the Herschel trade in this current system. And even he probably couldn't do it.

You want to ride Parcells because he had a #5 overall pick when he started yet happily give Jimmy a pass for that trade plus having a #1 overall pick when he started, and the freedom from Jerry to use it on a QB.

There are some who would term that as complete and total hypocrisy.

 

[Trip]

Explain to me how that trade would not even be possible with the salary cap in place.

Please.

You should read what I say, and not go off half-cocked while your LYAO.

Did I say our cap situation was bad, now?

Of course the outlook is not as bright as it once was.

Did I compare Parcells situation with Jimmy's, or Campo's?

 

[wileedog]

Explain to me how that trade would not even be possible with the salary cap in place.

Because the cap hit for trading Walker would have been huge, and because with the cap no team in their right mind trades that many picks for ANYBODY.

Mike Ditka aside, but I think we can agree that was lunacy.

You should read what I say, and not go off half-cocked while your LYAO.

I'm reading what you say.

You are blaming everything on not having a kicking coach, which no other team in the entire league feels is even necessary.

Maybe you should be reading what you write?

Did I compare Parcells situation with Jimmy's, or Campo's?

You can't pick and choose just because Campo came into a worse situation. Nor can you just disqualify Jimmy's situation because you happen to like him better.

If Parcells walked into Dallas with a #1 overall pick that he could spend on a Troy Aikman and an aging RB he could trade for a bushel of other picks, we would probably be no question SB favorites right now. I don't even see how that is arguable.

 

[Trip]

You said the trade wouldn't have even been possible, and you're wrong. How do you know what the cap hit would've been? How do you know how much his signing bonus would've been if a cap were in place, which it wasn't. You do know you only take the hit on the bonus money, right? Walker wasn't in the league that long, and would've likely still had his ROOKIE, 5th round draft choice contract. The cap hit wouldn't have been bad at all. That statement was comparable to firing a good kicking coach.

I'm not blaming everything on not having a kicking coach. Just our poor kicking situation, that's all. And missing the playoffs this year if we do.

And Jimmy came into a horrible situation, since you keep throwing it out there.

 

[wileedog]

You said the trade wouldn't have even been possible, and you're wrong. How do you know what the cap hit would've been? How do you know how much his signing bonus would've been if a cap were in place, which it wasn't. You do know you only take the hit on the bonus money, right? Walker wasn't in the league that long, and would've likely still had his ROOKIE, 5th round draft choice contract. The cap hit wouldn't have been bad at all. That statement was comparable to firing a good kicking coach.

Walker cap number speculation aside, who besides Crazy Ditka has traded that many draft picks for anybody since the cap has been put in place? WHose come even close?

Anyone?

I'm not blaming everything on not having a kicking coach. Just our poor kicking situation, that's all. And missing the playoff this year if we do.

Cundiff. Got. Hurt.

Deal with it.

And Jimmy came into a horrible situation, since you keep throwing it out there.

Um, yeah.

Not much point in continuing this. I don't want to belittle what Jimmy did accomplish just to prove to you that he had a lot of ammo to do it.

I hope all your kicking coach dreams come true in the future.